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Why eggs not allowed in Sikh dharam? confused?


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I understand many sant groups - such as taksal, rara sahib, harkhowale, nanaksar, akj, 3ho refrain from eating meat or meat is not allowed but what they do go against eggs? I never really understood even to this day especially eggs here are free range.

I think there is bit of vaishanv influence of sikhi thought when it comes to diet, physical interaction, there is no question about it all this overtly hyper sensitive/superstitious issues on even eggs.

I put a question to most hard core anti egg eating/ veggie followers, how exactly being so ultra paranoid about this makes us "Khatri ko put ho bhramin ko nahi " - Amrit bachan by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Maharaj.  

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I understand many sant groups - such as taksal, rara sahib, harkhowale, nanaksar, akj, 3ho refrain from eating meat or meat is not allowed but what they do go against eggs? I never really understood even to this day especially eggs here are free range.

Bro, correct me if Daas is wrong, aren't eggs, menstrual waste of hens?

Bhul chuk maaf

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Female :  The ovary of the human female releases egg called ovum on day 14.  It travels from the fallopian tube and stays in the uterus  for 12-14 days, waiting for a sperm. In the meantime, the endometrium is building up. This is the lining of uterus, which is called the periods.

Hen: Ova (yolks) develop in the ovary, released into oviduct, in oviduct glands secrete stuff to make egg white and shell. So the egg passes through the reproductive tract, stays in the vagina, and then the vaginal muscles push it out like delivering a baby.

So yes, paapiman is right, It is essentially eating the period of a hen when eating unfertilized eggs.

It is analogous to eating the Periods/Menstrual waste of a woman , however not covered in a shell, but essentially the same thing.

And we all know how dirty female menstrual waste it, just to induce vomiting... I am just kidding ;)

 

 

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Edited by Ragmaala
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So egg is coming from the reproductive tract.

The honey comes from the digestive tract of bees. Essentially it is Bees Vomit hehe

I personally do not use honey much.

And as for milk, we drank it from our mothers when we were babies. Now we choose to make cow our mother, and just drink her milk. Even milk is a tricky one for me, because of the cruel handling of cows, I hope they treat them well in Canada. In India, cows are kept quite nicely.

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In india the eggs a lot of times are fertilized and that's why those groups do not eat eggs even if they are not fertilized in the west. I'm not sure if the nihangs eat eggs. Does anybody know?

In my opinion there is nothing wrong with eggs that are not fertilized. There is no killing involved to get the egg.

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So egg is coming from the reproductive tract.

The honey comes from the digestive tract of bees. Essentially it is Bees Vomit hehe

I personally do not use honey much.

And as for milk, we drank it from our mothers when we were babies. Now we choose to make cow our mother, and just drink her milk. Even milk is a tricky one for me, because of the cruel handling of cows, I hope they treat them well in Canada. In India, cows are kept quite nicely.

What a joke Indian treatment of cows is one of worst in India. And Farmers in Punjab and Haryana are abandoning cows for profitable buffaloes as 16000 crore of worth buffalo meat is exported from India .Punjab has 75% buffaloes and Haryana has 80%. Infact .What is shocking is that Mathure the birth place of Krishna have abandoned cows . There are 5 times more buffaloes in Mathura

 

While buffaloes constituted 34.6 per cent of the country's total bovine animal population (male plus female) as per the latest 2007 Livestock Census, the corresponding percentages were higher for Haryana (79.3), Punjab (74), Uttar Pradesh (55.8), Andhra Pradesh (54.2), Gujarat (52.4), Rajasthan (47.8) and Bihar (34.8). Most of these states are in the Vaishnav-Jain-Arya Samaj heartland, where the cow is specially revered. On the other hand, the buffalo shares were the lowest in Kerala (3.2), West Bengal (3.8) and the North-East states (4.6) that have no blanket laws prohibiting cow slaughter or sale of beef!

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/opinion/columns/harish-damodaran/cow-belt-or-buffalo-nation/article3328532.ece

 

Farmers in Punjab and Haryana are raising buffalo for meat and milk

 

 

 

 

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Okay there is a HUGE difference between a chicken egg and human 'menstrual waste' as Paapiman puts it. But I am not surprised that he tries to use women's periods to justify his position on eggs.  Because, women are gross and unclean right... 

I think the real issue is that in India there is no strict isolation on chicken and hens so the eggs can sometimes be fertilized - mind you you might never know because they would be consumed before anything grew in there that was visible.  But it's the thought of killing a potential life.  In North America, there is no chance the eggs are fertilized as the hens are kept away from the males all together. So there is no chance of killing a potential life.  And the hen lays the egg regardless.  

If there is nutrients and protein in eggs then why would anyone look at them as gross?? As long as they are not fertilized we aren't killing anything.  At least the inside of the egg is sterile!  More than I can say for milk.... which by the way actually has an allowance for the amount of 'pus' it can contain (sine cows are milked so much they develop infections in their udders) and then they are pumped full of antibiotics to combat that, and who knows how much of that stuff we are getting.

You'd be grossed out by just about everything you eat if you only knew.... there are allowances for number of insect pieces allowed in canned vegetables and sauces are particularly bad.  Something like 4-5 full maggots per bottle of sauce.  Insects notoriously get into grains... do you think all the grains are gotten rid of??  Think of all those bugs having sex in your grains and lentils and beans Paapiman!!! 

HAHAH

P.S. I LOVE honey and it's considered nature's super food as it contains so many compounds which are beneficial... it's both anti-inflammatory and antiseptic, is much better to use as a sweetener than sugar and is full of antioxidants.  

You know all these things are just in your head if you find them gross... 

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Back in the 1700s the Singhs probably even are insects in the jungles. Right now our people are like god damn Brahmins and are scared shitless. They still have these stories of Singhs eating chickpeas etc (which might be true in some instances) but we all know that the Singh had to eat meat. If I had to live in the jungles I too will hunt and fish cause that's how the old Singhs survived.

Our people are too much about shanti and bhagti and not much about shiv shakti.

Bro, don't even compare those Singhs to today's so-called Sikhs. If those old Singhs ate meat, they also sacrificed a lot for the panth.

Correct me if I am wrong, Nanaksar and Taksaal don't deny that Sikhs ate meat for survival, akj does.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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What a joke Indian treatment of cows is one of worst in India.

Thanks for enlightening !

I am talking about the cows who were kept in homes with love. We used to have a cow in India, especially in city, during childhood times. Organic& no extra hormones or Oxytocin.

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You know all these things are just in your head if you find them gross... 

Satkirin, It truly comes down to personal preference, how much one can handle before they gross themselves out.

Unfertilized eggs:  yes, they come from the Hen's reproductive tract.  As I proved earlier, it is equivalent to female ovum. So it is a matter of personal preference, if you can handle it. I am not dictating anything, just providing simple facts.

Milk :   That is also personal. Some people are vegans. Others like myself consider it okay.

 Honey :   I find it to be tasty as well, lol, but the idea of bees vomit, I like to use that to gross other people out for fun

Other food for thoughts, for fun

  • If the udders are not cleaned, you are ingesting urine & dung,  pus from infection etcetc, if the emotional state of cow is not good, you are ingesting her chemicals, stress hormones &  other chemicals
  • Billions of microorganism being ingested through air 24/7, bacteria on our skin, and other dirty surfaces
  • Flies bringing fecal matter to your food in dirty Indian streets
  • The street food in India is notoriously disgusting, ...   Anyways I will stop.

In the end, eat & drink whatever you like. It truly does not matter in end, as each person is on his own. Except for Sants who have a responsibility of carrying a group with them in the afterlife, they advise certain diet restrictions for their devotees. 

The paths are many & unique, choose whichever you like .

 

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As for original question, the best person to ask would be someone who clearly has a knowledge beyond the physical realm or a highly advanced Sant, as to why Sants are against meat & eggs ?

Bhai Raghbir Singh Bir who wrote Bandginama was a non-vegetarian, but he later became vegetarian due to his own personal feelings & experiences. Read that chapter where he talks about it & share here for others.

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ਸਲੋਕੁ ਮਃ ੧ ॥
ਜੇ ਕਰਿ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਮੰਨੀਐ ਸਭ ਤੈ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
ਗੋਹੇ ਅਤੈ ਲਕੜੀ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਕੀੜਾ ਹੋਇ ॥
ਜੇਤੇ ਦਾਣੇ ਅੰਨ ਕੇ ਜੀਆ ਬਾਝੁ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥
ਪਹਿਲਾ ਪਾਣੀ ਜੀਉ ਹੈ ਜਿਤੁ ਹਰਿਆ ਸਭੁ ਕੋਇ ॥
ਸੂਤਕੁ ਕਿਉ ਕਰਿ ਰਖੀਐ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਪਵੈ ਰਸੋਇ ॥
ਨਾਨਕ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਏਵ ਨ ਉਤਰੈ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਉਤਾਰੇ ਧੋਇ ॥੧॥

Dhan Guru Nanak ...

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As for original question, the best person to ask would be someone who clearly has a knowledge beyond the physical realm or a highly advanced Sant, as to why Sants are against meat & eggs ?

Bhai Raghbir Singh Bir who wrote Bandginama was a non-vegetarian, but he later became vegetarian due to his own personal feelings & experiences. Read that chapter where he talks about it & share here for others.

Bro, eating meat has a negative effect on the mind. Even, some vegetarian foods like garlic, onions, etc are not good for the mind.

Bhul chuk maaf

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your post reminded me about a shabad


ਸਲੋਕੁ ਮਃ ੧ ॥ सलोकु मः १ ॥ Salok mėhlā 1. Shalok, First Mehl:
ਜੇ ਕਰਿ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਮੰਨੀਐ ਸਭ ਤੈ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਹੋਇ ॥ जे करि सूतकु मंनीऐ सभ तै सूतकु होइ ॥ Je kar sūṯak mannī▫ai sabẖ ṯai sūṯak ho▫e. If one accepts the concept of impurity, then there is impurity everywhere.
ਗੋਹੇ ਅਤੈ ਲਕੜੀ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਕੀੜਾ ਹੋਇ ॥ गोहे अतै लकड़ी अंदरि कीड़ा होइ ॥ Gohe aṯai lakṛī anḏar kīṛā ho▫e. In cow-dung and wood there are worms.
ਜੇਤੇ ਦਾਣੇ ਅੰਨ ਕੇ ਜੀਆ ਬਾਝੁ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥ जेते दाणे अंन के जीआ बाझु न कोइ ॥ Jeṯe ḏāṇe ann ke jī▫ā bājẖ na ko▫e. As many as are the grains of corn, none is without life.
ਪਹਿਲਾ ਪਾਣੀ ਜੀਉ ਹੈ ਜਿਤੁ ਹਰਿਆ ਸਭੁ ਕੋਇ ॥ पहिला पाणी जीउ है जितु हरिआ सभु कोइ ॥ Pahilā pāṇī jī▫o hai jiṯ hari▫ā sabẖ ko▫e. First, there is life in the water, by which everything else is made green.
ਸੂਤਕੁ ਕਿਉ ਕਰਿ ਰਖੀਐ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਪਵੈ ਰਸੋਇ ॥ सूतकु किउ करि रखीऐ सूतकु पवै रसोइ ॥ Sūṯak ki▫o kar rakẖī▫ai sūṯak pavai raso▫e. How can it be protected from impurity? It touches our own kitchen.
ਨਾਨਕ ਸੂਤਕੁ ਏਵ ਨ ਉਤਰੈ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਉਤਾਰੇ ਧੋਇ ॥੧॥ नानक सूतकु एव न उतरै गिआनु उतारे धोइ ॥१॥ Nānak sūṯak ev na uṯrai gi▫ān uṯāre ḏẖo▫e. ||1|| O Nanak, impurity cannot be removed in this way; it is washed away only by spiritual wisdom. ||1||

 

Wow you actually posted something that agreed with what I said and without telling me to shut up. And I just looked out the window and I don't see any pigs in the sky...

 

In the end, eat & drink whatever you like. It truly does not matter in end, as each person is on his own. Except for Sants who have a responsibility of carrying a group with them in the afterlife, they advise certain diet restrictions for their devotees.

The paths are many & unique, choose whichever you like .

For me personally, I just feel guilty if something with a consciousness was killed - their whole life gone - for me to have just one more meal... so it's not like their life even sustained me for the rest of mine, but just one meal, just another day only.  Is that what the whole meaning of their life came down to??  I know some won't understand what I am trying to say.  And I am dead set against factory farming practices, usage of antibiotics and hormones in animals because of the conditions of factory farming and the resultant diseases among the animal populations, torture of animals ("broiler" chickens probably the worst of all... I won't summarize it here, but easily found online).

Now.... plants they are finding also have rudimentary consciousness... and can react to pain. (look up experiments on plants using anesthetic... its very interesting what it suggests!) so now what am I supposed to eat?? LOL.

At least bee vomit and eggs are only products of animals and not life in their own right... LOL.  (p.s. I always use the "bee vomit" thing to spark a reaction from people too! But I adore bees... without them we are in trouble as most plants which we eat fruits and vegetables from are pollinated by them.  Bee keeping for honey helps maintain populations.... in Asia they are already needing to hand pollinate!)

 

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Bro, eating meat has a negative effect on the mind. Even, some vegetarian foods like garlic, onions, etc are not good for the mind.

Bhul chuk maaf

Actually, they have proven that meat was a necessary step in the human brain developing to the point where we are:

"
One study, published last month in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, examined the brain sizes of several primates. For the most part, larger bodies have larger brains across species. Yet human have exceptionally large, neuron-rich brains for our body size, while gorillas — three times more massive than humans — have smaller brains and three times fewer neurons. Why?

The answer, it seems, is the gorillas' raw, vegan diet (devoid of animal protein), which requires hours upon hours of eating only plants to provide enough calories to support their mass.

Researchers from Brazil, led by Suzana Herculano-Houzel, a neuroscientist at the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro in Brazil, calculated that adding neurons to the primate brain comes at a fixed cost of approximately six calories per billion neurons.

For gorillas to evolve a humanlike brain, they would need an additional 733 calories a day, which would require another two hours of feeding, the authors wrote. A gorilla already spends as much as 80 percent of the tropic's 12 hours of daylight eating."

Also:

"Proteins affect brain performance because they provide amino acids, from which neurotransmitters are made. Neurotransmitters carry signals from one brain cell to another. The better you feed these messengers, the more efficiently they deliver the goods. The amino acids tryptophan and tyrosine, are precursors of neurotransmitters, the substances from which neurotransmitters are made.

Some high protein, low carbohydrate, high tyrosine foods that are likely to rev up the brain are seafood, meat, eggs, soy, and dairy."

Edited by Satkirin_Kaur
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I put a question to most hard core anti egg eating/ veggie followers, how exactly being so ultra paranoid about this makes us "Khatri ko put ho bhramin ko nahi " - Amrit bachan by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Maharaj.  

Bro, one does not become a warrior by eating meat only. There is no relation between, being very cautious (especially in Canada) about meat eating and being a warrior.

Having said that, if one accidentally eats meat, it should not be taken as a big sin. It is a small one, which can be easily forgiven by Satguru jee.

Warrior (Khatri) is also a person, who wins over his own mind.

Btw, what do you mean by being "ultra paranoid"?

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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In my opinion there is nothing wrong with eggs that are not fertilized. There is no killing involved to get the egg.

Bro, it is not only about killing (as we kill plants too for food), it is also about the effect of eating eggs, on the mind.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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Bro, it is not only about killing (as we kill plants too for food), it is also about the effect eggs have on the mind.

Bhul chuk maaf

This could be said of many things. What can smelling that fragrance do to the mind or going to an astrologer do to the mind etc. A person has to have full faith on the true guru and then nothing will affect him.

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This could be said of many things. What can smelling that fragrance do to the mind or going to an astrologer do to the mind etc. A person has to have full faith on the true guru and then nothing will affect him.

Paaji, many factors affect the mind, but the ones mentioned in Gurbani or told by Gurmukhs, are the ones we should focus on.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited by paapiman
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