amardeep

Did Guru Nanak become a muslim after reciting the Shahada, or was he also a muslim before the incident at Bagdad?

regarding the ishmailey muslims that regard Guru Nanak as a hujjat. do they consider him to be a muslim, or is he the non-muslim hujja?

Guru Nanak lived: 1469 – 1539 at this time there were actually not that many shias in Iraq(according to my shia friend). even in Iran there were not that many shias at the time. there were a few local sangats at varoius places, but they were not a majority. in 1501 the Safawi-alliance Tabriz took over Iran and made it shia kingdom which was only 38 years before the death of Guru Nanak. but still, the majority of Iran were sunnis. Guru Nanaks visit to Iraq must have been around 1519-1521 which is only 19 years after the Safawi-alliance got their rule of persia. Did they manage to convert the population to shiism in only 19 years before Guru Nanak came? in 1535, 4 years before the death of Maharaj, the Ottoman empire took over Iran and the kingdom was again handed over to the sunnis. so if the majority of the population at that time were sunnis, and the janam sakhis do not mention anything about the muslims being enraged due to Guru Nanak mentioning Imam Ali in the Azaan, then how do you know if it was the Shia Azaan he recited? you also mentioned(in a earlier debate) that The Gurus were above sharia level, so why would Guru Nanak participate in Namaz and Hajj as these are concepts of sharia. Did Guru Nanak adhere to sharia or? and if the Gurus were muslims, and all the sikhs were following the sunnah of Prophet Muhammad, then why did the Gurus not have any arab or muslim names? and is there any sources that mention that the Gurus told hindues to declare the Shahada before they became followers of the Gurus? regarding Mecca which only muslims can visit. Is there really any place in this world that the Gurus could not visit, if they wished to? If Guru Gobind Singh Maharja wanted to visit Rome, a lion would'n even be able to stop him from going there, so how could a few muslim guards? The Face of God is not restricted by anyone.

the 3HO are there, and they are doing great,

javanmard? tsingh? anyone

interesting

stupid sikhs

but at the same time i have wondered why Guru Nanak said "sahas atharan kahan kateba" as the Quran does not say there are 18.000 worlds..this is only to be found in the hadith collections, which are not a part of the Quran..

the majority of todays shia scholars agree that there has been no tahreef- alterration of the Quran, but i do not know what the scholars of the 10th century said. personally i do not think there would be a problem with men collecting the quran 20 years after the death of the Prophet.. If all versions of Japji sahib were to dissapear, i think i would be able to sit down with a friend and rewrite all of it by memory, so why would a handfull of sahaba not be able to do the same with the Quran if they had memorized it. view on the issue of tahreef from modern scholars: Shaykh Saduq (ra) said "Our belief is that the Qur'an which Allah revealed to His Prophet Muhammad is (the same as) the one between the two covers (daffatayn). And it is the one which is in the hands of the people, and is not greater in extent than that. The number of Surah's as generally accepted is one hundred and fourteen ...And he who asserts that we say that it is greater in extent than that, is a liar." sources 1. Etikadat Shaykh Saduq 93, Published Iran) 2. Awail-el-Mukalat, Page 55-56, Published Najaf 3. Shi'ite Creed (al-I'tiqadat al-Imamiyyah), by Shaykh Saduq, English version, p77 Allamah Muhammad Ridha Mudhaffar said "We believe that the Holy Qur'an is revealed by Allah through the Holy Prophet of Islam dealing with every thing which is necessary for the guidance of mankind. It is an everlasting miracle of the Holy Prophet the like of which cannot be produced by human mind. It excels in its eloquence, clarity, truth and knowledge. This Divine Book has not been tampered with by any one. This Holy Book which we recite today is the same Holy Qur'an which was revealed to the Holy Prophet. Any one who claims it to be otherwise is an evil-doer, a mere sophist, or else he is sadly mistaken. All of those who have this line of thinking have gone astray as Allah in Qur'an said: "Falsehood can not reach the Qur'an from any direction (41:42)" source 1. The Beliefs of Shi'ite School, by Muhammad Ridha Mudhaffar, English version, p50-51 Shaykh Abu Ja'far Musawi said "The main reason behind the compiling of this book is to teach us about the meanings of the words contained in the Qur'an. As far as the question of there being any addition or deletion in the Qur'an, there is no need to debate on this matter as everyone agrees there has been no change made to it the comments of Sayyid Murtaza Alam ul-Huda have been discussed and proved. I have seen many commentaries in the books of Shi'a and Ahl'ul Sunnah suggesting that the Qur'an is incomplete or that a verse has been transferred from its original place to another but these are secluded cases and cannot relied upon. It is best to abandon such texts and let them become extinct?.we are sure of Qur'an being true. The Ummah has never objected or rejected Qur'an. " source 1. Al Batiyan Fil Tafseer-ul-Qur'an, 1st Edition, Page 3, Published Najaf Sayyid Murtaza Alam ul-Huda said "We have a firm belief that the Qur'an is complete in the same way that we believe in the existence of Kufa, Basra or any other city, or the great events that occurred through history. The reason for this firm belief is (firstly) due to the deep affections Muslims have towards the Qur'an and other reason which keep this book, of Almighty Allah, safe from any alteration. Also the Qur'an is (a sign of) the miracle of Prophet Muhammad's Apostleship. It is the source and foundation via which we locate our religious edicts and regulations. It is for this reason that Muslim scholars throughout history have taken great care in its compilation to the extent that if they were unsure about the minutest of matters, they would to examine it (the Qur'an) rigorously. Our belief about the compilation being the exact copy (as the original) is as strong as our belief that the Qur'an is the Book of Allah Allah. The present Qur'an is exactly the same Qur'an that was compiled during the life of Prophet Muhammad (S)." sources 1. Tafseer Majma-ul-Bayan, Edition 1 Page 15, Published Iran

The Quran itself says that God will protect it from any corruption, so i do not see how it can be otherwise. maybe Javanmard can tell more on this

its difficult to hear what He is saying. He talks about the Quran today, not being the real authentic quran right? and something about letters written in Mecca and medina and then something about satan.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fateh i was wondering what this shabad is reffering to: ਕਾਇਆ ਕਪੜੁ ਟੁਕੁ ਟੁਕੁ ਹੋਸੀ ਹਿਦੁਸਤਾਨੁ ਸਮਾਲਸੀ ਬੋਲਾ ॥ काइआ कपड़ु टुकु टुकु होसी हिदुसतानु समालसी बोला ॥ Kā­i­ā kapaṛ tuk tuk hosī hinḏusaṯān samālsī bolā. The body-fabric will be torn apart into shreds, and then India will remember these words. ਆਵਨਿ ਅਠਤਰੈ ਜਾਨਿ ਸਤਾਨਵੈ ਹੋਰੁ ਭੀ ਉਠਸੀ ਮਰਦ ਕਾ ਚੇਲਾ ॥ आवनि अठतरै जानि सतानवै होरु भी उठसी मरद का चेला ॥ Āvan aṯẖ­ṯarai jān saṯānvai hor bẖī uṯẖsī maraḏ kā cẖėlā. Coming in seventy-eight (1521 A.D.), they will depart in ninety-seven (1540 A.D.), and then another disciple of man will rise up. ਸਚ ਕੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਆਖੈ ਸਚੁ ਸੁਣਾਇਸੀ ਸਚ ਕੀ ਬੇਲਾ ॥੨॥੩॥੫॥ सच की बाणी नानकु आखै सचु सुणाइसी सच की बेला ॥२॥३॥५॥ Sacẖ kī baṇī Nānak ākẖai sacẖ suṇā­isī sacẖ kī bėlā. ||2||3||5|| Nanak speaks the Word of Truth; he proclaims the Truth at this, the right time. ||2||3||5|| http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.g...=3&id=31091 a disciple of man? who is this

There is also one saying: The truth is with Ali, and Ali is with the Truth. Whereever he turns, so it follows..

do Nanakpanthis and Nanakshahis still exist, or have they fallen in under the majority ?

hahahha hilaroius guv i like

why dont you do some naam japna instead of bashing Islam

what are the signs of the Return?

look at how the Sikhs, hindues and muslims are sitting side by side, singing the glorious praises of God and attaining anand. it reminds me that we should send invitations to the sufi community in Denmark the next time we have a Kirtan programme. Guru Marahaj song the praises of the Lord with people from all religions, yet in Gurdware we only see sikhs. what a shame

The qawali track in the background is just awesome.. sounds like its praising Ali. does any one know where i can download or buy this track?

The noor is just flowing from his beautifull face....

How would the ideal Sikhi organisation be in your eyes? hilarious movie by the way

nevermidn veerji .. i think i have found it: http://www.sikhawareness.com/sikhawareness...light=sachkhand cant wait to read it later tonight unfortunately most of your replys have been edited...

"I have discussed the reasons as to why the idea of reaching Sach Khand is theologically and scripturally untenable.", could you link me to this debate, as i find it interesting i have tried seaching for it, but i could not find it-

i still do not understand how batnini muslims belive in reincarnation, when the Quran says, after death there is no way of coming back: [23:99-100]

what informations do Sikh literature give about the coming of Guru Gobind Singh? will he assist Imam Mahdi, or are they in fact the same light?