Lucky

No worries Sat, this is not too unusual....It's your etheric/subtle body that is gaining kundalini potential. The etheric body is made up of energy channels called chi, meridians or nadis. These start getting blocked in all of us from when we detached from the umbilical cord and starting to get our minds enveloped in maya.. The etheric body affects physical body and vice versa. Just as negative emotions, depressed moods etc. can lead to physical illness symptoms., then in the same way, a significant increase in chi or prana flow, can lead to physical and muscular stimulations. This is exactly how acupuncture works to relieve pain. The needle mapping in this therapy works on the Chinese meridian points- which are the same as nadis. Needling the surface of etheric body meridians results in stimulation and loosening of tight muscles. People wonder why acupuncture is not painful and why there is no bleeding,.....This is because, it is the subtle etheric body being poked, and not the physical.... p.s. " I've been having acupuncture and IMS regularly for a few years" Anyway, I mentioned the above so that you get and idea about how powerful prana actually is..The muscle rigidity and aligning you experienced is because your erupting etheric energies are telling the physical to "straighten up and let us get through". This is why it is important to maintain good postural alignment for both a spiritual and physical well being. I always imagine the prana flow and channels as thousands of long tubes running straight up your body. If you look at some human biology books or pictures and see the blood flow in veins, then you will see lots of valves that prevent blood from flowing backwards. I imagine the chi channels being blocked as if these kind of valves are closed shut and preventing flow........So when you felt the physical jolt and muscles aligning, ...it was because the prana was desperate to flow through and upwards along kundalini.. This is exactly what you want, but your physical body was not aligned and was obstructing by not helping the valves to open.... Thus, we can understand that to get the internal jog between atma and paramatma, we need to get some physical balance and alignments to help with the process. I've heard that some people can be so physically unbalanced and unstable, that the prana channels can open with such a force that they get thrown a couple of feet from the floor as if some 'poltergeist' has wacked them whilst they were doing simran! ....On the other hand, some people can also end up passing flat out on the floor with such force when the prana erupts through channels above or near heart chakra. Sehaj, 24/7 helps. Sehaj in day, no emotions, no regrets, no anger, no praise, no slander....just sehaj ,,,calm and neutral... This will help all your body layers to stay in equilibrium. It will help prevent abrupt and sudden flows of energy. .

Have you started doing naam simran and have an idea of how to be proceeding?..............there is some very useful material on the forum that you can use to get going with some techniques.. Then it's a matter of scheduling some fixed routines to keep going. Good luck!

This topic has gone completely off track with the same old repeating argument with the same members again. The OP's question was about oral sex...... To answer this from my understanding, I can say that oral sex has nothing to do with sikhi. Sikhi doesn't say you can or you can't, it doesn't ban fellatio or cunninglingus, or state whether one swallows or spits!...... oral engagement is an intimate sexual encounter between a couple as any other act would be considered. In sikhi, one only exhibits this behaviour with ONE lifelong spouse... I'm not sure exactly what the op's intention was or what they wanted to hear, but let's get this straight- Sexual relations outside a marriage are a no no. ... I'm saying this because many young, distorted minds feel that they can indulge in such acts outside or even before marriage because they feel it is not full sex, or that no one's "cherry" is popped. These folk will be under the impression that they can still be considered pure virgins at the time of marriage because full penetration never occurred, The same goes for people that will be so sure that they haven't committed adultery just because they didn't go all the way... This is a false misconception because sexual relations with anyone means any kind of pleasures gained via senses of touch, feel, taste or sight by use of another's body. .....Bottom line is that oral is not prohibited, but it is still an act of sexual relations and is therefore not engaged with anyone other than your husband/wife. What you do with your husband or wife in the bedroom is entirely your business and nothing to do with sikhi. Saying that you can't engage in this or that in sikhi is like saying you can only wipe your backside with this hand or that one because your Sikh.

Sat, the key is to just take the message from the dream and not to focus on imagery. All our dreams have some underlying message from our subconscious that is trying to tell the conscious. You have to learn to decipher the messages yourself and what is important in any dream is to try and think exactly what your feeling of emotional state was whilst in the dream..and this usually helps you get the message. Dreams and thoughts are MAYA and will remain maya, but you have to use it to your advantage to help you swim across it. Avoiding or ignoring maya is not going to help. They say that the when one transcends maya and conscious connects with subconscious, then there will be no more dreams......remember, just take the message,..act on it,...and move on.. IF you don't get the message and act on it, then the same sort of dreams will keep re-occurring. You never really want to have any sort of recurring dreams because it means you are stuck and not learning the lessons somehow. ....// I'm speaking from what I've learned in my own experience :)

lol Banday banjoah......me and you would say ."Tenu meh dollian dindhah, bandah banjah"

We need to look at the whole shabad on ang1161 to see where and why "adam" fits in the message, whilst also remembering that Adam is considered the first highly respected muslim prophet on earth.

yes, they are and they just go around trying to 'indirectly' justify themselves.. I'm gonna be blunt and offensive here because I get fed up and annoyed hearing the old "oh, I feel like a woman trapped in a man's body...or I've always been a girl inside a boys body all my life.".........I mean, this really irritates me because they are basically saying "God made a mistake...he put me I the wrong body!".....go sort it out and work on living out your karams,...,because GOD does NOT make mistakes...period!

It's clear that most people have no idea about the spiritual meanings of ''Kama sutra"............sexual intimacies can be forms of worship if you understand them

In my experience, a physical kriya practice does help with concentration in order to get surti and shabad connection(shabad-surti aspect).. I find that physical discipline practicing helps with getting internal discipline practice for my "naughty wandering" mind! The above kriya requires a fair amount of concentration and practice, so it can help some of us more than others.... there are many kriyas and techniques for balancing pavan ida/pingla, but it's the practice and ease with how one's mind can listen and respond to you when trying to merge with shabad. ...I suggest that if you go throught phases of having difficulty focusing and settling into simran, then go try some example of physical pranayama or kriya and see if it helps.....what my mind responds to, ..may not work for others and vice versa.

This is the So Darshan Kriya or 'sudarshan kriya'. There have been slight variations amongst yoga schools, but the one below uses the "waheguru" mantra.

I'm afraid two camps can't both be right because there is only One EK ONKAR. Some scholars are wrong and it becomes apparent whether they have naam or not. There is no point fooling yourself if you are not willing to make effort to earn your own naam. What method you use, is open to choice, Waheguru isn't concerned about that. What does matter is ignorance, because it keeps you going around in circles instead of progressing.

Sat, that is a blessing. In my experience and understanding, when Guru Gobind Singh ji comes, he gives a message or helps in some way to clear the path for you, But when Guru Nanak dev ji comes, he is reassuring you the presence and closeness of Nirankar. ps... as long as you know that you are not going to form a bond and get tied up in the image,, I don't think it is a problem. You can use it to help catch the flow of naam current. You are aware that the goal is to get to the first stages of "emptiness" in Samadhi, and personaly, I don't feel that there are problems with guru ki murat, mann meh dhyan, as long as you know what you are doing. The dream's deeper message will probably come and make more sense to you in a few days, you just need to do some deep silent meditations.

I think it is. Soma is also another name for the sweet nectar. I don't know too much about it except that it is the cooling moon energy and is represented by the crescent moon. It is associated with "shiva"..... this SAME crescent moon is on the khanda worn by nihangs! I think it is worn by shiva as well... Information is not that clear and kind of 'mumble jumbled' in different texts and sources but I believe there is some association or link with this chakra together with the ajna and crown chakra being linked to make the upward triangle that represents the 2 triangles making a star. The upright shiv/cool energy and down facing shakti/solar energy. Triangle may have something to do with Egyptian pyramids?... May also be the Christians "star of david"?....I'm not sure and haven't looked into it. ...What is also interesting is that you mentioned "intoxicant".. Now, the soma or nectar produced from pineal gland does contain small traces of "DMT".. DMT is a real potent hallucinogenic in higher doses. May be this has something to do with nihangs and bhang, but there are a number of highly spiritual tribes in the Amazon, Brazil that use this (ayahuasca) as part of their deep meditative practices. I'm aware and have learned that they do encounter some things in their states that are also encountered in some naam amrit avasthas. I'm not too sure about that, but it is solar energy and agni. I do the agniprasana quite often in class and this is also known as "breath of fire''. Whereas the agnisara is a little different because breath is held. I will admit that I got a little annoyed doing this breath of fire in class because it would always diminish and stop amrit rus for over a week most times. I then stopped doing it, but later learned that I was imbalanced and that I needed more practice with both heating and cooing.......I'm still not balanced and in control though.

Please note Paapiman, that bhai Rahdir's book(which you mention) was one that was very misleading for me. This confusion is mentioned in early pages of other meditation thread. The book self created and divided so called yoga shabads and gurmat shabads... which is baloney.... Then the book comes across as if he never heard the sounds mentioned, again totally misleading,.. which raises doubts. ..In all honesty, I doubt most of the stuff from that camp...because there are avasthas where raags will be heard at different pitches and sound notes....yet the camp rejects ragmala? Papiman,f you really want to find the truth, Guru Nanak tells you that you won't find it by reading scholars or veds... you can only find it yourself by doing the practical. ... and I'm afraid that recording by gyani is wrong and is not talking from experience., ..

A lot of the kathas and other materials on anhad were wrong and misleading if you remember Sat?... that's why it took ages to work out what was what and what we should be looking for. At last we can look into gurbani ourselves and have a much better idea of what something refers to.

It is goldsmith for sure....."Suniyar". blacksmith is "lohar" I think. Was it the hammer and anvil mentions that made you associate "blacksmith"?

Good topic and good post. I will just add a little because I feel that it may be a technique or jugtee that is given. I think it was the bellows mention in translations tat made me think of breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out....I'm not disagreeing with your post or anything, but I think we can dig a little deeper and see something that is practical and for us to use? I think it may be saas saas gurmantar jap. We jap using bellows of body core(stomach navel and lungs), the gurmantar has to be done with dhyian and single one-pointed focus. We merge with and into anhad naad. Get amrit rus and ching-ching-->a minted coin of naam begins to accumulate in our body-crucible. ...Have a look below and see what you think? Patience of the goldsmith. ...This is essential because to get the final end product, the goldsmith has to sometimes work very patiently with small intricate details. In this case, he mentions the end product as a mint/taksal coin. Not an ordinary coin that would just be considered a coin shaped disc, but one with an official royal mint like seal to make it authentic. Understanding/intelligence -->Anvil, ...this is to what the "object" is hammered and shaped...... The "mat" is Guru's mat or gurmat. Using guru's mat, we use guru's mantra.....gurmantar. The hammer/hathiyar, used to shape the gold and make it authentic has to be specific in order to hammer the details. I think this is reference to "naad' because "gurmukh naadan, gurmukh vedan, gurmukh reha samayee" ....In simran,you have to listen and merge into the naad..... this leads to naam amrit. The "bellows" are used to pump forced air into a furnace to get the molten gold. ....Action of bellows is by expanding and contracting manually. This is analogous to stomach and lungs using saas graas techniques of breathe in-out, in-out, wahe-guru,..wahe-guru.. As per our prana, this area of the body is where heat is produced. ->the TAPAS is the heat energy generated by any yoga practice. Too much is not good, but to get the end product we still need it providing we can cool down the object in question. .....The cooling energy is higher up from the stomach and comes from moon energies of bindu chakra....Amrit is also considered as cooling and in gurbani it mentions in places how amrit cools the agan or brahmagan(fire-heat). NOTE- a lot of people get confused and think that they should avoid body heat production. They feel this because of problems with too much inner agani ....therefore, they avoid many practices, foods etc.... Sadly, they don't realise that we need both, but they have to be balanced. This is why yoga describes sun and moon energies distributed around the body. The sun/ right eye or pingula side is heat. The moon/left eye or ida side is cool energy. Guru ji mentions in gurbani that the sun and moon are both needed to nurse us, just as we have daylight and night. The crucible is where the product is collected of poured into. In this case, the body. Remember that the body has been pumping the gurmanta like a bellow from the body core. This will have generated the tapas heat.. The next step was to get the gurmantar into an authentic molten naam ras....and this happened using the ved from the naad. The next step would be to have the molten naam ras poured into the body crucible. Only now, after the molten amrit rus is poured, is the shabad and the coin of naam produced. This coin has the official seal to make it mint and give it an official currency value. Why would we need an official mint shabad/naam need value? Because the Wealth of naam is the only thing that we can take with us. Nothing else is of any value. We can't use fakes, we can't buy naam on black-market. We need the official naam currency just like the royal mint coins and US presidential seals on currencies.

who said the above ?

lol...........classic!

Yes, the yoga science of ru sound and tongue touching roof is to aid in the ascendance of sukham energy towards dasam duar. Once you start doing this regularly the current flow starts to adjust and becomes upward. --->this then helps to 'transform' below the navel-kaam/dark energy towards higher level/whiter- or light energy. I spoke about this another topic of how doing abyaas helps convert 'ojas' into god spiritual energy.

OK,..I've noticed a couple of things that have given me some conclusions about amrit taste and naam amrit. I am just going to give one of my earlier ones here that will help understand and describe the 2nd conclusion that I shall talk about later. The first result can be 'sort of' verified with gurbani as regards to sweet amrit/nectar. A few months ago whilst in yoga, we were doing a kriya that involved the chant of "har" (and using stomach force). That day, I wasn't too well physically and was trying to settle in and override my aches and discomforts... So I knew that I was nowhere near a meditative level. However, I noticed that with the chant of "har" and along with the kriya movement...I immediately felt the sweet taste in my dry/anxious mouth! Usually, when the sweet taste comes unexpectedly, I always try and think back to exactly what I was doing and where/how my state of mind was. .....Most of the time it is when I hear gurbani, simran or any kind if sift salah, but this usually involves the rom rom kicking in as well, or further magnifying in amplitude...... So, I was a little surprised in the class that day, but I kept it in memory that I was doing "har har" when it started and to note it my mental log book. Just recently we were doing another kriya and this also involved a chant of "har", and again, the sweetness taste was immediate. The first thing that came to my mind was "amrit bani har har teri" .. then I thought that there must be more to this link of "amrit" and "har" Looking into the shabads, there are so many like.. ang 99 ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਰਸੁ ਹਰਿ ਗੁਰ ਤੇ ਪੀਆ ॥ Amriṯ ras har gur ṯe pī▫ā., ang 95 ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਹਰਿ ਮਨਿ ਭਾਵੈ ਮਿਲਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪੀਜੈ ਜੀਉ ॥੨॥ Har har amriṯ har man bẖāvai mil saṯgur amriṯ pījai jī▫o. ||2|| The Ambrosial Nectar of the Lord's Name, Har, Har, is so sweet to my mind. Meeting the True Guru, I drink in this Ambrosial Nectar. || ang 119 ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸਬਦੁ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਹਰਿ ਬਾਣੀ ॥ Amriṯ sabaḏ amriṯ har baṇī. The Shabad is Amrit; the Lord's Bani is Amrit. Something like 164 single line tuks that reference "amrit" and "har" ... and funny enough, I was surprised that I never heard it mentioned by any one or any kathavachik. The problem is that you can't play around and test it to see if it works with "har" or not because your attitude and state of mind has to be correct. If you approach with intention that I wanna see if "ram ram" works or not, then you have already shifted your state of mind for experimental, self gain, maya purposes without noticing....and this approach won't work or bear any fruits...... btw "ram ram" does also work, no doubt. So, is there a theory for this?.............Well, I'm sure there is a better one than what I can explain. From what I know and have read, they say that a mantar has to be such that it should complete the internal breath cycle of coming from navel, up the sukhmana, lungs, throat , mouth and to go back down and start again. For this they say that the tongue should touch the roof of the mouth to aid the cycle completeness and flow. in "Har" it is the "arrrrrrrr" motion that does this. In "wahe-guru", it is the "urrrrrrr" motion, in "ram" it would be the beginning "rrrrrrrr" motion. My little self-theory is that this "mechanical" affect of jap is important. However, this is just for saas graas and saas saas simran, which is non-silent, and not full internally mental jap. But for complete silent and mental simran, we should sit with the tongue resting or touching the front roof of mouth and this will promote dripping of "naam/charan amrit" that has a slightly different affect in taste and I will speak about this later.

yeh man....Don't waste time--> "Just Do It" I've spent countless hours deciding when to fit in some time to sit and meditate. Everyday for the past couple of years, I usually wake up and plan the day mentally in terms of when I will later sit down and meditate. I even got into a habit of making the bed and arranging the pillows so that I could come back in the afternoon and sit straight down into simran....as you know, some thing always comes up and then I would go back into bedroom later and be disappointed,.. and like everyone else, I would then plan to better the next day..and so on... Nowadays, I do attempt it many times throughout the day and especially if I'm on my own and not talking to someone.....walking...on the bus...in the gym...in fact I've probably had more fruitful and sweet amrit sessions whilst sat in the gym steam room!... doing a cardio workout is also a fantastic way to just close your eyes(or just fix your gaze) and do saas saas from the stomach up.

but the theory of meditating and doing simran without shadab dhun is wrong. Meditating at 3rd eye only, does not take you to nijh ghar. This goes against gurbani and also the science of yog, where atma or jiv- which is below that area,.. has to merge with paramatma,.. that is well above 3rd eye.

from lala land.............maybe read John 3:16..."famous bible quote"

It depends on what the maas maas ka murakh jhagrey tuk really means to you. ਮਾਸੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਰਿ ਮੂਰਖੁ ਝਗੜੇ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਜਾਣੈ ॥ Mās mās kar mūrakẖ jẖagṛe gi▫ān ḏẖi▫ān nahī jāṇai. The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom To some it is more about justifying the meat or not, whereas for some of us it may be about "ghian dian". Talking from experience and from being an all round, everyday meat eater, the shabad is more about the meditation and spiritual wisdom. As one starts to get serious on the meditation path, then the automatic and intuitive understanding makes you realise that the "taste" of the tongue is of little importance. From my own experience and without any discipline and controlling,.. I automatically shifted away from desires of any meat products or even processed veggie junk,.. towards more natural, fresh fruit and raw veg. At this stage in my life, the shabad is more about desires and "taste of the tongue".....These are of very little significance compared to the desire for naam amrit.