Genie Singh Posted September 7, 2011 Report Share Posted September 7, 2011 WJKK WJKFji According to some scholars Dasam granth was taken out of akal takht in 1940s and it was understood that this establishes raj yog for the sikh panth. For whatever reason the sgpc and all 5 takhts agree that dasam granth is bani, and that only a sikh can believe it anyone who challenges it is tankhian. There will never be khalsa raj until dasam granth is put back in akal takht. What can we do to have dasam granth put back into the akal takht? WJKK WJKFji 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satgyan-pujari Posted September 10, 2011 Report Share Posted September 10, 2011 (edited) WJKK WJKFji According to some scholars Dasam granth was taken out of akal takht in 1940s and it was understood that this establishes raj yog for the sikh panth. For whatever reason the sgpc and all 5 takhts agree that dasam granth is bani, and that only a sikh can believe it anyone who challenges it is tankhian. There will never be khalsa raj until dasam granth is put back in akal takht. What can we do to have dasam granth put back into the akal takht? WJKK WJKFji Good question veerji, maybe the Singh Sabha Reformist Sikhs can shed some light on the reasons and causes of these events, and what actions should be implemented to reverse them. Edited September 10, 2011 by Satgyan-pujari 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 11, 2011 Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 (edited) Good question veerji, maybe the Singh Sabha Reformist Sikhs can shed some light on the reasons and causes of these events, and what actions should be implemented to reverse them. They dont need to shed light on anything, they have already made their decision, what we need to do is start a program to work towards restoration of Sri Dasam Granth Sahib, sheddong light on why it should be there. It can be done, for 2 decades at least no tanti saaj was played regularly in Sri Darbar Sahib, but now it is played very regularly, because some Sikhs who were promoting Gurmat Sangeet met with the Jathedaars and requested a program for tanti-saaj to be introduced again to Sri Darbar Sahib. The Jathedaars of the 2 Takht Sahib should take a step in getting this done. If Sri Dasam was restored to Sri Akal Takht Sahib, then it would go a long way to countering the nuisance of anti-dasam fools. Edited September 11, 2011 by chatanga1 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted September 11, 2011 Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 Good question veerji, maybe the Singh Sabha Reformist Sikhs can shed some light on the reasons and causes of these events, and what actions should be implemented to reverse them. I'm not a reformist, but I can tell you the perspective of the the Singh Sabhiyas on this issue. The Singh Sabhiyas were Dasam Granth supporters, we know this from their writings. But the question is why did they not support doing Parkash of Sri Dasam Granth at Akal Takht. The reason is because the Dasam Bani was originally in separate pothis. It was composed into a single Granth by Bhai Mani Singh Jee. So from this we can deduce that Dasam Bani in the form of a single Granth (Dasam Granth) was not there during the time of Guru Gobind Singh Jee even though Dasam Bani was in existence in separate pothis. So doing Prakash of Dasam Granth alongside with SGGSJ can be seen is an innovation by Sikhs. Being a supporter of Sri Dasam Granth does not automatically make you a supporter of doing Prakash of Dasam Granth. You can be a staunch Dasam Granth supporter and not support such innovations. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 11, 2011 Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 So doing Prakash of Dasam Granth alongside with SGGSJ can be seen is an innovation by Sikhs. yes brother, but this was accepted by Guru-Panth centuries ago, with no argument until recent times. I have personally thought that the Singh-Sabha did not fully understand the intricacies of Sri Dasam Granth Sahib, and this can be seen by their version of Benti Chaupee, which ends on verse 25, because verse 26 begins " kirpa karo hum par Jag Mata", and they have taken this to mean the Goddess. Only upto verse 25 is read in Sri darbar Sahib. I think that as some hindu-phobics get scared by the chaubis avtar, some scholars got scared of certain words in Sri Dasam and cut it in places as seen in Benti Chaupee. The tat gyan of such granths comes from the samprdayes or taksal, and i dont think the Singh Sabha scholars were from any of these. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 11, 2011 Report Share Posted September 11, 2011 The reason is because the Dasam Bani was originally in separate pothis. Ive just been looking at Patshahi 10 org (in your signature) and they have on that a bir of Sri Dasam from 1698, which is naturally excluding zafarnama, and mitr pyare nu, as they chronologically came years later. So was Sri Dasam in pothis only, or were there a handful of saroops here and there? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) yes brother, but this was accepted by Guru-Panth centuries ago, with no argument until recent times. It was accepted, but it is an innovation none the less. Personally, my view is that I'm not for or against it. I have personally thought that the Singh-Sabha did not fully understand the intricacies of Sri Dasam Granth Sahib, and this can be seen by their version of Benti Chaupee, which ends on verse 25, because verse 26 begins " kirpa karo hum par Jag Mata", and they have taken this to mean the Goddess. Only upto verse 25 is read in Sri darbar Sahib. I think that as some hindu-phobics get scared by the chaubis avtar, some scholars got scared of certain words in Sri Dasam and cut it in places as seen in Benti Chaupee. This is a common misconception about why Singh Sabhiyas did not read Kirpa Kari ham par Jag Mata when reading Choupi Sahib. The reason they don't read it is because the subject matter from 1 to 25 is the same. It changes from 26th pouri where it is clearly referring to Charitro Pakhyan Granth. While Choupi Sahib is a part of Charitro Pakhyan in Sri Dasam Granth, but it was composed separately. I beleive there is even a Gurdwara in existence where Chaupi Sahib was composed. This is similar to Zafarnama which although is a part of the Hakayats in Sri Dasam Granth, but it was composed separately from the Hikayats. Edited September 13, 2011 by Mithar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithar Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 Ive just been looking at Patshahi 10 org (in your signature) and they have on that a bir of Sri Dasam from 1698, which is naturally excluding zafarnama, and mitr pyare nu, as they chronologically came years later. So was Sri Dasam in pothis only, or were there a handful of saroops here and there? As per traditional Sikh history, Sri Dasam Granth was composed into a single volume by Bhai Mani Singh Jee. I don't know about the authenticity of how old that Granth is. But it may be possible that some Sikh may have composed it into a single granth earlier but it was not prevalent otherwise why would Bhai Mani Singh Jee have to painstakingly do the job himself. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipledgeblue Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 They dont need to shed light on anything, they have already made their decision, what we need to do is start a program to work towards restoration of Sri Dasam Granth Sahib, sheddong light on why it should be there. It can be done, for 2 decades at least no tanti saaj was played regularly in Sri Darbar Sahib, but now it is played very regularly, because some Sikhs who were promoting Gurmat Sangeet met with the Jathedaars and requested a program for tanti-saaj to be introduced again to Sri Darbar Sahib. The Jathedaars of the 2 Takht Sahib should take a step in getting this done. If Sri Dasam was restored to Sri Akal Takht Sahib, then it would go a long way to countering the nuisance of anti-dasam fools. Perhaps it is only the Akalis Nihangs that can do this job? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted September 13, 2011 Report Share Posted September 13, 2011 Perhaps it is only the Akalis Nihangs that can do this job? perhaps, but unlikely. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Isn't the use of electricity, lights, coolers, fans, televisions, mics, cameras, a/c in gurdwaras innvoation as well? We need to move forward take the past and move with it into the future to define it. Dasam Bani can be done prakash in a separate room or have a border set up then. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipledgeblue Posted December 19, 2011 Report Share Posted December 19, 2011 they will destroy the kshatri dharam in the panth by removing Dasam Granth Sahib! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted December 19, 2011 Report Share Posted December 19, 2011 they will destroy the kshatri dharam in the panth by removing Dasam Granth Sahib! The main ones who will destroy Kshatri dharam in the panth are the Kshatris themselves, by acting like they are Kshatris and not Kshatris when it suits them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 19, 2011 Report Share Posted December 19, 2011 The main ones who will destroy Kshatri dharam in the panth are the Kshatris themselves, by acting like they are Kshatris and not Kshatris when it suits them. Priceless comment...parchand sat !!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaikaara Posted December 19, 2011 Report Share Posted December 19, 2011 the kshatris had foresaken kshatri dharam and the Khalsa had to input the kshatri dharam into all. the kshatris r the most usless creatures since they twirl their moustaches in front of the the castes which they consider lower and offer their daughers to the turaks so that they can keep their joy and merry making gonig on . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipledgeblue Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 The main ones who will destroy Kshatri dharam in the panth are the Kshatris themselves, by acting like they are Kshatris and not Kshatris when it suits them. is that the ones who dress like kshatris and then tell everyone off for not being vegeterian? Or maybe the kshatris that need half an hour to take the kirpans out of their gatras if the situation arises. Ah, there are many kshatris that either behave like they are brahmin, or a mix of confusion! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatanga1 Posted December 25, 2011 Report Share Posted December 25, 2011 yes those you have mentioned and those, who, on seeing and hearing about oppression, prefer to keep silent. The Sikh should have a perfect blend of all 4 varans ie 25% in his persona. Of course some veer towards Brahman a lot, as that is what is being promoted as true Sikhi, but like yourself, i believe that Sikhs should promote and nurture the Kshatriya lifestyle as equal. The thing is that these Brahman type Sikhs look to you Kshatriya type sikhs to do something when oppression occurs. The Sikh character: 25% Brahman - worship of Sri Akal, study etc 25% Kshatrita - practising arms, defend the oppressed etc 25% Vaish- work honestly, and fairly 25% Shudra - to do sewa with honest heart. nowadays what do you think it is? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matheen Posted January 5, 2012 Report Share Posted January 5, 2012 When was the last time 'Kshatriya type Sikhs like' stood up and fought against oppression of their brothers, or their own?! As long as we keep working on ourselves, trying to follow Guru Ji's Sikhshya, then there is hope that things will go right, with Guru Ji's kirpa. As long as we follow our minds desires, we will lack Guru Ji's kirpa and nothing will happen. It only took 1 Pyara of Guru Ji to shake the oppressive Indian Govt' to the core in the late 70s and early 80s. Imagine what a handful can do? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Singh Posted January 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) You know the kshatriyas are now who you call bhappa and remember the ancestors of the gurus all came from khatri background. Many kshyatrias were politicians trying to marry turks for diplomatic reasons which did backfire to some extent. The thing was Islam was too new with new philosophy that couldn't match the age of hinduism. Well in reality all of the castes were only human, people acted as such in accordance to the environment they were brought up in, also taking into consideration the knowledge they had, it was a time before encyclopedias and the internet, if only they had encarta, they were only writing encyclopedias then. Edited January 5, 2012 by JatherdarSahib 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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