Great Sikh intellectuals

[Guest Javanmard]

Lets discuss great scholars of Sikhism.

[Guest BikramjitSingh]

Gone on then.. which scholars.

GurFateh

Bikramjit Singh.

[Guest Javanmard]

Sant Gurbachan SIngh Bhindranvale, Sant Sundar SIngh Bhindranvale, Pandit Tara SIngh Narotam, Pandit Gulab SIngh, Giani Gian SIngh, Rattan SIngh Bhangu, Piara Singh Padam...

[Guest]

Next- Rara Sahib Mahapursh's

[drawrof]

professor puran singh,

In my opinion he has lived an experience and is expressing it through sikhi. For those who like osho, read "spirit of a sikh". This man's approach and zeal is formidable ( I am speaking from intellect and feeling)

[Guest Javanmard]

THough he was a Singh Sabhia, there is an entousiasm about Puran SIngh that I like. H eactually recognised the four sampradavan in one of his famous texts>

[Guest]

Let’s discuss it in details. Scholar’s contribution to Sikh panth and researches they have done and their history.

I will look forward to see great knowledge this thread will have...

[Guest Javanmard]

How do you define a proper Sikh scholar first?

[Guest]

How do you define a proper Sikh scholar first?

If this question is for me then I would say a person who brings the truth without any partiality.

[Deep Singh]

ummmm Singhs....what do you think about Bhai Veer Singh, Bhai Kahan Singh and all of them?

and what about Kavi Santokh Singh....Bhai Daya Singh, Bhai Desa Singh who wrote Rehitnameh....what about Bhai Nandlal jee....

What about the greatest of them all....Bhai Gurdas Jee.....Bhai Buddha Jee

[Ideal Singh]

What about Kala Afgana ? He seems impartial about Truth !!!

[Deep Singh]

if we start calling Kala a scholar then i can understand why Sikhs are the way they are today....

[Ideal Singh]

Deep Singh : if we start calling Kala a scholar then i can understand why Sikhs are the way they are today....

If you could justify your alligation then it would be much better for all of us... mere refutation of a person is not enough i think...

[Deep Singh]

Bhaji the reason why i made such a statement has two reason:

(i) Akal Takht has declared Kala Afghana a tankiya and later on excommunicated him from Khalsa Panth, because of his writings;ie his scholarly mastermind....being a Sikh (who has faith in the concept of 'Guru Khalsa Panth' and Surbat Khalsa) i can not say that what Kala Afghana has written is nothing but only the truth, since the Panth as whole has denied his writings and given them the label of 'anti-Panthic'

(ii) Not looking at the decision made by Akal Takht or the Unified Will of the Panth, we can read his books (i believe they are avaliable online) and find out whether he is a scholar (who speaks truth and nothing else) or not. For that i like to refer you to this webpage: http://www.khalsaalliance.org/kala.php

Sangat must try to read all the material that has been posted above. If they do not agree with some of it, it can be wise to post those points here so we might have a formal debate over this and find out whether Akal Takht was right regarding KalaAghana or is he a Sikh scholar ('who brings the truth without any partiality')

I apologize if i hurt your's/others' feelings by making this statement.

However i believe that on Sikhawareness the members have had some debates over KalaAfghana and my baseless statement should not sotp us from discussing what we intended to do: discuss Great Sikh scholars....so we should rather discuss how some scholars have helped Sikh Panth...and not "controversial" figures such as; KalaAfghana.

[Guest Javanmard]

Kala is not an intellectual, he a retired police officer. By scholars I meant propers scholars. Not recreational scholars!

[sidak]

can't police officers/doctors/lawyers etc be intellectuals ?

[Narsingha]

Main Entry: 1in·tel·lec·tu·al

Pronunciation: "in-t&l-'ek-ch&-w&l, -ch&l, -shw&l

Function: adjective

Date: 14th century

1 a : of or relating to the intellect or its use b : developed or chiefly guided by the intellect rather than by emotion or experience : RATIONAL c : requiring use of the intellect

2 a : given to study, reflection, and speculation b : engaged in activity requiring the creative use of the intellect- in·tel·lec·tu·al·i·ty /-"ek-ch&-'wa-l&-tE/ noun

- in·tel·lec·tu·al·ly /-'ek-ch&-w&-lE, -ch&-lE, -shw&-lE/ adverb

- in·tel·lec·tu·al·ness /-'ek-ch&-w&l-n&s, -ch&l-, -shw&l-/ noun

from: http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book...va=intellectual

..doesnt mention anything having to be recognised by any authority (Sikh, or otherwise) to prove that one is an intellectual.

[Guest Javanmard]

We're talking about scholars not recreational intellectuals!

[drawrof]

what defines puran singh as a singh sabhia?

would it be his pro-kesh stance, him being influenced by bhai veer singh, would it be that he disengaged himself from "hindu-india".

Personally, I have been at extremes in my life, many factors including personal experience to ideals, to influence to practicality has had me grappling with these issues, but in the end I feel guruji's bakhshish has allowed me to see things from both ends and I take the appropriate stance accordingly.

with regards to sikhism and its relationship with hinduism, as seen by professor puran singh, what I gather is that sikhi, in his time, was not openly recognized by mainstream indians (again, this is my understanding). So, some of his writings will reflect his experiences and his influences,

lalleshvari,

what book of his talks about the original sampardava?

again, other issues aside, the "spirit" projected by professor puran singh was refreshing because many others who have written usually use flowery words but it appears to be "superficial".

sat sri akaal

[Deep Singh]

so if i say i am an intellectual...does that make me one..... :?

secondly are we talking about intellectuals or 'Sikh scholars'?

[Ideal Singh]

Most "Sikh Scholers" are recognised much after they are dead... :shock:

[Ideal Singh]

In their lifetimes they are declared Tankhaaiyaz :twisted:

[tSingh]

Gurfateh

The reference for Prof. Puran Singh's mention of the sampradaya is in 'The Book of the Ten Masters' on page 107 under the section 'Akali'. He mentions Nihangs, Nirmalas, Sewapanthis. He clearly states that they were part of the Khalsa. This is what he says:

Akali

(taken from 'The book of the Ten Masters', Professor Puran Singh, 1920)

The human spirit at Anadpur manifested its joyous spiritual energy in many ways. On every day that dawned there were new ideas in the very air, and the Khalsa crystallised in many shapes. The Sevapanthis, the Nirmalas, the Sahej-dharis, set forth new shining resolutions ; and last but not least, came the Akali, who washed himself clean of all earth and earthly life, till absolutlely free from the illusion of flesh and immersed in the vision of the Guru. Sevapanthis reserved themselves for the creed of service; later on they formed the first 'Red Cross' corps of Gobind Singh, serving friend and foe alike. They carried water on their backs in the battlefield, and held the bowl of mercy to the thirsty lips of the dying. They carried on a stock of first aid, and gained special knowledge in surgery and medicine. Nirmalas devoted themselves to learning. They studied Sanskrit and Vedanta, and went about educating the country and spreading literature that took its rise in Anandpur. Sahej-dharis, 'Disciples of the vow of moral devotion' was a beautiful name given to the disciples who could not yet stand up to wear the sword of the Khalsa, since wearing the sword meant death and dissolution. They would rather be in the background, the sympathisers, the hidden disciples of the Master. 'They also serve who only stand and wait'.

Akali was the Khalsa with an increased share of the Master's Amritam in him. He was already immortal; he had shaken off his body; there was no consciousness in him of death, sin, or self. He recked nothing, he heeded nothing. So great was the power of soul in him that he called Death - 'ascension to Heaven (charahi)'. If he ate raw 'gram' he said he was having a 'meal of almonds'. He called silver and gold coins 'husks', 'pieces of broken china'. His arithematic began with Sawa Lakh (1,25,000). Whenever an Akali entered the city, he said 'The Armies of the Khalsa have arrived' - he never said 'I'. When any one asked, 'how many?' he said; 'Swa Lakh'. Whenever he wanted anythig he did not beg, but he said that he had only come to collect 'taxes of the Khalsa'.

Some ill-informed writers have depicted the Akali as a kind of human wild boar, because he was sincere to the point of savagery. He was armed from head to foot, 'covered with steel'; his flesh was steel abd his eyes shone with the blue fire of destruction if anyone touched him wrongly. But he was the disciple full of Nectar of the divine song. If they were to cut him, they would find nothing but Hari Nam in his blood and bone. Was it not a marvel that at the call of Gobind Singh, there came a kind of men who soon rid the country of it's weakness and won a respect for the Masters personality that no king could command? 'Akali' means deathless or timeless. 'Kill me, cut me to pieces, I never die. I am Akali, out of this Door I go, out of that door I come in again. His touch has emancipated me. I am knowledge absolute, I am purity absolute, I am love absolute.'

The Akali called Emporer Aurangzeb by the curtailed name 'Auranga'; their language turned the world's glories and greatnesses into objects of contempt. They acknowledged no kings, and perhaps that is why no Akali could be tolerated in the British Punjab.

Without intending it, no doubt, the present rulers in India, in the ordinary course of their administration, have made the existence of the Akalis in the Punjab of to-day impossible. For he could allow no laws to interfere with his indigo garments, his infinte self-confidence, his prohpetic-like majesty and sincerity combined with the simplicity of a child in his love of his Master.

(end of excerpt)

[Deep Singh]

Ideal Singh jee..this time i ask you to give some reason why you say 'in their life time they are declared tankayias'

i know of Teja Singh Bhasuria who got excommunicated....but i think before he was excommunicated he was wellknown.....give me some examples of some Sikh scholars who became known AFTER they were excommunicated... :shock:

jtSingh:

i believe also that Nihangs, Nirmalas, Sewapanthis are part of Khalsa Panth after reading some of there practies and believes BUT i am not sure..therefore i asked the question that has not been answared.....but i wonder do they themselves recognize as a part of Khalsa Pantj...and how do they see us; 'mainstream Sikhs'. Are we maleccha ["kafirs" for Hindus, used for muslims and others] as someone mentioned that word here about SGPC...?

So still Udasies are not considered part of Khalsa Panth?

[SinghMunda]

Artists too are only recognised once they're dead