amardeep Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 A very popular 19th century British newspaper, Tit-Bits, made a comparative analysis of great generals of the world and arrived at the following conclusion: Some people might think that Napoleon was a great General. Some might name Marshall Hendenburgh, Lord Kitchener, General Karobzey or Duke of Wellington etc. And some going further might say Halaku Khan, Genghis Khan, Changez Khan, Richard or Allaudin etc. But let me tell you that in the North of India a General of the name of Hari Singh Nalwa of the Sikhs prevailed. Had he lived longer and had the sources and artillery of the British, he would have conquered most of Asia and Europe…." 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 A very popular 19th century British newspaper, Tit-Bits, made a comparative analysis of great generals of the world and arrived at the following conclusion: Some people might think that Napoleon was a great General. Some might name Marshall Hendenburgh, Lord Kitchener, General Karobzey or Duke of Wellington etc. And some going further might say Halaku Khan, Genghis Khan, Changez Khan, Richard or Allaudin etc. But let me tell you that in the North of India a General of the name of Hari Singh Nalwa of the Sikhs prevailed. Had he lived longer and had the sources and artillery of the British, he would have conquered most of Asia and Europe…." If only he were alive during the Anglo Sikh wars. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSD1 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 (edited) At the battle of Chillianwallah in the Second Anglo Sikh War, one of Hari Singh Nalwa's sons led a cavalry charge that crushed the British right flank. If the sikh empire had been more organised we would have stuck the great general Hari Singh Nalwa in a military academy and let each year's students pick his brains so that we would have had hundreds of officers like him, similar to how european and americans spread knowledge amongst their military. Instead we sent him every time there was trouble, almost making it inevitable that he would end up dead. The plotting of the afghans, dogras and brits didnt help either. Edited January 7, 2011 by HSD 2 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 At the battle of Chillianwallah in the Second Anglo Sikh War, one of Hari Singh Nalwa's sons led a cavalry charge that crushed the British right flank. I think his name was Jwala Singh Nalwa. Let's not forget how whitey took his jagir away afterwards and probably gave it to some arse licking, cooperative 'son of a farmer'. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 (edited) My bad, his name was Jawahir Singh. Notice how his name gets pretty much wiped off the slate of our itihaas post wasp intrusion. Edited January 7, 2011 by dalsingh101 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 I think his name was Jwala Singh Nalwa. Let's not forget how whitey took his jagir away afterwards and probably gave it to some arse licking, cooperative 'son of a farmer'. you mean Jat? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSD1 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 My bad, his name was Jawahir Singh. Notice how his name gets pretty much wiped off the slate of our itihaas post wasp intrusion. All the more reason to spread what little we know. As well as him there are many others who are even more unknown as they didnt have such important fathers. At least his parts of Jawahir Singh's story survive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 All the more reason to spread what little we know. As well as him there are many others who are even more unknown as they didnt have such important fathers. At least his parts of Jawahir Singh's story survive. You should get that new book by Sidhu, he goes a top rate job on the first war with the wasps. Although he could've put the boot into their imperialist motives and bullshit a bit more. Still, it's better than all the whitewashed accounts by Gough etc. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSD1 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 You should get that new book by Sidhu, he goes a top rate job on the first war with the wasps. Although he could've put the boot into their imperialist motives and bullshit a bit more. Still, it's better than all the whitewashed accounts by Gough etc. Lol, I got that book a month ago and read it straight away till I finished the whole thing which was a few hours as it is not that long. I was going to dig it out this weekend and write a proper review on the thread you posted. I agree that the book isnt encyclopeadic enough, but it is a start at a Khalsa orientated history in non-punjabi languages and a very good one at that. I was surprised the author talked about the Geiji period of Japan as I have often talked about the similarities in the history of Japan and Punjab in the last of 2/3 centuries of european 'enlightenment', but most people told me to shut up. Not so smart now are they? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 7, 2011 Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 Lol, I got that book a month ago and read it straight away till I finished the whole thing which was a few hours as it is not that long. I was going to dig it out this weekend and write a proper review on the thread you posted. I agree that the book isnt encyclopeadic enough, but it is a start at a Khalsa orientated history in non-punjabi languages and a very good one at that. I was surprised the author talked about the Geiji period of Japan as I have often talked about the similarities in the history of Japan and Punjab in the last of 2/3 centuries of european 'enlightenment', but most people told me to shut up. Not so smart now are they? Definitely do that review. The author is current doing the sequel on the lion-wasp war part 2. I hope he doesn't sell out and take the easy 'whiteys apologist' route with it. Cunningham called a white spade a spade, so there is no excuse for our guys to pussy out in this respect. Fingers crossed x lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted January 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2011 A quick question: When did the first "sikh state" appear? I've always thought it was with Maharaja Ranjit Singh but sometimes it seems like there already were sikh kingdoms here and there during the mid 1700 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyhp32 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 I think his name was Jwala Singh Nalwa. Let's not forget how whitey took his jagir away afterwards and probably gave it to some arse licking, cooperative 'son of a farmer'. After the Anglo-Sikh war Jawahir Singh Nalwa was one of the first to join the British against the mutineers in 1857 and fought in UP in command as the Senior Native Officer 1st Sikh cavalry. He took part in 18 encounters with the enemy. After the mutiny he was given a Rs 12,000 per annum jagir and became a honorary magistrate at Gujranwala. Sorry to burst your anti-imperialist bubble but Jawahir Singh and other Sikhs knew that the Sikh interests lay with supporting the British and not in sitting back or actively supporting the resurrection of the Mughal empire! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyhp32 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 A quick question: When did the first "sikh state" appear? I've always thought it was with Maharaja Ranjit Singh but sometimes it seems like there already were sikh kingdoms here and there during the mid 1700 The first Sikh state though short lived was in the time of Banda Singh Bahadur around 1710AD until his shaheedi. In most of the history books Sikh sovereignity is usually shown as having been lost until the Misls started to divide the Punjab between themselves in the 1760s. But a decade after Banda Singh, Ala Singh started to carve up his own kingdom in the Patiala area. Other branches of Ala Singh's family carved up areas in Faridkot-Mansa-Bathinda area into minor kingdoms which later became the Sikh states which were dissolved in 1948. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) Sorry to burst your anti-imperialist bubble but Jawahir Singh and other Sikhs knew that the Sikh interests lay with supporting the British and not in sitting back or actively supporting the resurrection of the Mughal empire! Thanks for letting me know. If true, he's definitely off my 'heroes list' now. Actually some evidence for your assertion would be nice. Plus what the hell are you? A pro Anglo-imperialism jatt? Edited January 8, 2011 by dalsingh101 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSD1 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 Well Jawahir Singh did have problems with inheriting his father's land after Hari Singh Nalwa died, so it's no surprise the British would have offered him what he wanted in order to get him on side. That's what their good at. As for the Mutiny, we all know that many sikhs hated the mughals/hindustanis as the East India Company's army was 70-90% indian. Many of them saw the mutineers as the same people who had attacked the Punjab. Add to that the way the British threw the warped Sau Sakhi around that the sikhs were destined to join the British in order to destroy the Mughal Empire, it's little surprise that so many of the heroes of the Anglo-Sikh wars ended up fighting for the British in the Mutiny. I think the book 'Warrior Saints' that came out a few years ago had more examples of singhs who made a name for themselves fighting the afghans or brits were heavily involved in suppressing the mutiny. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted January 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 Thank you for that tony... Interesting posts, i've never heard of Ala Singh. Do you have any good books you would recommend ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyhp32 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 Thanks for letting me know. If true, he's definitely off my 'heroes list' now. Actually some evidence for your assertion would be nice. Plus what the hell are you? A pro Anglo-imperialism jatt? So he would have been your hero had be fought against the British and supported the resurrected Mughal empire? If he and other think Sikhs have been a blind to Sikh interests at the time as you seem to be then we would probably have Punjab today as a province of the Mughal empire with some descendent of the effeminate Bahadur Shah as emperor. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyhp32 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 Thank you for that tony... Interesting posts, i've never heard of Ala Singh. Do you have any good books you would recommend ? This book contains the background to the Phulkian States. Ala Singh's life story is contained within the chapters about Patiala state. http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ZEkBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA28&dq=ala+singh&hl=en&ei=pdIoTZOTNtK7hAfgq-jrCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=ala%20singh&f=false 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 This book contains the background to the Phulkian States. Ala Singh's life story is contained within the chapters about Patiala state. http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ZEkBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA28&dq=ala+singh&hl=en&ei=pdIoTZOTNtK7hAfgq-jrCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=ala%20singh&f=false Another good source is Hari Raam Gupta's history of the Sikhs 5 volume set. It contains some well researched info on the Phulkian states. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 So he would have been your hero had be fought against the British and supported the resurrected Mughal empire? If he and other think Sikhs have been a blind to Sikh interests at the time as you seem to be then we would probably have Punjab today as a province of the Mughal empire with some descendent of the effeminate Bahadur Shah as emperor. You and I both know that Moghuls were a spent force by then. In anycase forget history, it is abject Anglo arselicking by apnay today that is something we can do something about. Just stop doing it. That Jatt inferiority complex thing to goray must stop before you become their he-bitches of choice again. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zulu Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) Add to that the way the British threw the warped Sau Sakhi around that the sikhs were destined to join the British in order to destroy the Mughal Empire Hi HSD, could you elaborate for me what you mean regarding the sau sakhi? Do you mean the British gave light to a 'fake' sau sakhi to divide the sikhs? for example the Namdhari sau sakhi which they believe in? in that way? Sorry If I have said anything wrong. Edited January 12, 2011 by zulu 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amardeep Posted January 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 Hahaha come on dal singh please stop your jatt crusade in every topic where tony writes something ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 No way Amardeep! I'm doing the polar opposite to what you instigated earlier when you said you were going to work in the word 'jat' into whatever you can at every opportunity. lol To balance things out, I'm going to put the boot into the white arse licking, jumped up, rapist peasants at will. It's ying and yang. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 That Jatt inferiority complex thing to goray must stop before you become their he-bitches of choice again. DalSingh brother, why do you need to put an entire caste down? you always seem to be attacking Jats for this reason or another. Everyone has some bias about the other caste except their own, but that doesn't mean our bias views are reality, how would you like it if someone attacks your caste here repeatedly for some reason or the other? Ass licking of the west is not a problem of Jats or Tarkhans or Khatris alone. It is a problem of all our people. To single out a single caste for all our problems big or small is hateful and malicious. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalsingh101 Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 There must be balance in the force.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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