mrsingh

Going back to the OP: In Punjab right now today there is a systematic program to convert all Mazhabi and Ravidassia Sikhs of today into tomorrow's Hindutva votebank by way of Balmiki and Dera Ballan Mandir franchises. If Sikhs do not urgently address biraderi apartheid immediately by way of ending discrimination, matrimonial apartheid and ensuring each pind only has a single united sangat Gurdwara then by the time of the (east) Punjab census in 2021 the Sikh percentage will be less than 50% of the population (currently around 60% in Punjab if we include all dera followers within Sikh ranks - as we should) via the loss of 6million sincere Punjabi-speaking Sikhs of today potentially becoming tomorrow's Hindutva votebank by 2021. We as ordinary Sangat need to actively fight the cancer of matrimonial apartheid and biraderi-based golaks by uniting Gurdwara's by Panj Piare representation from all erstwhile Gurdwara's which merge into one in every pind and locality in the West. We need to eradicate the despicable mentality of matrimonial apartheid if the Sikh Panth is to progress.

Paapi Ji, Banda Singh Bahadur Ji never claimed themself to be a Guru. This was a lie popularised by the Mughals and anti-Sikh forces over the years. May I also ask Paapi Ji, since you openly admit that you are not a Sikh yourself, why it concerns you so much as an openly declared non-Sikh yourself as to who can or cannot be included within the sharan of the Sikh Panth?

The simple definition of an ordinary lay (sehajdhari) Sikh is one who bows down before Guru Sahib. An Amritdhari GurSikh should rightly be stated as one who keeps kes and shastar for the protection of the weak. But the more extensively we define, the more we will end up excluding. For example if a person of African ancestry keeps kes in the form of dreadlocks but wishes to become Amritdhari we should welcome that without ritualising the insistence upon kangha for all circumstances. I think all jathebandi's and samparda's are unanimous about kes and shastar for protection of the weak (given that kirpan is any weapon with which we can do kirpa upon others via their protection - as opposed to ceremonial ritualistic one inch kirpans hung around the neck like jewellery). Kara is purely for combat purposes as not for nothing did Guru Sahib discard the janeu. Jhatka or use of sukha need not come into definition of an Amritdhari Sikh though I think all of us (except for a few nangs who eulogise Santa for supporting Indira Gandhi) understand that recreational drugs for getting high go stridently against what Gurbani states.

Paapi Ji given that you consider yourself a non-Sikh, I just about grasp where you are coming from now. The reason why Baba Banda Singh Bahadur was eventually captured and made shaheed was due to lack of supporting numbers. The reason for our defeat in 1849 was due to lack of numbers given that 90% of Punjabi's were Muslims and Hindu's in 1849. The reason for the losses we suffered in the Pakistani Genocide of Sikhs in 1947 was our lack of numbers (only 13% of Punjabi's in 1947 and today) and yet again the hundred or so brave shaheeds of 1984 were defeated purely due to a lack of numbers. It is only Hindutva supporters who wish for the Sikh Panth to remain in as small numbers as possible as that way the Sikh Panth will always be at the mercy of other enemy forces unable to defend itself nor unable to meaningfully serve humanity on a wider basis as the Khalsa Panth should by being at the forefront of genocide prevention, disaster relief, clean water provision, schoolbuilding etc.

N30 Paji even though the UK and Canada are held us as the two diaspora strongholds for Sikhs (which is demographically true) the reality is that Sikhs account for 0.7% of the UK population whereas Canadian Sikhs at 1.4% have double the population strength on a percentage basis within Canada. Obviously in BC Sikhs compise 5% of the population which enabled a Sikh premier. Sadly the UK has zero number of Sikh MP's (out of 650) whilst the Muslims have 13 MP's. The Pakistani's whose population is about double the number of Sikhs in the UK have 10 MP's and the Bangladeshi's have three female MP's despite the Bangladeshi population only recently having overtaken Sikhs. What this shows is that UK Sikhs need to ditch jathebandi politics, abandon biraderi affiliation, end matrimonial apartheid, merge Gurdwara's so that we united saanjha Sangat in every locality. UK Sikhs need to focus on expanding Sikhi via grass roots action for Sarbat da Bhala rather than expenditure upon brand new places of worship with biaderi-based golak control and where minor theological differences over issues like meat or what is authentic Dasam Bani take precedence over Panthic Unity.

Paapi Ji in the context of you conceding that you yourself are not a Sikh, then your hesitation to accept that the wider Sikh Panth is not solely defined by Gurmukhs makes sense. So now that we have got over that hurdle let's agree that non-Sikhs such as yourself and me should all work together to nevertheless expand the basis upon which Sikhi can serve humanity in a bigger and better way globally. Key to that Paapi Ji is that you regarding yourself as a non-Sikh is completely fine (in terms of your spiritual state and paapi actions) however let's try to increase the numbers of people who consider themselves part of the Sikh Panth (including yourself as a member of the Panth regardless of via your actions and soch you feel that you are not a Sikh).

Essentially paapi Ji i'm arguing that i believe it's you yourself who is failing to grasp the basics of Sikhism via your insistence that the Sikh Panth's population must be made smaller and smaller over time whilst increasing the Hindu population to match. If being a minority is better for humanity and Sarbat da Bhala then I presume you supported the Genocide of Sikhs by Pakistan in 1947 and the Genocide of Sikhs by Congress from 1984? Neither of which would have occurred if Sikhs had been a majority population. If you want Sikhs to be a microscopic powerless minority then you are de facto arguing that you support the fact that Sikhs should be a vulnerable community dominated by others and prone to Genocide should the non-Sikh majority of the world decide the fate of Sikhs whichever way they please. Why do you feel the need to bolster your point by lumping together sehajdhari Sikhs with perverts? What is so difficult to understand about the fact that there can be Amritdhari, Kesdhari and Sehajdhari Sikhs within the Sikh Panth? How convenient! So sehajdhari Sikhs are committing worse than incest in your opinion. But you wouldn't dare say that to a non-Punjabi as you know it would only bring ridicule to what is perceived about Sikhi. Gurbani defines a true Sikh (Gurmukh) yet nowhere does Gurbani or Guru Sahib mention that sehajdhari Sikhs are to be excluded from the Sikh Panth and pushed away into the arms of the Hindu fold. I personally do not eat meat but if I am understanding you correctly you seem to consider Nihangs as non-Sikhs. Do you also consider Taksali's as non-Sikhs? As many other Sikhs disagree with their bowing towards 3 granths. Did you agree with Babbar Khalsa's classification of DamDami Taksal followers as non-Sikhs when DamDami Taksal campaigned for Congress and Indira Gandhi in the 1980 elections, which laid the framework for Indira Gandhi's Genocide of Sikhs. Essentially are you paapi the only Sikh in the world and how many other Sikhs in the world are there like you?

​The most fundamental point about Rehat is remembering Akaal Purakh and focussing on actions which benefit humanity through Sarbat da Bhala. Thus it can be argued that those outwardly professing to keep rehat yet aggressively aiming to exclude Sikhs from the Panth in order to do the dirty work of Hindutva forces are to all intents and purposes are patits. I won't go so far as to argue that you are a patit (as I think you say what you do out of sincerity) however, you have to see the negative impact occurring by pushing those people who you dislike out of Sikhi and into the Hindu fold. ​No I disagree. The minority of Sikhs that smoke, eat meat, use drugs, cheat or sell themselves should be assisted to leave such life choices. The best way to do that is to see them as fellow brothers and sisters within the Sikh Panth. How exactly will we help them when we exclude them as ordinary lay members of the Sikh Panth? Will classifying these people as Hindu's help them? Or will it assist the Hindutva political agenda? Most Indians are not even Hindu. The Hindutva strategists only barely get to the figure of 79% of the population by manipulating figures and including every belief system within the mythical umbrella of Hinduism for political hegemony purposes. The hundreds of millions of poor Indians outside Punjab whom a minority of which might smoke, do drugs etc should be encouraged to see themselves as sehajdhari Sikhs as only via this strategy will Khalsa Raj (rule via justice) come closer to pass. I keep my kes however your point about cutting hair being as sinful as incest is ludicrous and deliberately exposes Sikhi to ridicule amongst the 99.9% majority of the human population outside Punjab that do not keep their hair.

​Exactly Paji. The sakhi is a fake story. It does not align with what Gurmat teaches us and should be considered as an anti-Sikh sakhi interjected by anti-Sikh forces to weaken the Sikh Panth. kdsingh80 rightfully exposed this false sakhi before others might fall for it. All material which does not align with Gurmat should be exposed and discarded if we are to progress. Amongst the bravest of the brave our Panth has produced were Bhai Jiwan Singh Ji (that our Hindu and Muslims opponents abused and despised when Gurdwara Sis Ganj Sahib Ji was initially constructed as in Hindu and Muslim eyes, Bhai Jiwan Singh Ji was a Bihari choora) and leader of the Sikh Fauj (at Guru Sahib's behest) Shaheed Bhai Sangat Singh who again the Muslims (and the Mughal's Hindu allies) despised as they could not countenance that the Sikh Fauj was being led by what anti-Sikh forces thought of as a degraded chamar. Sikhs nowadays fail to recognise that the Ramgarhia misl had around 90% of its fighters from a non-tarkhan background with the Khalsa warriors in that misl hailing from diverse former backgrounds including Brahmins, Leatherworkers, Rajputs, Mazhabi's, Jatts, Weavers, Saini's, Water Carriers etc all uniting as equals and assigning Jathedari to the most qualified general amongst them (Bhai Jassa Singh). Also instead of bandying about the word brahminwaad so often we should educate more and more Punjabi and non-Punjabi Brahmins as to the bravery of our beloved Sikh shaheeds like Bhai Mati Das and Bhai Sati Das. The only relevance caste should have to us as Sikhs is that should violently despise it as a label and oppose it's use amongst our ranks but nevertheless utilise it's appeal to draw in new Sikhs to the Panth from particularly Hindu backgrounds.

Until we merge all biraderi-based Gurdwara's into single united Sangat Gurdwara's in the West and put an end to the associated matrimonial apartheid, Sikhi parchar cannot really be taken seriously by many. Furthermore, only by accepting sehajdhari Europeans as new Sikhs (rather than insisting on them being Amritdhari in order for us to consider them Sikh) will greater number believe that the values they believe are best described as Sikhi and that they themselves are Sikh. The vast majority of human rights activists, animal rights people, those that helped the fight against Ebola are natural born Sikhs if only they knew it.

No in fact it does Paapi man. Those paapi's like yourself that drink, smoke, eat meat, use drugs, cut their hair are actually the vast overwhelming majority of the Punjab population and an even greater percentage of the​ India population more generally. You wish to exclude and alienate all those that do not mirror your own beliefs as non-Sikhs. The Hindutva forces that oppose Sikhs are delighted by your viewpoint as they mop up every person that you wish to exclude from Sikhi and include them within the Hindu fold. The result being that the Hindutva political base strengthens whilst the Sikh Panth suffers as time goes on. So Sikhs have already been reduced from a 100million plus population that we could have been today down to arguably only1.8% of the Indian population if we include sehajdhari Punjabi-speaking Sikhs. What you propose is to reduce this 1.8% further to 0.18% (only those 10% that keep kes) so that democratically and politically the Sikh Panth has zero power to defend itself from any Genocide and nor have any ability to serve the poor and downtrodden for Sarbat da Bhala. As 0.18% equates to 1 in every 555 people which is powerless minority which will never hold any democratic sway or influence. You need to understand that only by growing the Sikh Panth's population to a critical mass can we best defend ourself from events like 1947 and 1984 and only by having a larger population of the wider Sikh Panth will an enlarged Khalsa Panth population emerge in order to do seva in Punjab, India and worldwide to prevent genocides like Rwanda, to combat Ebola outbreaks, to assist after earthquakes and other natural disasters. By having an enlarge Sikh Panth population which accepts anybody who bows down before Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj as a Sikh, you yourself as a paapi are not prevented from following the beliefs you paapi currently hold.

​What better way is there for enemies of Sikhi to make the Sikh Panth so demographically small as to be politically irrelavant? What's amusing is that it is dressed up superficially as respect for Sikhi (despite it being blatantly against the ethos of Sarbat da Bhala and purely only serving to strengthen the Hindutva agenda). And sadly some of our people unwittingly imbibe this de facto anti-Sikh agenda of making Sikhs a smaller minority both unable to protect themselves nor serve the wider world and humanity where the Khalsa Panth should be at the forefront of doing where Ebola, floods, earthquakes, genocide, modern day slavery etc are happening.

The Congress and Nehru approved definition of a Sikh solidified in the SGPC Maryada of 1950 was citical in excluding all non-Punjabi sehajdhari Sikhs from the Sikh population by the time of 1951 Census in order to deliberately make the Sikh Panth as small and politically irrelavant minority as possible. If the Kabirpanthi, Ravidassia, Satnami, Sindhi, Vanjara, Sikligar and other tribal Sikhs had been accepted and integrated within the Sikh Panth the population of Sikhs today would stand at over 100 million. The political strength of such an enlarged and inclusive Sikh Panth may have meant that 1984 would not have been possible to orchestrate by Indira Gandhi had the Sikh population been four or five times larger than it was at the time back in 1984. To a great degree the sehajdhari Sikhs of non-Punjabi ancestry have lost much of their connection with Sikhi due to the Hindutva policies of consolodating them within the Hindu fold. However, even in Punjab right now today there is a systematic program to convert all Mazhabi and Ravidassia Sikhs of today into tomorrow's Hindutva votebank by way of Balmiki and Dera Ballan Mandir franchises. If Sikhs do not urgently address biraderi apartheid immediately by way of ending discrimination, matrimonial apartheid and ensuring each pind only has a single united sangat Gurdwara then by the time of the (east) Punjab census in 2021 the Sikh percentage will be less than 50% of the population (currently around 60% in Punjab if we include all dera followers within Sikh ranks - as we should). Singh Sabha were not responsible for turning Dr Ambedkar away (which resulted in 10million new Buddhists since 1947) as Giani Ditt Singh Ji (who the Muslims and Hindu's openly derided by referring to him as the "chamar leader of Singh Sabha") was instrumental in the ideology that bought many hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of erstwhile Hindu's and Muslims from poor families into the Sikh Panth in the early 20th century (including my ancestors - without any insistence from Akali Singh Sabha Lehar Gurdwara's upon becoming Amritdhari). Interestingly, Anand Karaj prior to the 1940's was a way where couples where both man and wife were previously of non-Sikh background became new Sikhs by virtue of Anand Karaj. As the puratan definition of a Sikh was anybody who would kneel down in humility before Guru Sahib. One grouping seeks to limit the definition of its adherents to as small a number as possible. Whilst Hindutva seeks to include anybody and everybody within it's fold in order to increase it's political strength. It's clear which will be triumphant in the long run if we do not immediately start to address this by accepting that the tens of millions of Gurdwara Sangat that are wrongly termed Hindu's nowadays are in fact sehajdhari Sikhs and encouraging greater acceptance of Kabirpanthi's, Ravidassia's, Satnami's, Sindhi's, Banjara's, Sikligars and other tribes and communities estranged from the Panth since 1849 to again feel part of an enlarged and stronger Sikh Panth more able to protect itself and project forward for Sarbat da Bhala.

Anand Karaj have been performed ever since Guru Nanak Dev Ji rejected the purohits, janam kundali's and various gods and godesses invoked in the average Hindu marriage rites. You are correct to point out that the original Nirankari forefathers (as the Amritdhari GurSikhs they were) rejected the lapse of ordinary Sikhs into Manuvadi influenced Hindu marriage rites. All Guru's married according to non-Hindu marriage rites. Sikhs are not particularly interested in the history presented by anti-Sikh historians in the employ of the Mughals or more recently the RSS or Arya Samaj (as for example Khemu Bedi). Of course GurSikh Darbara Singh was refused by Hindu Mahants more interested in reading Triya Charitar in 1861 British-controlled Amritsar. Well pointed out as always Jonny Paji. Gurdwara Kandh Sahib is testimony to the fact that Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj rejected false Hindu marraige rites. So circling around Bani is ridiculous but instead of the ancient pagan pre-Hindu tradition of circling around fire is not and is better in your view? Your "source" is one we don't accept. Much of Sikh history is passed down orally. We know what we believe. We know why you want to believe what you do. But if you suddenly think people will revert to Hindu marriage rites I really think you are very much mistaken! Within Sikh circles there is no doubt about the Sakhi where Guru Nanak Dev Ji rejected the whole concept and practise of janeu. You're welcome to wear a red string for being the high caste Hindu Rajput you are but why do you have such a problem with Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj having rejected it and most Sikhs similarly so? Exactly Jonny Paji So a red string janeu can have meaning to you as a Hindu but a defensive shastar such as kirpan or kara cannot to us Sikhs? A stone idol can have meaning to you as a Hindu but words in praise of Ik Onkar Akaal Purakh cannot have meaning to Sikhs? Pilgrimages including bathing at the Ganges have meaning to you as a Hindu but Sikhi's rejection of pilgrimages and emphasis on all castes in a locality bathing together in a pool of water is problematic to you? We don't care for Mughal paid historians who clubbed all Indian "kaffir" practises as being Hindu rites regardless of whether Jaini, Hindu, Buddhist or Sikh.

The best way to oppose Sher is by embracing 99% of Punjab's Khatri's and Brahmins as the sehejdhari Sikhs they are and to re-establish the puratan definition of a Sikh as anyone who bows before Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. The question is do we want lakhs of innocents dead or crores of new members of the Sikh Panth to advance all towards the aim of Sarbat Da Bhala for all humanity?

Well said as usual Jonny Paji GtLoc what you've stated is worse than anything Sher has ever stated on here. Regardless of his agenda, he has never condoned the murder of innocents (unlike those Indira worshippers that celebrated the events of June 1984). You've blanketly made a highly agressive anti-Sikh statement either deliberately to stir up the thread or out of conviction. If you said it rather flippantly then I hope you can retract the statement as it's a 100% anti-Sikh comment and it denigrates our (nirvair) Panth. You should also be aware that 99% of Punjab's Khatri's and Brahmins attend Gurdwara's and are in fact sehajdhari Sikhs. Presumably you would have killed Bhai Lehna Ji too? If you said it out of conviction ... you'll have to make at least Panj Piare shaheed to even get a scratch against a single innocent Hindu Punjabi as Sikhs in general and the Khalsa Panth in particular are committed to defending all innocents rather than the bogus rhetoric that you seem to think is cool. Our opponents love whay you have said as they want to see exactly the type of polarisation that can forestall one billion people joining the Sikh Panth. Your words betray that you are a Jatt first and a Jatt last - as Sikhs do not have anything against the entireity of any community on this planet. What's sad is that you don't realise that the image of Sikhs that our enemies want to portray is exactly the one you are representing. Nobody really hates you and certainly nobody wants you dead. Your views are objectionable imho but you have a right to believe them. Even where we disagree we should be mindful that there are bigger mutual enemies out there and should look to find common ground that can advance everyone's interests. Your views are highly helpful in enabling us to understand the mindset of those against Sikhs and we can constructively use your points to sharpen up our own positions and advance our Panth in the best way. The more people oppose the Panth, the easier it is to build Unity internally within our ranks, so I for one would not like to see you dead ... but rather to defect and join our ranks ... as Sikhi is the foremost opponent of terrorism ... and it's the only ideology that truly wants Sarbat Da Bhala. Well said as always Sikh Khoj Paji Every Sikh on this forum condemns idiotic nonsense of the type GtLoc has stated in relation to his own individual fantasies. Most of the silent majority have not bothered to dignify his utterly wrong comments. Amritdhari GurSikhs cannot carry out Wisconsin type outrages, as regardless of keeping kes or other signifiers, actions that go against the Khalsa Panth's ethos of service to all humanity and defending the weak and oppressed automatically mean that such anti-Sikh rogues are patit. Patit are those who are no longer fit to be known as Amritdhari. Thus you should be aware that Amritdhari GurSikhs can NEVER commit, support or endorse terrorism against innocents.

Brothers and sisters it's been a pleasure to be on this forum recently. My claim to fame is that I am N30Singh Paji's biggest "protestant reformist type wala" fan in cyberspace (i hope) :-) To see legends like Dal Singh Paji, Jonny Paji, Amarjeet Singh bir'ay, tonyhp32 Paji, Harsharan000 Kaur, Mehtab Singh, SikhKhoj Ji, DSG Singh, Lucky Paji and others on here that I'm familiar with is just brilliant. I'm from the UK, London to be specific and I like to hope that I am worthy of being called a poor example of a Sikh. The reason I have made the effort to post can be credited to our good friend - Sher. His posts motivated me to join. So Chardi Kala to him and all his family! Sikhs are meant to be nirvair as we all know (often though I often fail on that). My main reason for being on here is to see if others can be persauded to add their voice in support the following agenda: With the painful history of 1984 and the subsequent Genocide of Sikhs that occurred ... there's nothing we can do to turn back time now. However, 30 years on what we youth in the West can certainly do is set ourselves aims and objectives as members of the Sikh Panth to hit the following targets for Panthic upliftment by combatting drugs, alcohol, biraderi, infanticide, illiteracy, cancer and poverty. All bakhre bakhre Gurdware must be merged as soon as possible, if we seriously care about the future of our Panth. UK Sangat to raise £30 million plus by June 2014 Canadian Sangat to C$30 million plus by June 2014 American Sangat to raise $30 million plus by June 2014 Other Diaspora Countries Sangat should target $10million plus by June 2014 India-based Sangat could arguably raise R300crores plus by June 2014 And with an eventual target of national Panj Pyaaray representatives from each country handing over their respective nation Sangat's cheques to the SGPC for firewalled projects for Panthic Upliftment in combatting drugs, alcohol, infanticide, biraderi, illiteracy, cancer and poverty ... and every penny of the funds presented to SGPC in June 2014 being watched over by auditors to confirm that Badal Dal cannot access, use or waste a single penny of the funds raised by Sangat, thereby transforming SGPC into a clean saanjha charitable vehicle for the Upliftment of the Poor and management of United Gurdwara's as it was always intended. Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj must be translated into Tamil, Bengali, Oriya, Telugu, Swahili, Yoruba and all African languages etc to get the Truth of what Sikhi represents out there further. Rather than just remembering the past, we need to actively attack the current silent Genocide occuring via infanticide, drugs, cancer, illiteracy, biraderi and poverty. Let's hear every forum members idea's on how we actually make this happen. Let's all contact our local Sikh organisations and us as normal Sangat try spread this agenda like a virus! ------------------------------ Separately for UK Sikhs: We all know that the review by the Tories etc isn't even good enough (it's a damage limitation exercise). So we clearly need a minimum of £100million plus reparations (in the form of international development funding by the UK Government) ploughed into community projects in Punjab for the upliftment of poor Sikhs suffering illiteracy, cancer, infanticide, social discrimination, drugs, alcohol (and the surviving victims of the Genocide against Sikhs launched by Indira Gandhi and her son Rajiv) etc ... given the then UK Government's assistance in the Genocide against Sikhs. The Sikh Council UK, Kesri Lehar, Sikhs for Justice, Sikh Federation UK etc need to join hands to actively and aggressively lobby for this £100million compensation by June 2014 to mark 30years and we can push them on that. If we write in our hundreds to them, then they in turn will consider our input. The Department for International Development regularly doles out billions overseas (around £9billion globally last year) so the Sikh Qaum should be able to secure this if we try and we effectively lobby for it with one united voice as this is common sense. I do not advocate any fool burns the Union Jack as a way of getting our point across (as i suspect GOI will try defame us like that). Should we not succeed in getting Cameron to commit £100million to help those suffering various problems in Punjab etc we can always play our own part in making 2014 a year of meaningful progression for our Panth to mark 30 years of hurt by actively combatting the issues that affect our Qaum currently right here right now and are arguably a modern "silent" Genocide primarily self-inflicted. VJKK VJKF

Sikhs don't kill Hindu's as can be seen clearly from 1984. Sikhs as true Ravidassi's cannot kill themselves though Dera Ballan mobs employed by Congress have tried to instigate Sikhs (without success I may add). Dera Sirsa adherents have indeed killed Sikhs and Gurbachana of the Nirankari's did revel in his part in killing 13 Sikhs in 1978. The communist leadership of the Soviet Union fully supported Indira Gandhi's terrorist plans to murder thousands of innocent pilgrims on the Shaheedi Diwas of Guru Arjan Dev Ji Maharaj in 1984. Paji first off absolutely brilliant to see you posting here. Your anti-caste stance has always made me so proud of you as a fellow Sikh! I wish every single Sikh in the Diaspora had the same passion for kul nash that you do (and no Dal Singh didn't pay me to say this)! Paji re Kuldip Singh Manak ... even I'm close to Islam in as much as that I also believe in monotheism - doesn't make me Muslim and neither was KM - he genuinely rejected it and the support for slavery, peadophilia and rape in the Quran that goes with it and i believe it to be unfair that Muhammad Izhar Alam and others are trying to re-cast what the man believed in - the same Sikhi that inspired Banda Singh Bahadur Ji. As for those pathetic Jatt this Jatt that tunes ... i'm sure you're aware that the famous Muslim Jatt record label from Birmigham deliberately pimps those ... and sadly 315 years after 1699 we Sikhs still cannot see the wood from the trees to rise beyond such vile ignorance! Bir'ay don't believe the hype. That was nonsense authored by anti-Sikh authors to hoodwink us into believing that lie and thereby perpetuating the caste system within our ranks. The enemies of the Sikhs know that once we are 100% united our Panth will be unstoppable so please don't read into the narrative of anti-Sikh authors. Their lies are demolished by one simple glaring fact. Mata Gujjar Kaur Ji were of Gujjar ancestry. The spouses of our Guru Sahiban came from various ancestries but all were deliberately stated by Mughal and other anti-Sikh authors to be Khatri on the basis that a wife assumes a husband's caste upon marriage (despite the fact that we all know that our Guru Sahib had and have no caste). Case closed.