DSG

No problem Silence Ji Thanks for the reply ( good luck in your exams)

Piaree Sangat Ji Please provide any feed back , I surprised no one as responded , this unique event which is free , sangat ji , hopefully is making people aware about Sikhism as a Christian friend at the Abbey has been asking us for a long time , in particular about Sikh Music , hence this unique opportunity to see a 1200 year Abbey and top Sikh artists perform at such an ancient place , with Wahegurus Kirpa , the atmpshere/mood will be electrifying , lets pack out the place . I appreciate and understand if sangat ji has other committments , Kema dha ja chak hay Wahe Guru Ji ka khalsa Wahe Guru Ji ke fateh

Piaree sadh Sangat ji 16th May 2009 at Polesworth Abbey 6-7pm Tour of Abbey 7-9pm Performance [/size We are arranging a programme ( please see attached doc) at Polesworth Abbey regarding Healing Sounds of the Sikh Tradtion and A tour of the Abbey almost founded 1200 years ago . Top artitists from Raj Academy and Thames Valley University will perform raags according to the holy Sikh scripture using Taanti saag ( stringed instruments like Dilruba, Taus , sarode, sarangi ) and tabla ( Jori ) which is played more with open hands. The venue is free and food will also be provided , so please if you can attend ( yourself, family , friends ) ]Please let me know as there are limited seats available due to health and safety aspects we are only allocated X amount of seats at the Abbey. Poster_healing_sounds_of_sikh_tradition_.doc

Das very good post , the issue is not about eating meat , the issue is about performing jatka at one the Tackt Sahibs ( Hazur Sahib) and then taking the head of the goat into the gurudawara , to put tilak on the shastra - Come on is this right ? I dont think so You talking about notes included in the same composition , ( what you are taking about are Human made notes ) That is the biggest problem . The utmost truth , the highest of the high is sri Guru granth sahib ji , you cannot go wrong following it , reading it and practicing it - 100% guaranteed . The problem is when you bring I into the conversation which you have by writing I went to a concert , etc.. one string ... This is not follwoing sikhi or has nothing to do with sikhi , follwoing Sri Guru Granth Sahib is , we humans make up our own rules hence all the different sects , as Baba Hardev Singh Lulon wale said , sikhs fighting amongst sikhs , sikhs believing in dehdari sikhs , the solution is simple and all falsehoods can be abolished ... solution is everyone to take Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as there Guru believe it to be your Guru... quite simple. Another thing , why dont they recite japji sahib path for each of sastra they have , surely this would be more beneficial. It is not about enforcing our own notes , the notes we should enforce should be from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji . all the same notes where ever you are.

das Have you got more information on this i.e. chatka not allowed ( It should be completely banned) I was also speaking to someone , who read an article stating that someone from the states tried to oppose the jatkha "ceremony " , he got beaten up ( I'm trying to get hold of the article ) hopefully we can get enought proof to evict these people .

The article , doesnt really explain much as to the puropose of this un-called for jatka of a goat in the 21st century. It defies all the teachings of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji ( Animal rights acvtivists who see the video , I bet will not sit quietly ( i sincerely hope they dont , thtas if they see it) Do we whole heartdedly think , this is Sikhi ? ) Again as i mentioned before , WE MUST NOT COMPARE OURSELVES TO THE GURUS .. WE MUST NOT ) and that it was is being done now i..e Gurus use it hunt , Gurus use to perform jatka etc.. BUT they also laid down their lives . I personally believe this should be stopped , I dont know if anyone has tried this in the past , and what obstacles if any have they come across. what kind of message is this given to the youngsters ? When sri guru granth sahib is not respected , we call it beadbi , performing jatka in a Gurdawara isn't ?? This is wrong

That is totally totally wrong , what is the significance of killing the poor goat ? None what soever . Wheres the sharda in that , none what soever . Then taken the head of the goat into the gurudwara , naa man that is totally wrong. Lets think about it , you are there in the Gurdawara for 2 weeks , your at peace , enjoying the environment , becoming spirtually enlightened ........... then on the 15th day jatka is performed , and is witnessed by yourself ... I beleieve all the things mentioned above go out the window , you'll get sickening thoughts in your mind for weeks / years na that is wrong ... I was listening to Baba Hardev Singh LULon Wale ( very very good he is) I think he summed up jatka and meat very well, i.e. we as humans cannot contemplate why the 10th Master hunted animals , why jatka was carried out etc.. all that todays sikhs see is that , the "Gurus use to do it , so it cant be that bad " , but then he also added the 10th Master Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji's father Sri Guru Tegh Bahadhur Ji was beheaded , his 4 sons were matryed - Now how many of us Sikhs are willing to sacrifice our families I bet we know the answer to that . Then he added , dont go into these kind of areas , you'll definitely have to pay for the consequences , when your time comes. I still believe this is wrong .. , totally wrong

I have the CD , very good it is , however a slight downer in the sense i persoanlly think the giani is reciting bani too fast .

Sorry for being a bit negative here but how will planting a sapling make people aware of " save the girl child " ? I personally believe they need to organise events where people are educated , provide material to read stating opportunities for women , current women leaders , etc... The money could be spent more wisely.

Wahe Guru Ji ka khalsa Wahe Guru ji ke fateh I was speaking to someone from India who did katha whilst reciting the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji at berrievment not long back . I asked him the question about so much grief in the world , inoccent people dying , etc.. if its all under Gods control , why is there so much grief/sorrow in the World He explained to me that before we are born , spending 9 months in our mothers womb , we are hanging upside down . We are doing so much Bhagti , inside the womb wanting to come out into the world very quickly. During the 9 months , GOD makes a vow with us, that vow is , one day you will come back to me ( i.e. death) , you will not be in the World forever and most importantly you must remember GODs name at all times, when "released" Inside our mothers womb , ready to come out into the World we agree to all this , but when released into the world , some naam jap , some forget his name , some are in the middle etc.. So the decision making / free will is up to us whether we chose to follow it is our decision. I dont know how true this is , I havent researched the topic or whether its relevant to the topic discussed . I also believe we are trying too hard to find out all the answers as to the beauty of GODs creation and his thinking . We will never ever ever ever understand GODs thoughts / Idiology . Also talking about authenticity , how do you know the translations of sikh scriptures are authentic . We dont , they are our interpretations, interpretations of top scholars -

Its OK unbreakable , I respect your views , but if a NON-Sikh or even a sikh who is searching to find something to follow , and stumbles across the above article as its first read , dont you think it would encourage the person to find out more about the religion. I dont think its about being cool , the ultimate aim is to get approval from GOD , but you have to take the first step. Peoples own experiences into sikhy are probably different to the next persons , and it could be the simplest of things he/she has read/experienced that has entrigued them to find out more.

I thought it was quite positive and encouraging that they couldnt find any flaws in Sikhism - personally I dont think any religion is bad its the people who twist the meanings and make up their own rules

It does make a lot of difference , but I think the biggest issue is the judicial system in India . They have been getting away with delaying cases , giving false evidence ,etc.. for years and it pays if you know the right people and the biggest culprit is money talks . I think it does not a big shake from an external entity which has enough power to shake the judicial system from its roots , not just individual cases but the whole system itself

Sword of Tabriz if you say human efforts are nothing without correct guidance , and you say "gurbani unchanged , you beg to differ" How do you know the source for " correct guidance " isnt changing what ever there prophets/gurus have written down ? How do you know what they say is 100% accurate and authentic ? simple answer you dont ? only waheguru does ? If for arguments sake , what you say is true , what does that prove ? nothing , has it changed you -- no it hasnt The point being as said before is quite simple , we must act on our Gurus teachings ? We will never ever ever ever ever fully understand what our Guru is telling us , its our own / "guiders "interpretations which we accept .

Sword of Tabriz wrotes Interesting point , correct guidance from where ? or whom ?

Sword of Tabriz , it is quite simple , practice whatever religion you believe , understand the meaning of bani rather than going off topic and "trying" to pick faults ONLY WAHEGURU knows the truth ONLY WAHEGURU knows if the bani is suchi ONLY WAHEGURU knows if we are reciting bani correctly We on the other hand do our best to understand and practive bani , you could be here all year arguing your point what will it achieve- nothing if you act on Gurus words , change your inner self , it would be much better Dont get me wrong i'm no preacher , nor a scholar , keep it simple there are alot of things we dont know and make alot of assumptions , but the main point being WE NEED TO CLEANSE ourselves , We may have all the knowledge in the world , and prove others wrong this will only feed your ego , BUT if we dont practive and change its worthless

Let me add these are my opions only may be wrong may be right , firstly i believe the question you asked is a hyperthetical question because 1. Not everyone is blessed in being a khalsa , not everyone believes in God , not everyone practices religion. 2. The people who practice there religion , have something telling them inside , this is the path for them and then seek further knowledge by reading literature , doing 'path' , taking amirt etc.. 3. When one enters the religious path , he/she would not beat up his wife/husband , idol worship, stealing etc.. unless the person is only a sikh from the outside and not within. A person born into a sikh family does not make him/her a sikh , they have to be baptised , follow and practice the Gurus teaching

sorry for the late response Thankyou sangat ji To sum up , Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji does not mention anyting in particular about smoking but the rehit mariyada does , and the coinside with each other " Who started the rehit maryada ? Matheen / others , you mentioned about there are "sakhis " about smoking can you please provide further information

I was having a discussion with a colleague and he asked the following question Does it mention smoking is not allowed in the Sri Guru Granth Sahib I told him about intoxicants are forbidden , but specifically wanted to know about smoking Because intoxicants can be coffee and tea which contain caffeine , but we drink tea and coffee , but does smoking fall into the same catergory hence the question . wahe guru ji ka khalsa wahe gurur ji ke fateh

Dont get me wrong here i'm not trying to cause any negative vibes , its your decision and we respect that . The name change why Bahadur Ali Singh ?

Balbir Singh , its quite simple :- 1. If you belive in your "sub guru" , follow him/her 100% end of story , which obviously you dont thats what you are asking these questions. Does you "sub guru" know you are on these forums ? 2. If you have doubts in your mind , and want to know the truth , read the sri guru granth sahib , learn from the scholars on this forum . {ractive the teachings of the 10 gurus ? 3. If you are here just to earn points , then you'll be here on this forum for the rest of your life , achieving nothing just feeding your ego.

i personally believe its all politics , they are ridiculing the Sikh Religion , they dont want Sikhs to wake up, think for themselves , every time its negative vibes , sikhs are not tolerant , sikhs dont enourage freedom of speech etc.. etc.. You have a sikh prime minister of india , what is he doing or done to put this guy behind bars of his crimes ? The question is who is funding these DERA type people ? Who are giving them strength to open the DERAs ? Why aint Akal takt , educating the people who follow these DERA ? What are the DERAs offering the people ?

When justice is done , everything will come out in the open , and by wahegurus kirpa , - JUSTICE WILL BE DONE

I like the way "WE SIKHS" stick together I like the way "WE SIKHS" praise other sikhs come on guys , no one is perfect but at least he is trying , i went to couple of his kathas , i saw people doing mutha-take without him knowing , how can you stop these people , he even said dont mutha-take him , but this didnt stop certain people . Before katha started he asked the sangat , to approach him directly regarding the rumours being spread , and he would answer the queries. I personally believe , If we see someone doing something positive for the community,religion , we try and pick faults, also try to belittle the person rather than encouragement , why isnt there a discussion about the postives ? As the saying goes , out of a thousands tasks , one task was done wrong , rather than praising the 999 tasks , that 1 wrong task keeps propping up time and time again

For Sikh point of view , I think the main cause was the event that happened at Handsworth Park at the vasakhi mela. I cant blame them for banning the "sword" , the question is you have the council of sikh gurdwaras , what are they doing or have done in order to stop events like this happening ? Theres regular trouble and police involvement at a particular Gurdwara that provoked these events , whats been done about this ? If they are takeing positive action ,I think they are keeping it to themseleves , wheres the update?