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formation of the khalsa


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this is rele confusin....basically, wen the khalsa was formed, guru gobind singh ji took 5 singhs behind a curtain and came back out with a sword full of blood, proclaimin that he'd cut their heds off.

however, wen the curtain wos drawn back, all five sikhs were miraculasoly still alive. now, many people hav different theories as to y this happened

1) that guruji had sum special powers and joined the sikh's heds back 2 their bodies

OR

2) that guruji used sheeps blood insted of real human blood

which one is it???? or is it even ne of the ones ive stated???????/

please help

waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

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this is rele confusin....basically, wen the khalsa was formed, guru gobind singh ji took 5 singhs behind a curtain and came back out with a sword full of blood, proclaimin that he'd cut their heds off.

Darshan Kaur ji, he didn't take five deciples behind the tent at the same time but it was one after another. He asked for head for sure and that was to see the gutts.

however, wen the curtain wos drawn back, all five sikhs were miraculasoly still alive. now, many people hav different theories as to y this happened

Have you watched new released movie Bhagat singh? In which, chandershekhar Azad tells him that whatever they were doing not a play of kids, and all of sudden Bhagat Singh puts his hands on candle fire.

Now, it showed his dedication and gutts and he wasn't doing any miracle but he was trying to prove himself. Now for Khalsa establishment Guru ji didn't try to show people miracle and he wasn't there for games as well but his intention was to choose the best five to lead Khalsa panth.

Just imagine how brave those fives were? I mean in that huge crowd only 5 stood up and gave their head? So, main reason to do this was to choose five the best from all those were sitting over there. Five heads repersent "True dedication" not that guru ji asks us all to cut our head and give it to him. He wants to see every sikh dying for Sikh faith and ready to give his head if there is need to save Sikhism. This was the message.

1) that guruji had sum special powers and joined the sikh's heds back 2 their bodies

It doesn't matter what he did behind the tent and please don't go for the fantasy of that establishment day. Real intention was to get five dedicated deciples the ones will lead Khalsa Panth.

2) that guruji used sheeps blood insted of real human blood

I have written Guru ji's intention.

which one is it???? or is it even ne of the ones ive stated???????/

please help

If you don't want to get the message he gave through his khalsa establishment then its your own personal choice but the question you have asked above can be anwsered in only one condition if Guru ji shows up and tells us by himself. I would prefer to get his message of Khalsa establishment rather than what he did on that day.

I hope it helps....

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fateh ji

well it all boils down to a matter of belief - the average person cudnt kill someone and bring them back to life... but our gurus were not jus ordinary people.. they had the power to do anything they wished, they were all one with god and had been blessed

jus look baba atal for example - he was the son of shri guru hargobind sahib - he brought back his best friend from the dead - the gurus didnt perform miricles to show off - they performed miricles to show people the truth, to break their egos and to proove points

anyways - shri guru gobind singh ji went on many "liberating hunts" - where he would kill animals to liberate them in their present lives as promised by earlier gurus...

various gurdwarey have been set up on each of these hunting places.. gurdwara shikar ghat sahib is where he hunted a rabbit - which in its previous life was bhai maula... n another gurdwara was set up where shri guru gobind singh ji killed a lion called gurdwara sher ghat sahib

now - if shri guru gobind singh ji killed goats that dat on vaisaki - dont u think they would have called it bakra sahib? :P the khalsa panth would have been created for the goats not the sikhs - our guru didnt have to trick people or make lies to win people over, :wink:

look at baba deep singh - he fought headless and rested at shri harmandir sahib - many things that past sikhs have done defy the rules of science... thats why they are called mircles... deaf and dumb poeple have been made to speak by our gurus... huge boulders stopped with one hand... the proof of these mircles are visible at gurdwaret accross india today - for the khalsa nothing is impossible :wink: :wink:

sorry but i think i drifted off the subject :P:P

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Sat Sri Akal:

A new account by one Abu-Ul-Turani, former spy for Auragnzeb was found in Aligarh University Librery. In it, Turani states that the Guru Sahib did not take the Panj Pyare into a tent, but chopped the heads of the five in front of the sangat!!! This is in starj contrast to the "traditional"account, which states that goats were slaughtered. Turani himself felt compelled to take amrit afterwards, and became Ajmer Singh

Your choice to believe either one. I'll post the account below:

_________________________________________________

Vaaheguroo jee kaa Khaalsaa. Vaaheguroo jee kee Fateh.

Below is the version which "Abu-ul-Turani" has narrated in his book or

memoirs presumed to be held in the archives of the Aligarh University. It is a record of accounts that are supposedly eye-witnessed by "Abu-ul-Turani", who was under the employment of Emperor Aurangzeb. The Emperor had instructed him to keep a watchful eye on Guru Sahib and act as the Emperor's informer to keep him informed of all the activities and movements of Guru Sahib.

(Reported to be info from a booklet printed and distributed by Baba Khem Singh jee of Dera Baba Rumee Wala, Bhuchae Kalan , Bathinda. Panjab on Vaisakhi 1998.)

---

"The day Guru Gobind Singh prepared the nectar at 'Anandpur' the

congregation was estimated to around thirty five to forty thousand sikhs who had come from far and wide. I had seen the grandeur of the 'Mughal Darbars' but this 'Guru's Darbar' had a charm of its own - simply majestic and beyond comparison.

The Guru came on the stage and after drawing his sword demanded a 'head' from the 'Sangat' present. This awesome call from the Guru sent a shiver to spines of the sikhs present in the congregation. Amidst all this a brave person emerged from the crowd and with his clasped hands humbly presented himself to the Guru. The Guru, with one stroke if his sword, beheaded the sikh in front of all the stunned 'sangat', and again asked for another 'head'. Another person who came on the stage was similarly beheaded. The Guru made the eerie call again and simultaneously three devout sikhs came on the stage and met the same fate under the merciless sword of the Guru. The stage was a ghastly sight with the torsos and heads of the five drenched in pools of blood. All the trace of blood diminished after the Guru cleaned it with water. The Guru then medically joined each head on a different body and

thereafter covered them with white sheets.

He then ordered a stone urn and on top of it he put an iron pot in which he

added some water. He put his sword in it and started moving it, while

chanting some words. He took some time and during this period some woman from the Guru's household came and put something in the pot. The nectar (Abe-Hayat) was now ready. The Guru then removed the white sheets from one body and poured the nectar into the dead man's mouth, on the hair and on the body. While he was performing this ritual he kept on pronouncing "Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh"( The Khalsa belongs to the Almighty and to the Almighty is the victory ). To the amazement of the 'sangat', the person sat up and loudly chanted "Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh".

The whole congregation was aghast and taken aback by this miracle. The Guru did the same to the rest of the four bodies and they also like their

counterpart rose up with shouts of "Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki

Fateh". The Guru then took these five sikhs into a tent and after some time

they emerged wearing new white clothes. The Guru then kneeled down in front of them and asked them to give him the life giving nectar. Obligingly they obeyed and baptized the Guru .

The Guru named them Daya Singh, Dharam Singh, Himmat Singh, Mohkam Singh and Sahib Singh and consequently changed his name from Gobind Rai to Gobind Singh. What happened in front of my eyes completely entranced me, and my heart longed to be in the Guru's eternal feet. With a lump in my throat, I approached the Guru and begged him to baptize me and take me in his abode. The Guru smiled and baptized me and named me 'Ajmer Singh'. Thus with the Guru's blessing I attained absolute bliss. This was the last report I sent to Aurangzeb in which I mentioned that the Guru was not an ordinary person but was 'Allah' Himself. Furthermore I warned the Emperor that his enmity

towards the Guru will lead to the downfall and destruction of the Mughal

Empire."

----

Vaaheguroo jee kaa Khaalsaa. Vaaheguroo jee kee Fateh.

(Bhai Vir Singh mentions Abu Tarani in his writings of "Dasmesh Chamatkaar". Sant Kartar Singh of Taksaal also mentions that this has been witnessed bhai charan Singh Bhorshee in the book at "Aleegarr Muslim VihavVadiala" and according to Giani Dalip Singh of Komal Dhnaula the writings can be found at the Aligarh Muslim University.)

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no one knows what happened in the tent (lol it wasnt a curtain) but i can be sure that goats were not killed, because it is against basic sikh tenets.

guru gobind singhs father died for the cause not only of hindus but also to show that flashy tricks are totally wrong, and guru gobind singh elaborates on this ESPECIALLY in bachitar natak, why would he go against what his own father had died for, and he had written against in his own book?

btw the accounts of him slaughtering a goat came about 50 yrs after gurujis death, as people tried to think of ways how guruji could have done this (they believed he didnt have any special powers)

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Sat Sri Akal:

Forgot to mention this in other post. Baba Maan Singh made an excellent point in his katha, "16 Days with Sant Baba Maan Singh" (it was posted here too).

He states that if Guru Gobind Singh chopped the heads off the goats, then the Khalsa Panth would be made up of goats!!! :LOL:

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aaapa oos chiij vaal koy jaa rhe ha jis..to Guru ji ne sanu OLE kita

why are we trying to figure out sumthin that Guru Ji didn't SHOW us

why dont we jus keep toGuru Ji's teaching...which we were meant to see

why are we trying to visionize sumthin that Guru Ji didn't want us to see

personally :PÖ

i dont belive in the goat theory......or shall i simplpy say

goat "story" ;):P

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thes acts were'nt miracles, but acts of shakti and bakhti, if some1 wants to put limitation of what guru sahiban where able 2 do go ahead...

look at dhun guru nanak dev ji maharaj, stopped a boulder with the touch of his hand............ shakti and bakhti

look at dhun siri guru har krishen ji maharaj he would cure the ill with a touch.

look at dhun siri guru tegh bahdur ji maharaj, gave his head for another faith.

look at every1 of our guru sahiban and u will see an act of suprmembe bakthi/shakti.

for a more recent account

i'm not trying to equate bai sahib iwth guru sahiban but its a recent event

when shaheed sardar bai mehnga singh ji babbar was shot in the head, he was doing his sukhmani sahib phaat, and even after gettin shot in the head he kept on goin at it. without a flinch. As he finished phaat, a singh asks bai sahib, how r u? bai sahib answers chardi khalaa, and leaves this duniya to join with wahegurooo.

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