Matheen

Discuss all you want, but there's no need to call each other names.

Not happening from a religious perspective, and for very good reasons. If you're talking about Sikhs of different races, that is acceptable and becoming more widespread. The Rajey did what they wanted - very few of them were religious but they did donate generously to religious causes. Not so different to many rich apney these days. You know what Punjabis are like once hard times pass!

Many of his advisors were Muslim, so I'm not sure how accurate this is. 'Dharma' - why is it an excellent policy? It flies against Gurbani.

If i remember correctly, the word Rudra also means 'to destroy'. This makes sense because Shiv is also called Rudr, and his duty (or the prupose of that shakti) is to destroy. Part and parcel of war, so I don't see the negativity of it. Probably something that isn't easy to control when it sufaces, though.

cardamon

There we go, all cleaned up. Harjas, if you wish to discuss my view of people who leave Guru Sahib or this forum in general, please open a thread in the 'gupp-shap' section. Thank you. And cleaned yet again. Please read the bold bit above.

Done some long stretches when sharing a house with Singhs during uni and also when in India. The effect is amazing and you have so much time to do extra Nitnam. Hope to get back to that level, with Guru Ji's kirpa. A bit sporadic at the moment!

Cul, what is your definition of 'capitalistic'?

How did it go this morning?

Actually, a very small percentage of the railway workers were Sikhs. Most of the Sikhs were skilled workers or taken over as part of the Police and Army. The skilled workers were involved in supervision, fabrication (metal and wood), mechanics, (later on) farming etc.

Thanks for the screen shots das ji. In the first one, mool mantar is quoted as being up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. The first page of the diary also has mool mantar up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'.

I will read it tonight. I've checked my tapes (bachan with Sangat in UK) and they definitely tell the sangat to recite up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. These might be on ik13.com, when the audio section is updated. I can also confirm that when they had Amrit Sanchars, they taught 'Waheguru' as Gurmantar and Mool Mantar upto 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. N30, I think this is more an argument over semantics - none of the Mahapursh or Sampardas mentioned ask their students to recite up to 'Gurparsad', but up to the end, as your first link shows.

Mool Mantar or Mangalacharan?

Yes, they said 'kahaundey' ah. Maybe they were speaking of people who say that, I don't know. However, they did say to recite up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. Let me see if the tapes I have are on gurmatveechar - I will post a link here. I don't think the reason for reciting up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach' is to reduce the intensity. It's the form that Guru Sahib gave to his Sikhs, after adding Ustat of Akaal Purakh.

Waking up is ok - even if it's just to turn off the alarm. I've tried some NLP techniques, and they sometimes work as far as waking up is concerned. It's getting out of bed that's the issue! Dalsingh, you are right that it comes down to nadar, or kirpa. It seems strange and contradictory, but I've felt an increase in ego/haumai when I manage a long run of Amritvela. As soon as I notice this, it's guaranteed that I won't be up the next day. It's like someone is showing me who the boss really is, lol. I think that's why reading Gurbani, with its constant message to be humble, is so important. Ardas is very powerful as well.

I also have a few tapes of Sant Isher Singh Ji Rarewale saying that Mool Mantar is up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. In the link you post, they are talking of 'Maha Mantar' or Mool Mantar as given by Akaal Purakh to Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Guru Sahib then gave Mool Mantar to Sikhs - up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach'. Just as Japji Sahib is incomplete without the Salok, Mool Mantar is incomplete unless we read up to 'Nanak Hosi Bhi Sach' The old sewadars of Sant Ji have confirmed this with me, but there is one guy in the UK who insists that they said it was up to 'Gurparsad', even after he was given the tape!

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa! Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh! The first characteristic of a Sikh as defined by Guru Ji is one who wakes up at Amritvela. Would be interesting to hear of the various techniques used - not theories but what you have tried and tested yourself. The most effective one for me is to have someone wake me up, lol. What works for you?

I understand why many Brits are apprehensive about immigration, but the BNP is not the answer. How will they stop illegal immigrants? Legal immigration is very strictly controlled, believe it or not, and I don't see how they could change anything significantly. Anyone who votes for the BNP is a moorakh, without doubt. It would be funny if so many asians/blacks become members that they take over the party!

Your theory is surely disproved by the fact that non Ramgharia Sikhs in Kenya also wear the same style. This maryada is now less widespread, as the vast majority of 'sikhs' in that region are now moneh and the ravaaj is now for 2-laar dastars with insufficient material for the chunj. Singh in your photo has smashed it, lol!

There is the text by Bhai Jaito Ji who mentions that Guru Ji cut off the heads of the 5 Pyare. This view is held by the majority of Sampardas, some with links going back to the original Panj Pyare. Anyway, this discussion should be about the topic at hand - which is about women in the Panj Pyare.

You can order the book for free from: www.gurukhoj.com

WJKK! WJKF! Having spent a large part of my youth in E.Africa, I assumed that starching a dastar and tying it with a sharp 'chunj' was normal, and those of us who didn't were in the minority. That was until we moved to places with more sikhs, visited Punjab etc. Anyone know why the Sikhs there started starching their dastars and what's the reason for the sharp chunj - is it a shastar or influence of living amongst rhinos, lol? (no offence to anyone - you should see my nana ji's dastar, it could take your eye out, lol!)

Jattboot - you are 100% right. However the threat of climate change shouldn't be used to secure huge funding for dodgy companies or government departments, or to tax us to oblivion.

Bhramgyan is not a state of mind. Once a Bhramgyani, always a Bhramgyani. We just need to look at the definitions of a Bhramgyani that are given in Gurbani e.g. Bhramgyani Aap Nirankaar etc.

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