Mithr

Just curious London da Jatt, but why do you do Maan in being a Jatt? It can't be anything to do with bravery or anakh and Izzat as I've already shown here that it was Sikhi not Jattness that has anakh, Izzat and bravery. So why this maan in being Jatt?

That was some good kirtan.

Jattboot is right, in the background it does sound something similar to saas graas. could some one please enlighten us about this? It does sound like there is a breathing technique involved.

In Sikh tradition, many words belonging to Hindus and Muslims have been redefined. If we take the meaning of each word that we use and define it according to how Hindus and Muslims define it, then that would be a huge mistake. We need to ponder upon what Shaheed means in the Sikh tradition rather than the Islamic tradition. A Shaheed Singh can only be a Singh who is Shaheed, the world “Singh” is inseperable from the word Shaheed in our tradition since both terms go togather like hand in glove. A Muslim or a Christian can be Shaheeds in their own respective traditions, but they cannot be considered “Shaheed Singhs” in the Sikh tradition since they are not “Singhs” to begin with.

The only Jat kingdom that were not Sikhs were the Jats of Bharatpur. Yes the Bharatpur Jats were a great people as well. But, they were pushed around and bullied by the Rajputs of Rajasthan who quite often tried to put these Jats in their place as Shudras. The Bharatpur Raja had to pay the Sikhs who at the time were in the area for help against the Rajputs. So the Hindu Jats were pushed around by the Rajputs, compare that to the Sikhs who would push around the Rajputs of Punjab. In Himachal Pardesh and Jammu the Rajput chiefs were all under the heel of various Sikh misls. In Malwa area, the Patiala Sikhs took most of their land from Bhatti Rajputs. Sikh were not pushed around by anyone whether they were Mughals, Pathans, Rajputs or Gurkhas. Even Jihadis who during the first Wahabi Jihad in recorded history lead by Shaheed Syed Ahmad Barelvi lost from the Sikh forces who were outnumbered by the Jihadis in the North West Frontier. Sikhs fought triumphantly against all South Asian powers they faced. It took the super power of the time the mighty British army to defeat the Sikhs who were just a small minority in Punjab The Muslim Jats don't really have any great history worth mentioning except for maybe Ranjha and Mirza Jatt. The Hindu Jats have a history of being bullied around by Rajputs. The ONLY reason Sikh Jatts have it different from their counter parts is because of them following the Guru's path. We only have Anakh and Izzat and a proud unrivalled history because of Guru Gobind Singh Jee. Being Jatt simply means NOTHING if you compare Jatts with other so called martial races like the pathans, Rajputs, Marathas and gurkhas.

Acknowledging the fact that you're a Jatt is okay as long as one does not feel pride in being a Jatt. Guru Gobind Singh Jee gave Jatts Sardari. If you look at our Jatt counter parts in the Muslim and Hindu communities, it just comes to prove that we were not born with Sardari. Sardari, Ankh, Izzat was given to us only because we were followers of Guru Gobind Singh Jee. Without the Gurmat factor, we are no different than the Hindu or Muslim Jatts. I was once reading a Sakhi in Suraj Parkash long ago. A Sikh once asked Guru Gobind Singh Jee as to why you are giving Sardari to the lowly Jatts, Tarkhans, Chimbay etc instead of the high born Rajputs of the Shivalik? Guru Gobind Singh Jee answered that “If I give Sardari to the Rajputs of the Shivalik, then tomorrow when they conquer large territories they will become proud and say they are great conquerors because they are Rajputs, and not acknowledge the role of the Guru in their triumph. But If I give Sardari to the lowly Sikhs like the Jats, Takhans etc they will always recognise the fact that it was the Guru’s Kirpa that turned them into the masters of the land." Today, I see so many ungrateful Jatts who have now become so proud of their Jattness that they dare to claim that they became great because of their Jattness, while not acknowledging the fact that it was only and ONLY because of Guru Gobind Singh Jee's kirpa that we became masters of Punjab against all odds. Sometimes I think that the only reason why Sikhs are in the sorry state that they are now in is because we have abandoned the ways of our Gurus. All of our boys especially Jats are cutting their hair, our girls especially the Jattis want clean shaven boys completely forgetting the sacrifices our Guru made for us. Such ungrateful people we are! We as Jats have nothing to be proud of. The only thing we have to be proud of is that Guru Gobind Singh Jee is our Master, and we should feel VERY proud to be his humble slaves.

Thank you for this very informative post Matheen.

No religion starts off as tribalistic, but eventually all religion turn tribalistic. It's unavoidable if you look at Sikh history the way Sikhs were persecuted during the 1700s. During the times of Zakriya Khan and Mir Mannu, it was literally a crime to be a Sikh and the penalty for being a Sikh was death. It's things like that make you tribalistic in nature. Then after such severe persecution the Sikh minority of Punjab who were just a mere 7% of Punjab's total population came out triumphantly to rule Punjab against all odds. This type of history gives us a sense of being special and Nyara. Our history is unrivalled by another other community in the South Asian subcontinent or even the world in my opinion.

I've said this before and saying it again. Without Sikhi, Punjabi Jats are NOTHING. The Jatts in Pakistan whose ancestors were forced to accept Islam speak for themselves. The Hindu Jatts although have a proud history, but they get victimised by the Rajputs in Rajasthan. Why is the Sikh Jatt so different? it's only because of Sikhi. Without Sikhi, we would have been nothing. Long ago before Sikhi, the Pathans would invade India and carry away our women and Jatt Anakh and Izzat didn't mean $hit to the Pathans. But Guru Gobind Singh Jee changed all that. We didn't get victimised by Pathans like the ancestors of Muslim Jatts, nor do we get victimised by the Rajputs like Hindu Jatts do. Now we have Annakh and Izzat, not because of our Jattness but because of our King, Sri Guru Gobind Singh Jee. It really makes me laugh seeing Jatts feeling so proud of being Jatt. Being a Jatt doesn't stop a Pathan from victimising you. But being a Sikh of Guru Gobind Singh does. We need to be proud firstly of being Sikhs of Dasam Patshah. All other things are secondary and worldly, and in the bigger picture of things seems very small.

Wasn't it Bhai Mani Singh Jee who made it into a single Granth?

What black list are you guys talking about? is there an online site I can see this black list if it even exists? But I agree with alot of you. Sikhawareness is the best. I think that Sikhsangat is full of small kids who get angry very easily.

Actually Shaheediya is right. The first vaar of Bhai Gurdas Jee can answer all your questions as to why Gurmat was started in this world and why Guru Nanak Dev Jee had to take avtar in Kaliyug. LondonDaJatt, if the Guru Jyot didn't bring about something to Humanity, then why did they take avtar in this world for? SatGuru Jee is essential for us as humans. Parmatma is Gurprasaad, unless of course you beleive in some alternative Guru. Gurmat is a Nyara path for humanity. Please read Bhai Gurdas Dhiya Varaa and Bhattaa De Svayai on this matter.

I like Qawali music. But I don't think that we have any Qawali style kirtan. But Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan Ji did some Shabds. In Qawali, people clap while doing Qawali, but in Sikh traditions, claping is not encouraged. Instead we use chimte and shanay.

amazing Tabla player. Love the way he plays it.

The Sheesh is better than the Guru!

That was some very informative stuff. Thanks for sharing it.

I'm not knowledgable in Viakaran, but long ago I read a book by Bhai Randhir Singh Jee called Sant Padh Nirnai. In that book he has written that the word Sant is used depending on the context of the Shabd to Guru, individual Sikh or Sangat.

Have you ever read Giani Narain Singh Jee's steeks on Dasam Granth? Those were really worth reading. But I guess who better to do steek of the Birrassi Dasam Bani than a Nihang Singh. What's the Nihang Singh's name? I also want to get those steeks now. Does Buddha Dal have an official steek of Dasam Granth that they endorse?

I've heard from another Singh that if you talk to the book store owner, he can usually agree to arrange shiping your books straight to the country you live in. So you might not have to put anything in your luggage.

Arent those the same people who prevent Guru Maharaj's sroop from going to marriage palaces? If so FetehSingh Jee, what exactly is wrong with that?

Sikh sangat and tapoban were on a blacklist??? and what is R4G? is that a discussion forum?

Jattboot, Common! how are Radhaswamis, Bhanyarawala and Ram Rahim minority and victims? Although we have our differences with the Radhaswamis, but at least they are a peaceful people, who I might add don't get harrassed in Punjab by hardcore Singhs. But the Bhanyarawala and Ram Rahim themselves tried to mess with the Sikhs which is why they faced a violent backlash. They are no victims. The Radhaswamis are smart. They have seen what happens when you mess with Sikhs. They see the examples of Bhanyarawala and the recent violent clash between the Ram Rahim Dera and Sikhs. Radhaswamis in comparison are most active at the heartland of militant type Sikhs i.e. Majha area. The fact that Radhaswami deras are all over Punjab and especially Majha is proof they are not a persecuted bunch. But yes, we oppose them because they misuse Gurbani to support their DehDhari GuruGadhi, but they are not persecuted. Many people don't know this, but the Ram Rahim Dera and the Noormahalia Dera of Ashutosh are an offshoot of the Radhaswami beas dera, just as DhirMalias and RamRaiyas were an off shoot of the Sikhs.

Most Sikh youth during their teenage years are sometimes very enthusiastic. But those same Sikh youth who are very over enthusiastic are usually the ones who don't have any Amritvela, listen to western or Kala music, don't read their Nitnem daily. Basically they are no different from their Mona counter parts in terms of their jeevan. They are Sikh by appearence rather then lifestyle. But most grow out of it, and focus on religious matters once they enter their 20s. But the Khalistani Bujurgs are real villains. Although I respect the Shaheeds, but the Khalistani Bujurgs who live in western countries are the biggest villains I have seen. These guy are the biggest supporters of Kala Afghana in the west because they happen to be so Hindu phobic and plus they are the biggest opponents of Dasam Bani and Sikh traditions.

The old Nishan Sahib's did not have a Khanda on it. The old ones had some weapon maybe a kattar or a dagger symbol. During the Singh Sabha movement, the Khanda symbol became very popular because it combined 3 traditional Sikh weapons into one i.e. The Chakra, the Khanda sword and two Kirpans swords towards the side. Personally I don't see anything negative about the Khanda symbol. It doesn't really go against Sikh traditions, in fact I would say that it's in line with Sikh traditions, which is why even many non Singh Sabha groups like the Damdami Taksal also support this symbol on their Nishan Sahib at Mehta.

No good books about Sikhi in English. Most if not all are written for the western audience trying to make Sikhi look like a very scientific religion completely empty of spirituality. But one man by the name of Surinder Singh Kohli has written a number of excellent books on Sikhi in various topics. I would suggest his books.