dalsingh101 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Dal how did you find this out? Its published by IOSS which is not known as close to the SGPC.The translator and people in the IOSS told me via email. They were lacking funds for publishing the 2nd volume and their attempts to get funding from abroad was unsuccessful (they asked me but you know how the situation is here for some of us in these austere times.....tight!). So they gave it to the SGPC. They were clearly frustrated by the delay. SGPC was sitting on it for years. The 2nd volume was completed about the same time as the 1st, but we had to wait a good few years for it to come out in printed form. I think IOSS got fed up in the end and released it as a PDF first on their site. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Did you ask them what the cost is for one translation of a decent sized Granth? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Did you ask them what the cost is for one translation of a decent sized Granth?If memory serves me right they mentioned a figure between £1000 - £2000 (?) which also (understandably) included renumeration to the translator who'd spent a few years on the project. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Thats a small amount for our community in comparison to its immense value. If we only did not direct our resources towards useless things like protesting against Modi, building luxurious Gurdwaras when there already are in the area or rebuilding mosques in Punjab... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Another fact is that the manuscripts either say 1701 or 1741. Trying to find a date near 1708 would defy all existing proofs just for the sake of obtaining a 'contempnary source'. Gal khatm.with all due respect to your scholarly endeavours for me (and i would say others here) it never really started. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Thats a small amount for our community in comparison to its immense value. If we only did not direct our resources towards useless things like protesting against Modi, building luxurious Gurdwaras when there already are in the area or rebuilding mosques in Punjab...not to mention the crores they spent on Khalsa Virasat at Sri Anandpur Sahib. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 The translator and people in the IOSS told me via email. They were lacking funds for publishing the 2nd volume and their attempts to get funding from abroad was unsuccessful (they asked me but you know how the situation is here for some of us in these austere times.....tight!). So they gave it to the SGPC. They were clearly frustrated by the delay. SGPC was sitting on it for years. The 2nd volume was completed about the same time as the 1st, but we had to wait a good few years for it to come out in printed form. I think IOSS got fed up in the end and released it as a PDF first on their site. Good to see that someone is in touch with the Indian scholars. I know what you mean about austerities and all that. Just a shame that Gurdwaras like my local one can give £1500 to a cricket club that has no links/connection with it to get the presidents face in the local paper, but when it comes to real investment for the Panth, they are not so forthcoming. If any issue like this comes to your attention again Dal bring it to the forum and lets see if we can do something here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 We can still do something now Chatanga. They're up for translating. Need funds as I posted earlier in this topic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 with all due respect to your scholarly endeavours for me (and i would say others here) it never really started.Says the one who quotes half lines from here and there, and doesn't know basic words like chaant is out to defend illiterate babeh.Anyways, ah chak, whats so hard about contacting these scholars? You don't need an UFO or Brahmgyanta. Are you up for donating? Lets get started then.http://sikhinstitute.org/res.htmINSTITUTE OF SIKH STUDIESGurdwara Sri Guru Singh Sabha, KanthalaOpp Tribune Chowk, Indl. Area Phase IIChandigarh - 160 002 (India)Phone 91 172 2642580; Fax-cum-Phone 2642581E-mail : iosschd@gmail.com or ioss@satyam.net.inWebsite : www.sikhinstitute.org 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Have a look at this: http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/14208-sri-gur-sobha-by-dr-ganda-singh/#comment-131935We all first started discussing this 5 years ago! lol!! Edited June 15, 2015 by dalsingh101 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Perhaps you forgot to add the link? Edited June 14, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 You know I had a quick flick through the translation last night and one thing that struck me was how Sainapati moves across space in his narrative, he goes from the inauguration of the Khalsa in Anandpur to the impact of the new rehat (in quite fine detail) with the Delhi sangat.I don't think he is likely to have been darting between Delhi and Panjab so it implies that he relied on other sources for some of his information. So we have to question how much of his account is based on what he personally witnessed and how much on what he subsequently learned from other sources. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) *** Edited June 18, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) **** Edited June 15, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) **** Edited June 18, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) *** Edited June 18, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 ਕੁਛੁ ਸੁਨੀ ਕੁਛੁ ਉਕਤ ਕਰ ਬਰਨਤ ਹੋਂ ਅਬ ਹੋਇ।ਕਰਨਹਾਰ ਕਰਤਾ ਧਨੀ ਜੋ ਕੁਛੁ ਕਰੈ ਸੁ ਹੋਇ। 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 Thats the one I am talking about, especially the first line. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 I used some of what I heard and some of what was previously mentioned 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) Lets accept that translation for a while, what do you make of it ?'Previously mentioned' in the text, in previous books or what could he imply (according to the translation). Edited June 15, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 I think he may be saying he used information he directly heard himself, and secondary information (i.e. written sources like Bachitar Natak and obviously people who had heard what was going on at places he wasn't like Delhi). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 (edited) The line comes in the chapter of Anandpur war. The fact that he wrote the line here is very important.Lets assume he started writing it chronologically as time passed and as some have claimed, then it means 'hearsay' part was about Anandpur and not the latter (otherwise it would have been used in later parts, the parts about Delhi). Now the question arises why a 'darbari kavi' need secondary sources and hearsay about the times he supposedly lived there ? Couldn't he simply ask the Singhs with whom he lived or the Guru? Lets think logically.How would you translate it if:ਕੁਛੁ ਸੁਨੀ; ਕੁਛੁ ਉਕਤ ਕਰ; ਬਰਨਤ ਹੋਂ ਅਬ ਹੋਇ। Edited June 15, 2015 by SikhKhoj 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhKhoj Posted June 15, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 And this time I want you to look at other possible meanings of ookat:ਬਿਆਨ ਕਰਨ ਦੀ ਸ਼ਕਤੀ, ਦਲੀਲ, ਯੁਕਤੀ, ਦਲੀਲ-ਬਾਜ਼ੀ, ਜੁਗਤਿ, ਢੰਗ, ਤਰੀਕਾ, ਵਿਓਂਤ ਬੁੱਧੀ। ਉਦਾਹਰਣ: ਅਪਨੀ ਉਕਤਿ ਖਲਾਵੈ ਭੋਜਨ ਅਪਨੀ ਉਕਤਿ ਖੇਲਾਵੈ॥ {ਧੰਨਾ ੫, ੩੯, ੧:੧ (680)}। ਸਗਲ ਉਕਤਿ ਉਪਾਵਾ॥ {ਸਿਰੀ ੫, ਅਸ ੨੭, ੮:੧ (71)}। 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 Going bed. Will look at later. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted June 16, 2015 Report Share Posted June 16, 2015 Lets play a small game Dal, since you love Punjabi so much. Let's not play games, let's talk to each other like adults instead. Anyway, what are trying to get at? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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