Fearless Warrior Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 I’ve just joined the form and I have been reading the posts / topics for the last 6 hours or so. Respect to everyone that has made this site possible. Before I get to the point just want to say that I am not dissing any one by this statement I just feel it needs to be said and question answered. Now I would like to bring up some home truths about the UK Sikh culture and where I see it heading in the next 10 yrs. The problems we face at present, recently I have heard and faced encounters where Sikhs, our brothers and sisters have been beaten by gangs of Muslim youths and adults because there Sikh, while fellow Sikhs sit back watching with shock but with out the respect for there beliefs to help out by even doing the littlest of things. Where has the brotherhood gone? Are Sikh youths that scared that they can’t even fight for there own. I am ashamed by the mentality of such cowards. But it seems that very few Sikhs wants to help another. Why is this? I would just like to get the views from the rest of you. When you bring such topics up for discussion it seems that everyone wants to help and fight for what is true, but when it comes to the crunch there just like the rest shivering in there shoes. Do you think it is the way we have been brought up in the UK by our parents who just want there kids to get a degree, good job and then get married. But what people don’t realise is if we don’t do some think about it now things are only just going to excel and in 10 years time when you and I have kids they will face the same problems but by not just the Muslim community but other community that are setting up camp in the UK for example the Kosovo’s. We need to reunite the community as one doesn’t matter if you’re not a pure Sikh long as you hearts in the right place you can do that little bit to help. People need to wake up and smell the blood of our brothers and sister who are targeted by communities that are aware that the Sikh community will not lift an eye lid. What happen to the likes of Sher-e Punjab? When will someone step up take charge of this matter, doesn’t seem the gudwara communities think its a major topic, everyone is still stressing about Punjab and 1984 how can we help our own in India when we cant even control what’s happening in our own back garden! No hard feelings meant. okay just realised i can do a poll so am gonna give it agoo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 most interesting topic fearless, i also think like you, but too many divisions have come in the way of the brotherhood, but in all honesty i think its one's own ego that stops things, u no i no enuff people that would be like, "no he goes to such n such a Gurdwara, thus i will not help this person"..... what has happend to the time when the sikh brother/sisters of the UK used to help each other in all subject. so many people sit there arguing over meaningless stuff, trying to get over there piont that they are right, but all that does is get more people in trouble. Final piont, "everyone wants to help and fight for what is true, but when it comes to the crunch there just like the rest shivering in there shoes" that is very true i no of enuff people that would shit it when things come to the crunch. holla at ya boy....... Mod's Note: Edited. Please bring evidence against BOSS not your hearsay. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 Muslim vigilantes attack a Sikh youth. Result: Sikh vigilantes go out to a attack a Muslim. Result: Attacked Muslims indiscriminately attack an innocent Sikh youth. Result: Sikh youth attack an innocent Muslim. Now it gets juicy... Result: Muslim/Sikh youth 'attack' Sikh/Muslim girl. Overall Result: We got innocent Sikh/Muslim girls caught up in immature hatred between Muslims/Sikhs. The funniest thing is, so many of these Sikhs would probably want Khalistan/independence, or would think they are fighting to uphold their religion. Yet what they are actually doing is fighting out a hostility between 2 neighbouring countries, irrespective of religion. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narsingha Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 Muslim vigilantes attack a Sikh youth. Result: Sikh vigilantes go out to a attack a Muslim. Result: Attacked Muslims indiscriminately attack an innocent Sikh youth. Result: Sikh youth attack an innocent Muslim. Now it gets juicy... Result: Muslim/Sikh youth 'attack' Sikh/Muslim girl. Overall Result: We got innocent Sikh/Muslim girls caught up in immature hatred between Muslims/Sikhs. The funniest thing is, so many of these Sikhs would probably want Khalistan/independence, or would think they are fighting to uphold their religion. Yet what they are actually doing is fighting out a hostility between 2 neighbouring countries, irrespective of religion. Why did the Muslim attack the Sikh youth in the first place? ..are u suggesting Muslims start the violence? Tsk tsk... :roll: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 lol I was waiting for that one! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhi Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 i dun live in the uk so there isn't really much i can do for you people. interesting topic though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Maha Devi Chandi Sri Mata SukhiUnderScoreVee Bibi 108 111 once said that fighting is not goooood. i agree with the above post 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 i dun live in the uk so there isn't really much i can do for you people. interesting topic though. stay in Canada...that's enough for us. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sikh_fauge Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 seriously, there are so many "apneh" who are not so nice people..bad apples exist everywhere..it sounds cheesy but its so true..heres a great example, the wonderful "SP" aka "shere" punjab in the uk..they like helping gurls from the clutches of muslim guys..but guess what?? most of them end up screwing them over themselves! wonderful isnt it! i think fearless warrior, in essence is right..but brother, first we need to sort out our own community..it seems we're the ones doing the most damage! how we do do it..i dunno 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 first of all fuaj singh, come meet ur friends evry once na while hey!!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearless Warrior Posted December 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Glad people made the effort to reply back . Was also thinking, how come we don’t get taught Gatka, when it’s a fundamental of every Sikh, to be a warrior as well as a saint :?: . If young kids were shown the ways of the gatka with the strong mental attitude you develop while learning would things have been different? I think that its time to evolve the way sikhi is taught to young children. My younger cousins aged between 8 - 14 learn more about sikhi from me then they ever have in the gudwara even tho there parents take them to the gudwara every Sunday. Mainly due to communication, as we are born in the UK we are brought up understanding English better then Punjabi. I don’t understand why people don’t realise that if we don’t change the way we teach sikhi to the younger generations that it will sooner or later die in the UK. Sikhi will be forgotten and everyone will call themselves Punjabi. This is what I think needs to be done. In every gudwara we should have sub-commuites of UK Born Sikhs running there own classes about sikhi, teaching gatka and uniting young Sikhs from the word go. As these day while sitting in the gudwara you come to realise that a lot of young children are sitting ideal looking at the clock waiting for the hours to pass when they go home. When that time can be spend teaching them about the gurus, the ways of Sikhism give them some think to be proud of and then maybe they will fight for it. Learning can be fun. How many Sikh people do you know that have learnt a marital art such as kick boxing, kung fu and wing chug for example but not realising that these arts have not been proven in war to the scale gatka has been. I wanted to share this powerful devotion. The person who is repeating these kinds of verses again and again from a young age while learning the art will develop into a mentally strong, focused warrior. :sikhiwink2: Oh holy sword of God, cutting and slashing Cutting down the armies of the wicked So beautiful in battle, giver of strength Unstoppable arm, terribly fast Your light is dazzling Brighter than all the sun's glory You bestow peace upon the saints You are the destroyer of the wicked You dispel sin You are my hope and protection Hail hail to the creator of the universe The liberator of all creation You are my protector Hail to the holy sword Hail hail to the creator of the universe Oh punisher of the armies of the wicked Who cuts down the demons and slays the enemy Oh supreme from the beginning of time Oh killer of the raksha demons Oh savior of the fallen, overthrower of hell Remover of superstition Indestructible, never ending, fast as light Oh fearless sword of God Invisible, uncomparable Hail hail to your forever, oh crusher of demons Oh you of incomparable beauty Protector of the earth Hail hail to your forever Grant me this boon oh God from thy greatness May I never refrain from righteous acts May I fight without fear all the foes in life's battle With confident courage, claiming the victory May my highest ambition be singing thy praises May the glory of God be, reign in my mind When this corporal life reaches its limits May I die fighting with limitless courage When this mortal life reaches its limits May I die fighting with limitless courage 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sikh_fauge Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 akali sodhi bruv..i love u man..and rakash..infact all my singh homies..but u know how it is with uni..second year..mash up (basically ive rurned into a nerd lol) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
double_edge Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 I think Beast has summed it up perfectly. This kind of thing is kicked off by the ignorant and the innocent suffer. Real life example: Two brothers i know got home one day to find some guy JUMPING up and down on the bonnet of their sisters car, while she was inside, too terrified to get out. Naturally they chased him down the street and gave him some Desi Beats (Volume 1) him for terrorising their sister and left it at that. The guy eventaully picked himself up, dragged himself back home and proceeded to tell everyone "these two guys beat me up coz im Muslim". Result? it sparked off what effectively became a gang war and as always, the innocent suffered the consequences. My point being, no matter how righteous the initial cause (protecting ur sister from some nutter jumping on her car is pretty damn righteous so far as im concerned), the eventual result was that the innocent suffered. wether it was because they became victims of the violence or wether it was because they were too scared to go to certain parts of the neighbourhood coz they'd be invading "Their Territory". Ultimately, we should all do what we need to when the situation calls for it.. but im always wary of people trying to rally their own little fauj to dispense justice. I think the emphasis should be on education. same thing i say when people start kicking up a fuss abt conversions etc. the answer isnt to go out and kick off with whoevers convenient. its in educating ourselves and our loved ones as to how we should behave and where we should draw our lines. Thats where we often fall short as a community, and that, in my opinion, is what we need to work on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearless Warrior Posted December 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Paji I understand the point and agree. It’s all about educating the young and bringing the community together. But it seems no one cares at end of the day everyone wants to lead a peaceful life but what’s going to happen in the years to come? When things get worse, hope they don’t. Also no ones ' rally their own little fauj' the point I was getting at is. example a young/old Sikh or non sikh lad getting " jumped " by a handful of lads, while other Sikhs watch not even thinking to even jump in and push a few off. These days everyone’s worried about there own neck. If sikhs thought like that hundreds of yrs ago I wouldn’t be writing this reply nor would this site be here! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 fauj, man i, i i love u tooo maaaan *goes n wipes his tears* 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
double_edge Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Fearless Warrior, i wasnt saying u were rallying a fauj, sorry if it sounded that way. but im sure we've seen people try to do things to that effect and its not usually a good idea. But im totally with u when u say we shouldnt stand by and watch someone get jumped. strictly speaking, we shouldnt really let that happen anywhere to anyone if the odds are uneven. Things like this, as i've noticed, seem to flare up every few years and then die down again.. its as if every few years, another bunch of kids hit a certain age, become culturally aware to whatever extent, hang out with other kids of the same background and then the "Us and Them" thing comes into it. conflict becomes inevitable, and then before u know it everyones saying "look how they're attacking our kids..." and before u know it the dominoes have started to fall and we end up in that oh so familiar place. Thats why i stress education.. the only way to break a repeating pattern is to change some contributing factor. We cant change anyone else.. so we should try to change ourselves first. Once our own foundation is solid, we probably wont have to spend half as much energy worrying abt the rest of the world.. or maybe im talking complete bakwaas lol.. more than probable in my case! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nectar Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Very nice and knowledgeable post...I wish I cud help somehow... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearless Warrior Posted December 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Dont worry paji know it wasnt directed at me as such lol, but just thought id clear it up just in case. You made availd point. Education is the was forward think am gonna have to learn my times table 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nectar Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 I guess we need to protect or rather guide sikhs in Punjab also...Youth da beda garak ho reha hai....In our pados only there are 8 guys and all are so called sikh ....and all they know drinking,chasing girls ,harassing girls in neighbourhood(once they tried to stop me )OMG batmeez ULLU jehe!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearless Warrior Posted December 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 We cant protect punjab untill we get the india goverment influence out. The national laugage in punjab is hindi (wtf) as stated by the indian goverment, they dont even teach young kids about sikhi. From my point of view sikhs dont belong in india and we cant call ourselves indians when we dont have the same right of freedom like other indians and indias ment to be the worlds largest Democratic country, there having a laugh. about the munday in your pind Kick there ass luv ! Ps GooglyKaur whos the little bold Kid looks japanees to me 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernal Monk Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Well I'm not in England, from America actually, and would like to give my two cents.... All I have to say is I don't bother anybody unless they bother my friends/family. I will take a lot of crap from people, but can't stand it when its to my family/friends. That said I also don't let people beat up on other innocent people (though this doesn't happen too much). That and most people don't say anything to me... (even though I can't fight, never been in one, lol). And about that comment of someone jumping on the sister's car. If some even dared to scratch my car I would beat their face in, and if they ever tried to do anything like that to my sister you better believe I would break their fuckin' legs, me and all the people I know :mrgreen: Granted my paragraph above goes against what most people here said, but that is how it would happen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nectar Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 We cant protect punjab untill we get the india goverment influence out. The national laugage in punjab is hindi ((admin-cut)) as stated by the indian goverment, they dont even teach young kids about sikhi. From my point of view sikhs dont belong in india and we cant call ourselves indians when we dont have the same right of freedom like other indians and indias ment to be the worlds largest Democratic country, there having a laugh. about the munday in your pind Kick there ass luv ! Ps GooglyKaur whos the little bold Kid looks japanees to me I agree...but I feel local bodies(gurdwaras) cud do something....like frm what I have heard frm my mamaji he lives in Ca..He said was like people use really advanced audio visual aids for educating the youth...here its not like that....I mean the only knowledge a kid gets is Bebe/Dadis nanis sakhis which they tell at nini time....but hunna now the prob is cos of nuclear family concepts...Dadis dont stay with their sons....so poor kids feed on Cartoon Network 24/7 or other nonsense...and theres no check on what filth these kids watch...Punjab ch jada haal mada hai since theres no check....I have younger brother and wen tells us abt what other guys his age do ....my mom is like ke ....we wont let him go out n stuff...but that cannot really happen hunna...Teenagers are blindly copying West..... I wish there cud be some ideas ,some organisation which cud help n educate kids in Punjab....and other areas of India where sikhs live.... That baby is from my collection of baby pics....I dont know who he/she is ...some cute nonu kaka.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sukhi Posted December 10, 2004 Report Share Posted December 10, 2004 stay in Canada...that's enough for us. careful now.... when u least expect it, i'll be there and then no one will be able to protect you. muahahahaaaaa! :twisted: thanks for agreein Sodhi... although i dun really know what u were agreein with... :? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejvir Kaur Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 well i've heard and seen lots...in the us and canada and uk and india and i think i agree with what sikh fauge said earlier we do need to fix the problems in our community first..if we don't stop fighting almongst ourselves how do you expect us to fight for eachother??? in some cases what I'm saying might be false to some of you but this is what I'm going on from what I've seen and heard...my apoligies if i said anything wrongs.. and sukhi...you should check out the UK its fun...and I hear Birmingham is like New York in the States... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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