Women Who Want A Son..

[CdnSikhGirl]

You guys are posting matter of factly like it's ok to advocate wanting only sons... isn't this what our Gurus actually spoke against??? Shouldn't we be advocating for children of either gender?  It's these exact things which precipitate females being seen as inferior, ultimately causing things like infanticide, ill treatment of girls etc.  I can't believe you are all speaking of ways to obtain sons over daughters like it's perfectly ok and normal.  I think it's actually kind of sickening... 

And if any of it actually worked, Punjabi culture would have birthed itself out of existence long ago.  

Edited November 15, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[SAadmin]

Pappiman, its about time you take your bhramin-punjabi tribal penduism rubbish somewhere else. Importance of having son over daughter may be significant during monarchy time for survival of kingdom but it has no significance in sikhi and today's time. 

[paapiman]

4 hours ago, N30 S!NGH said:

Pappiman, its about time you take your bhramin-punjabi tribal penduism rubbish somewhere else. Importance of having son over daughter may be significant during monarchy time for survival of kingdom but it has no significance in sikhi and today's time. 

Paaji yaar, Daas is providing references from sources. The above two granths were written by saints. Daas did not specify the above shabads for obtaining sons.

When did Daas say that a son is more important than a daughter in this topic?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited November 15, 2015 by paapiman

[dalsingh101]

2 hours ago, N30 S!NGH said:

Pappiman, its about time you take your bhramin-punjabi tribal penduism rubbish somewhere else. Importance of having son over daughter may be significant during monarchy time for survival of kingdom but it has no significance in sikhi and today's time. 

Yep, you're going to get what you are going to get. Waheguru's hukam. 

 

Plus how many apnay have completely fudhoo sons, druggie or dumb as hell. Plenty of people I've met lament their sons, so it isn't always 'lottery lag gee!' when you have them. 

Edited November 15, 2015 by dalsingh101

[CdnSikhGirl]

1 hour ago, paapiman said:

Paaji yaar, Daas is providing references from historical sources. The above two granths were written by saints. Daas did not specify the above shabads for obtaining sons.

When did I say that a son is more important than a daughter in this topic?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

What does that Saint say to do in order to obtain a daughter?  Oh that's right... nobody truly *wants* daughters...

[mahanpaapi]

Baba Nand Singh Ji Maharaj and Baba Isher Singh Ji Maharaj Nanaksar Kaleran repeatedly emphasized that a grishti should have doodh (home survival needs such as food, housing and shelter etc) and poot (a son), whether one understands what that means or like it not, that is entirely different. In fact they both blessed numerous families with both dodo and poot.

 

 

[Koi]

Question :

If EVERYONE gets a son, ergo there are no daughters.........what happens next? 

[dalsingh101]

11 minutes ago, Koi said:

Question :

If EVERYONE gets a son, ergo there are no daughters.........what happens next? 

Rampant homosexuality!

[CdnSikhGirl]

1 hour ago, mahanpaapi said:

Baba Nand Singh Ji Maharaj and Baba Isher Singh Ji Maharaj Nanaksar Kaleran repeatedly emphasized that a grishti should have doodh (home survival needs such as food, housing and shelter etc) and poot (a son), whether one understands what that means or like it not, that is entirely different. In fact they both blessed numerous families with both dodo and poot.

 

 

This is horrible!!! 

[paapiman]

There is a Shabad (whose Jaap can be done) to obtain a child (male or female). The above two shabads can be used to obtain a son (male child) and this topic is related to a son.

There is nothing wrong, if a Sikh woman desires to have a son. Even, Mata Ganga jee (mother of Satguru jee) wanted a son.

Examples of anti-Gurmat activities:

• Heinous crime of Female infanticide (either in the womb or when the child is born)
• Discriminating against (or looking down upon) a female child
• Discriminating against (or looking down upon) a woman, who has given birth to a female child
• Physically assaulting, either the female child, or the woman who has given birth to that child (using female child birth as a reason)
• Not accepting Almighty God's will

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[CdnSikhGirl]

47 minutes ago, paapiman said:

There is a Shabad (whose Jaap can be done) to obtain a child (male or female). The above two shabads can be used to obtain a son (male child) and this topic is related to a son.

There is nothing wrong, if a Sikh woman desires to have a son. Even, Mata Ganga jee (mother of Satguru jee) wanted a son.

Examples of anti-Gurmat activities:

• Heinous crime of Female infanticide (either in the womb or when the child is born)
• Discriminating against (or looking down upon) a female child
• Discriminating against (or looking down upon) a woman, who has given birth to a female child
• Physically assaulting, either the female child, or the woman who has given birth to that child (using female child birth as a reason)
• Not accepting Almighty God's will

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Yet you outright state males are higher status than females, that females are 'downgrades' to males, that it is seen as a punishment if a male were to be reborn in a female body, that males should have more rights in Sikhi, that women should show 'uttmost' respect to males (presumably because of this supposed higher status) Gursikh women should 'bow' to their husbands because their husbands are somehow higher status than them... explain how that's not discrimination??? LOL.  

Think of the reason WHY women would want only sons!  It's because of the above!  Because of the hatred of females!  All of the above creates the view that women are lowly and males are superior.  

Edited November 16, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[mahanpaapi]

this  son vs daughter crap is invention of bhasuria and propagated by his contemporary followers in different shades, that is horrible;

 by the way all Gurus blessed innumerable families with sons that is also horrible!

 

may Waheguru bless you with spiritual wisdom.

[kdsingh80]

10 hours ago, Satkirin_Kaur said:

What does that Saint say to do in order to obtain a daughter?  Oh that's right... nobody truly *wants* daughters...

When you have a culture where old age responsibility of parents is solely on sons then is it any wonder people want son.Just imagine 3-4 decades back  a couple having daughters have some serious health problem in village and their daughters are married in other villages with no phones or quick transportation available . then what will they do ? ask neighbours for help

Some people in india tried system of ghar jamai means bringing son in law , but only very lazy or money hungry men did that so it become but of joke.

Many families in India even force their sons to leave education and join father's business or help him in farming , so no choice for chasing so called dreams.

 

You have to understand that you cannot bring western thinking without bringing facilities which is provided in their nation.What I heard is that in those nation is an old or crippled person make a phone call that nobody is for him or her then Govt take full care of Him/her.No such facilities exists in majority of developing nations

Edited November 16, 2015 by kdsingh80

[Guest]

Bt fact remains... this whole concept is why women are hated, men are elevated.  Why can't a daughter also look after her parents?  Why can't married couples spend time with BOTH families and look after BOTH families? Who says someone has to be married to someone in a different town?? Why not look at moving both sets of parents into one home and look after them both? Or if it's rural, like on a farm, have in-law places for both sets of parents etc?  I don't see why being a daughter means you have to ignore your own prents!  I could never dream of ignoring my parents to the benefit of his! And I would expect him to also consider my parents and help them as well! What needs to change is the idea that it must be a son that looks after you in your old age!

This thinking is what actually creates the whole situation where women are devalued, right from their birth! They are seen as a liability when young, then a servant to their husband's family when they grow up, always seen as merely an appendage of the man they are attached to.  Never  seen as the individual they are. Never appreciated.  Life becomes about the males only and women are just another commodity.  It's sad...

[dalsingh101]

Talking from what I see, hordes of Sikh Panjabi females don't have any problems asserting themselves and doing what they want. Right or wrong. 

[Ragmaala]

Both son and daughter are necessary in order to complete grihasth dharam.  Son makes sure the lineage continues. The daughter makes sure that there is a continuous source of giving away 'daan', source of donation.Daughter is considered auspicious in a family. Giving away daughter is considered the greatest donation parents can give away, kanya daan. It is actually, a big deal.

But above all, it is your destiny, daughters, sons or no children. Children who come into your families usually have a previous connection with you in past lives.

 

[paapiman]

A bit off-topic - A Daughter (girl child) is refereed to as "Lachmi" (Goddess of wealth). Some believe that they (girls) are connected to wealth and prosperity of a family. Daas is not sure, if this concept conforms with Gurmat or not.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited November 16, 2015 by paapiman

[paapiman]

8 minutes ago, Ragmaala said:

Both son and daughter are necessary in order to complete grihasth dharam.  Son makes sure the lineage continues. The daughter makes sure that there is a continuous source of giving away 'daan', source of donation.Daughter is considered auspicious in a family. Giving away daughter is considered the greatest donation parents can give away, kanya daan. It is actually, a big deal.

Bro, does Kanya Daan (concept) fall within the paradigm of Gurmat? Can you please shed some light on it?

Thanks

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[Ragmaala]

Here is an article on Ayurvedic ways of obtaining a son. I am not sure if this is Gurmat or how accurate is it. But I just posted it for interesting knowledge.
Apparently, if you have more sukra (y)  than artava (x)  you get a son.  And one way of increasing your sukra was to abstain for atleast a month before copulating with wife. And apparently if you copulate on even nights, or something to do with moon or not, you can determine the gender. I am not sure if this is just fairytale, but I have heard similar tales from elders.  So just for your information, here is the link:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3331542/pdf/ASL-3-98.pdf

 

[Ragmaala]

2 minutes ago, paapiman said:

Bro, does Kanya Daan (concept) fall within the paradigm of Gurmat? Can you please shed some light on it?

Thanks

 

Bhul chuk maaf

I think our rehitnamas make a big deal about whom we should donate our daughters hands to. The gursikh girl shall not be married to a person who is hair cut, mona, not-dharmi, alcoholic or a druggie. Gursikhs should marry their daughters to gursikh grooms only.

Also, rehitnamas forbid parents from eathing from the house of daughter, or using the money of their daughters. Gursikhs never take from their daughters , but always give to them. Also there is a story in Sikh History, in which Guru Angad Dev Ji went with Guru Nanak, and saw some girl forms eating away the flesh of some beings. Upon further inquiry, it was mentioned the beings whose flesh is being eaten are the ones who ate the earning of their daughters.

So a lot of respect is given to daughters in Sikhi. You should always give to daughters, but not take away from them.  So based upon rehitnamas and above mentioned tales, and the traditions & sanskriti of our elders, I believe that giving to daughters is necessary & considered good merit. That is why in Sikhi we are also taught to look at other smaller girls as our own daughters.

So I dont know if kanya daan is gurmat idea, but I do know giving to daughters is essential. where as there is no mention of giving anything to sons. Instead it is the sons religion to earn for his parents.

[Ragmaala]

Having said everything, a child is a blessing of Guru. If you have sukh in your life, it will come either through a son or a daughter. It wont matter. Your own happiness is not dependent on the gender of child.  The only practical benefit of a son is the continuing of a lineage. And in true Gurmat probably the lineage does not even matter. Because sants are not even married. But on the other hand, if a bhagat is born in your lineage your 21 kuls get mukti/libeartion. So in that context lineage is important. But again if a bhagat is born is daughters side, they 7 kuls of nanke, and 7 kuls of dadke and 7 kuls of something else. So i guess even if one has only a daughter, he she can still get liberated in the context of a bhagat born into their families. But rather than depending on the imaginary  idea that a bhagat will be born into their lineage to get liberated, one would instead do bhagti on their own to get mukti.

So truly in the end, one gets what they deserve and is best for them. We need faith in Guru Ji.

[paapiman]

21 kuls - 7 nanke (mother's side), 7 dadke (father's side) and 7 soray (in-laws).

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

1 hour ago, Ragmaala said:

Also, rehitnamas forbid parents from eathing from the house of daughter, or using the money of their daughters. Gursikhs never take from their daughters , but always give to them. Also there is a story in Sikh History, in which Guru Angad Dev Ji went with Guru Nanak, and saw some girl forms eating away the flesh of some beings. Upon further inquiry, it was mentioned the beings whose flesh is being eaten are the ones who ate the earning of their daughters.

 

Thanks for the reply paaji. 

Was the reason earning of daughters or female infanticide in the above sakhi? Please do confirm, if you get time.

Thanks

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[Ragmaala]

7 minutes ago, paapiman said:

Thanks for the reply paaji. 

Was the reason earning of daughters or female infanticide in the above sakhi? Please do confirm, if you get time.

Thanks

 

Bhul chuk maaf

If you go to amir bhandar teeka, page 488, read the sakhi of sun-samadhi walean di.  It was about people who ate earnings of their daughters.

[kdsingh80]

23 hours ago, Guest said:

Bt fact remains... this whole concept is why women are hated, men are elevated.  Why can't a daughter also look after her parents?  Why can't married couples spend time with BOTH families and look after BOTH families? Who says someone has to be married to someone in a different town?? Why not look at moving both sets of parents into one home and look after them both? Or if it's rural, like on a farm, have in-law places for both sets of parents etc?  I don't see why being a daughter means you have to ignore your own prents!  I could never dream of ignoring my parents to the benefit of his! And I would expect him to also consider my parents and help them as well! What needs to change is the idea that it must be a son that looks after you in your old age!

This thinking is what actually creates the whole situation where women are devalued, right from their birth! They are seen as a liability when young, then a servant to their husband's family when they grow up, always seen as merely an appendage of the man they are attached to.  Never  seen as the individual they are. Never appreciated.  Life becomes about the males only and women are just another commodity.  It's sad...

I agree with you because of this system people don't want girl child,. but you cannot change a sustainable culture overnight. You first have to give people an alternative .