THE FLAME IS STILL ALIVE Posted October 6, 2003 Report Share Posted October 6, 2003 Waheguru ji ka khalsa - waheguru ji ki fateh the khalsa belongs to god - all victory belongs to god have we forgotten about 1984. well get up and rmmember. have we forgotten about the people who died in the 1984 november dehli riots well remember khalistan isnt going to be made by us sitting here so lets do somthing about it gotta go but remember khalistan zindabad raj kere ga khalsa THE FLAME IS STILL ALIVE 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugermach Singh Posted October 6, 2003 Report Share Posted October 6, 2003 lets do somthing about it gotta go lol, is that you doing something... lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 6, 2003 Report Share Posted October 6, 2003 We say in the Ardas that the Panth has been distanced from Nankana Sahib and other Gurughar, even though people do visit Pakistan and those Gurughar, even though the Guru can never be distanced from the Sikhs, yet we say we want Khalistan. What about the main Gurudwaras around India? Sis Ganj, Bangla Sahib and so on? When we get 'Khalistan', will we start including those in the Ardas also? :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjj Posted October 6, 2003 Report Share Posted October 6, 2003 Golden Temple Atrocity was already predicted by Gur Sahib??? or in some scripture and that the blood will come up to your ankles... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostsingh Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Golden Temple Atrocity was already predicted by Gur Sahib??? or in some scripture and that the blood will come up to your ankles... I heard the samething, I even heard that next time the blood will come upto your knees. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardu Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Waheguru ji ka khalsa - waheguru ji ki fateh the khalsa belongs to god - all victory belongs to god have we forgotten about 1984. well get up and rmmember. have we forgotten about the people who died in the 1984 november dehli riots well remember khalistan isnt going to be made by us sitting here so lets do somthing about it gotta go but remember khalistan zindabad raj kere ga khalsa THE FLAME IS STILL ALIVE Chodo kal ki baatein, Kal ki baat purani naye Daur mein likhenge, Mil ker nayi kahani If u want to remember 84's saheeds... First remember Bhagat Singh, Lala Lajpet Roy, Chadershekher Azad, subhash chader bose, Sukhdev, Raj guru, khudi ram bose, Ashfaqulla Khan and 100s of other freedom fighters. to whome we owe much much more!!!! Huh!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjj Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 I heard the samething, I even heard that next time the blood will come upto your knees. and when is that going to happen? when will Khalsa be 960 million 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Chodo kal ki baatein, Kal ki baat purani naye Daur mein likhenge, Mil ker nayi kahani Those who forget the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them. If u want to remember 84's saheeds... First remember Bhagat Singh, Lala Lajpet Roy, Chadershekher Azad, subhash chader bose, Sukhdev, Raj guru, khudi ram bose, Ashfaqulla Khan and 100s of other freedom fighters. to whome we owe much much more!!!! Huh!!! Lala Lajpat Rai - died of a heart attack due to getting a beating from police lathis. Now known as 'Sher-e-Punjab' by the Hindus Bhagat Singh - shot the wrong police officer in revenge for the 'martyrdom' of Lala Lajpat Rai Subhash Chander Bose - a lackey of the Japanese and Germans. Willing to trade British rule of Japanese rule. Emulated the Fascist 'Our leader' by being referred to as 'Netaji' Sukhdev and Rajguru - co-conspirators of Bhagat Singh. Some dispute over who actually fired the shot that killed the British police officer and a Sikh constable. You may think you owe them something but I owe more to the 1984 Shaheeds and Sant Bhindranwale than I owe to those misfits listed above. GurFateh Bikramjit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Those who forget the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them. Lala Lajpat Rai - died of a heart attack due to getting a beating from police lathis. Now known as 'Sher-e-Punjab' by the Hindus Bhagat Singh - shot the wrong police officer in revenge for the 'martyrdom' of Lala Lajpat Rai Subhash Chander Bose - a lackey of the Japanese and Germans. Willing to trade British rule of Japanese rule. Emulated the Fascist 'Our leader' by being referred to as 'Netaji' Sukhdev and Rajguru - co-conspirators of Bhagat Singh. Some dispute over who actually fired the shot that killed the British police officer and a Sikh constable. You may think you owe them something but I owe more to the 1984 Shaheeds and Sant Bhindranwale than I owe to those misfits listed above. GurFateh Bikramjit If someone askz me a question... How Sant B was anywayz different from Osama Bin Laden? Both of them brought misery to their own people ? As a Layman What should I reply to him ? Can somebody put some light on this question ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardu Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 Those who forget the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them. Lala Lajpat Rai - died of a heart attack due to getting a beating from police lathis. Now known as 'Sher-e-Punjab' by the Hindus He was hit on the head.... and was not taken to the hospital dispite of bleeding. His age was more than 55 that time. He was not prepared .. he was without any weapon.. You can't imagine his struggle.. and will power. Try this. Ask ur friend to hit a (police) laathi with full power on ur head.. proabably u will realize the pain and the emotions. Bhagat Singh - shot the wrong police officer in revenge for the 'martyrdom' of Lala Lajpat Rai he shot a firangi nevertheless. and Killing was not his Theme or way. His vision and feeling of pariotism are still the motivation of many youths. I feel proud to be born in the counrty where Bhagat Singh belongs to. Subhash Chander Bose - a lackey of the Japanese and Germans. Willing to trade British rule of Japanese rule. Emulated the Fascist 'Our leader' by being referred to as 'Netaji' One man Army. He single handedly Manage to build an army who was all set to vanish the englishmen from the country. Just a lack of bit of luck.. had there were no Nuclear bombing.. He might have proved that he was a True Leader. Sukhdev and Rajguru - co-conspirators of Bhagat Singh. Some dispute over who actually fired the shot that killed the British police officer and a Sikh constable. lol!!! none of your faults. But tell u its no way less heroic .. to kiss and accept the "Fassi ka Fanda" in the age of less then 30. you may think you owe them something yeah..I owe.. The whole country owe. You also owe... YOu can't just think/imagine the values of those great deeds.. Ask ur parents/grand parents.. What does it mean to be a slave of another nation. more to the 1984 Shaheeds and Sant Bhindranwale than I owe to those misfits listed above. GurFateh Bikramjit lol!!! Can anybody believe on this. One who can not respect the sacrificesof the martyrs of the nation, who didn't care about the religion, creed, caste etc before giving his life. One who didn't value the sacrifice of the persons who made the life for his (grand)parents better. What is the guarantee that tomorrow he won't forget the saheeds of 1984??? Mate, its always easy to disgrace the sacrifices. Today u disgraces the freedom fighter of India.. tomorrow somebody will come with the arguments to disgrace the fighters of khalistan. Its an easy job.. not a big deal. But this can't be justified? When u disgrace a martyr, u have disgraced all martyrs.. because u have insulted the feeling of sacrifice. Let me repeat, u can't change the past... If u are related to India, (or pakistan) U owe to the above mentioned martyrs and more.. u accept it or not!! Thanks n.. Regards Sardu! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malwadoabamajha Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 theres one part of this british indian history i dont understand, cany any1 please help clear this up. on the one hand we are told during british times the sikhs aligned themselves with the british and fought and gave sacrifices to the british raj in the world wars, on the other sikhs were fighting against the british rule. look at the dates of the second world war and the date of indian independance not far apart. or were there two sets of sikhs one loyal to british one against. i have even heard some sikhs say they were better off under british rule than indian rule, while others say the british treated all asians like animals. if that was the case i have another question how many indians were there? how many british soldiers were there? how cud the british maintain control over indians for 190 years as subject second class citizens unless a large chunk of indians agreed to this and worked actively with it to help theminute number of british soldiers? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 7, 2003 Report Share Posted October 7, 2003 He was hit on the head.... and was not taken to the hospital dispite of bleeding. His age was more than 55 that time. He was not prepared .. he was without any weapon.. You can't imagine his struggle.. and will power. Try this. Ask ur friend to hit a (police) laathi with full power on ur head.. proabably u will realize the pain and the emotions. Nice try. Lala Lajpat Rai was an anti-Sikh Arya Samaji. Since you seem to have been brought up to believe the 'official' history then obviously you will believe all the bukwas about him being such a heroic martyr. Read Kapur Singh's Sachi Sakhi if you want the facts and not fairy stories. he shot a firangi nevertheless. and Killing was not his Theme or way. His vision and feeling of pariotism are still the motivation of many youths. I feel proud to be born in the counrty where Bhagat Singh belongs to. So it's o.k. to kill a police officer just because he was British ?. How about the Sikh constable who had nothing to do with the lathi charge ?. Was it o.k. to kill him ?. He wasn't a farangee ? One man Army. He single handedly Manage to build an army who was all set to vanish the englishmen from the country. Just a lack of bit of luck.. had there were no Nuclear bombing.. He might have proved that he was a True Leader. More bukwas. The guy would have been a quisling for the Japanese. The Indian National Army was built up by Mohan Singh. He realised that the Japs were using him and they would try and rule India like the british so he stopped helping the Japs and was arrested. A 'true leader' like Bose either didn't realise that he was a pawn for the japs or he didn't care and probably would have been happy for some sort of governorship under the Japs. So you think that it was due to bad luck and the Atom Bomb that the INA wasn't able to free India. You're more gullible than I thought. yeah..I owe.. The whole country owe. You also owe... YOu can't just think/imagine the values of those great deeds.. Ask ur parents/grand parents.. What does it mean to be a slave of another nation. None of my family, grandfathers and grandmothers include owe anything to these people. If anything these Bhagat Singh's are to blame because they naively believed that India could be a country that would treat minorities as equals. Their actions promoted the belief amongst the Sikhs, so the Sikhs allowed themselves to be fooled by the Gandhis and Nehrus and hence we had 1984 lol!!! Can anybody believe on this. One who can not respect the sacrificesof the martyrs of the nation, who didn't care about the religion, creed, caste etc before giving his life. One who didn't value the sacrifice of the persons who made the life for his (grand)parents better. What is the guarantee that tomorrow he won't forget the saheeds of 1984??? Mate, its always easy to disgrace the sacrifices. Today u disgraces the freedom fighter of India.. tomorrow somebody will come with the arguments to disgrace the fighters of khalistan. Its an easy job.. not a big deal. But this can't be justified? When u disgrace a martyr, u have disgraced all martyrs.. because u have insulted the feeling of sacrifice. Let me repeat, u can't change the past... If u are related to India, (or pakistan) U owe to the above mentioned martyrs and more.. u accept it or not!! Only someone with a slavish mentality would consider that he owes these people anything. There's no need to worry, I won't ever forget the TRUE Martyrs of 1984, I respect their memory enough not allow their names of be mentioned in the same breath as coronary patients like Lajpat Rai. GurFateh Bikramjit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardu Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 theres one part of this british indian history i dont understand, cany any1 please help clear this up. on the one hand we are told during british times the sikhs aligned themselves with the british and fought and gave sacrifices to the british raj in the world wars, on the other sikhs were fighting against the british rule. look at the dates of the second world war and the date of indian independance not far apart. or were there two sets of sikhs one loyal to british one against. i have even heard some sikhs say they were better off under british rule than indian rule, while others say the british treated all asians like animals. if that was the case i have another question how many indians were there? how many british soldiers were there? how cud the british maintain control over indians for 190 years as subject second class citizens unless a large chunk of indians agreed to this and worked actively with it to help theminute number of british soldiers? Due to lack of time .. I will write one line in response.. it was majorly due to "Phoot Dalo Raaj Kero" technique of british which has always worked in this subcontinent.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sardu Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Nice try. Lala Lajpat Rai was an anti-Sikh Arya Samaji. Since you seem to have been brought up to believe the 'official' history then obviously you will believe all the bukwas about him being such a heroic martyr. Read Kapur Singh's Sachi Sakhi if you want the facts and not fairy stories. No veere.. I m not interested in reading anything which introduces "Hate". I have not learned or being told about lala ji's being anti-sikh or whatever.... and i m not concerned about that part here. The fact is that he gave his life for the nation i am living now.. and its enough for me to feel good about him. Its good i have been taught in that way.. atleast I don't have "Built-in" Hate for any religion in my heart. Thanks! So it's o.k. to kill a police officer just because he was British ?. How about the Sikh constable who had nothing to do with the lathi charge ?. Was it o.k. to kill him ?. He wasn't a farangee ? yeah.. it was more than okay to kill a poilce officer if he is part of system which were "ruling" on my nation. it goes for any person inspite of caste, creed, and religion. This nation has been hurt more by "Gadaars" then "Outsiders". More bukwas. The guy would have been a quisling for the Japanese. The Indian National Army was built up by Mohan Singh. He realised that the Japs were using him and they would try and rule India like the british so he stopped helping the Japs and was arrested. A 'true leader' like Bose either didn't realise that he was a pawn for the japs or he didn't care and probably would have been happy for some sort of governorship under the Japs. I realized today that Too much knowledge/information is also not good. I won't comment on this.. since it urs or any bodies assumtion without any proof... I can only smile on this.. . Though, It was a simple war politics that japs favoured India. but anyway... simple things are for fools like me.. I am happy. So you think that it was due to bad luck and the Atom Bomb that the INA wasn't able to free India. You're more gullible than I thought. I just can wish that you could have understood what i meant. No more explantions to you. you are actually "Too " wise than i thought. None of my family, grandfathers and grandmothers include owe anything to these people. If anything these Bhagat Singh's are to blame because they naively believed that India could be a country that would treat minorities as equals. Their actions promoted the belief amongst the Sikhs, so the Sikhs allowed themselves to be fooled by the Gandhis and Nehrus and hence we had 1984 I didn't request to inquire about owe part.. just ask them what it meant to be a slave of another nation.. what they feel about pre-independent era. Only someone with a slavish mentality would consider that he owes these people anything. There's no need to worry, I won't ever forget the TRUE Martyrs of 1984, I respect their memory enough not allow their names of be mentioned in the same breath as coronary patients like Lajpat Rai. Once again.. too much Wisdom. owe means a feeling of gratitute, respect and love. Now do u owe to ur parents, grandparents, friends, teachers? no please don't. otherwise u may feel like slave of them. huh!!! If u have disgraced a martyr, u can't truly respect others... its just like that 84 is fresh in ur mind.. and atmosphere around u is keeping it fresh.. If possible mate, Please come to 2003. I am here to welcome you. With Regards Sardu! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Its good i have been taught in that way.. atleast I don't have "Built-in" Hate for any religion in my heart. Thanks! I realized today that Too much knowledge/information is also not good. owe means a feeling of gratitute, respect and love. Now do u owe to ur parents, grandparents, friends, teachers? no please don't. otherwise u may feel like slave of them. huh!!! :hearme: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Its good i have been taught in that way.. atleast I don't have "Built-in" Hate for any religion in my heart. Thanks! I realized today that Too much knowledge/information is also not good. owe means a feeling of gratitute, respect and love. Now do u owe to ur parents, grandparents, friends, teachers? no please don't. otherwise u may feel like slave of them. huh!!! :hearme: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr §ingh Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 and when is that going to happen? when will Khalsa be 960 million Ooh C'mon Sikhism is only 500 yrs old...the most scientific religion u know loads of people with science degrees are converting to SIkhism (Such as Mission_impossible in this forum).. Sikhism is one of the or not THE youngest/newest religion, so give it another 500 yrs and it'll be Much more than 960 Million 8) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 Ooh C'mon Sikhism is only 500 yrs old...the most scientific religion u know loads of people with science degrees are converting to SIkhism (Such as Mission_impossible in this forum).. Sikhism is one of the or not THE youngest/newest religion, so give it another 500 yrs and it'll be Much more than 960 Million 8) Well "19" Million in first 500 yrz and "960" Million in next 500 yrz... :?: Oopz ! I am really very poor in Mathz... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsb Posted October 8, 2003 Report Share Posted October 8, 2003 yes ideal.......because every religion grown in a linear fashion... :shock: :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr §ingh Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 yep just like in the mid 1500th almost 100% of the Europeans were believing Christians, now only approx 20 % linear fashion... ??? Not really... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 yep just like in the mid 1500th almost 100% of the Europeans were believing Christians, now only approx 20 % linear fashion... ??? Not really... I had recently read somewhere that Sikhizm is the fastest growing faith in USA. Can anybody has some detailz... ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 Well "19" Million in first 500 yrz and "960" Million in next 500 yrz... :?: Oopz ! I am really very poor in Mathz... I think your stats are wrong. There's probably over 23 Million Sikhs now. Considering that in the 1720's it was estimated that there were only 11,000 Sikhs from Kabul to Bengal, and the Mughals twice proclaimed to have wiped the Sikhs out, going from 11,000 to 23 Million in about 300 odd years is no mean feat. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ideal Singh Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 I think your stats are wrong. There's probably over 23 Million Sikhs now. Considering that in the 1720's it was estimated that there were only 11,000 Sikhs from Kabul to Bengal, and the Mughals twice proclaimed to have wiped the Sikhs out, going from 11,000 to 23 Million in about 300 odd years is no mean feat. Thanx for correcting me... 19 million figure is in Indian Sikhz : Here is the full calssification of Sikh spread all over Globe and Growing : Large National Sikh Communities Nation___________________Number India____________________19,000,000 United Kingdom______________500,000 Canada____________________225,000 USA_______________________100,000 Malaysia____________________50,000 Singapore___________________20,000 Places With the Highest Percentage of Sikhs in the Population Place..........................................Percent.................Number Punjab, India...................................61.00%................11,000,000 Haryana, India...................................5.81.......................956,836 British Columbia, Canada.....................2.3........................100,000 French Guiana........................................2...........................1,200 Rajasthan, India.................................1.48.......................649,174 Himachal Pradesh, India......................1.01.......................400,000 United Kingdom.....................................1.........................500,000 Alberta, Canada.................................0.54.........................13,600 Ontario, Canada..................................0.5..........................50,100 Fiji......................................................0.5...........................4,000 Uttar Pradesh, India............................0.49.......................675,775 Manitoba, Canada...............................0.32..........................3,500 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjj Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 Bahai is already 6 million and it is only 100 year old so when is the second Golden Temple atrocity gonna happen, wher is it predicted? I guess we are going to be the next shaheeds ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BikramjitSingh Posted October 9, 2003 Report Share Posted October 9, 2003 Thanx for correcting me... 19 million figure is in Indian Sikhz : Here is the full calssification of Sikh spread all over Globe and Growing : These stats are out of date. Punjab has 12,767,000 Sikhs in 1991. Census of 2001 will probably show a little under 16 Million Sikhs in Punjab. Himachal Pradesh figures are inflated, there were about 53,000 Sikhs there in 1991. For anyone interested in Sikh demograpics there was an interesting discussion on the subject last year on the following link http://www.sikh-history.com/cgi-bin/Ultima...t=000751#000000 GurFateh Bikramjit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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