Why eggs not allowed in Sikh dharam? confused?

[Singh123456777]

Once you do these things as prescribed in the shabads you can eat 20 goats and 10 elephants and it still won't affect you but if don't follow the true guru even eating dals and vegetables the mind will be affected.

[paapiman]

Once you do these things as prescribed in the shabads you can eat 20 goats and 10 elephants and it still won't affect you but if don't follow the true guru even eating dals and vegetables the mind will be affected.

Daas is not a Brahamgyani.

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

The mind gets affected if we think it will get affected. When a person has full faith on guru the mind won't ever get affected. A person has to have a strong will like the puratan shaheeds. The only way we can get a strong will is if we have full faith on the guru.

This quote from osho is what drives me toward the guru

Osho once said, 'when you meet the true Guru, you will not find answers to your questions, but your questions will become irrelevant.' 

Daas is not a Brahamgyani.

Good quote. Thanks for it.

Bhul chuk maaf

[Singh123456777]

My brother a person does not need to be a brahmgyani to have a firm belief to not get affected. Many Singhs in maharaj Ji's time were not brahmgyanis but they still did not get affected by a lot of things cause they found the true guru. Put your faith in the true guru always and you won't get affected. 

[sukrit kaur]

IMHO,eggs and meat must not be included in any sikh's/gurmukh's/spiritual seeker's diet.Rest is one"s own choice.

P.S: I strictly oppose meat and eggs being part of my diet.

 

[CdnSikhGirl]

IMHO,eggs and meat must not be included in any sikh's/gurmukh's/spiritual seeker's diet.Rest is one"s own choice.

P.S: I strictly oppose meat and eggs being part of my diet.

 

Do you consume dairy??? 

[sukrit kaur]

Lol! I knew such questions would be asked.

I well understand the biological and scientific concepts which support the fact.

But just implying our own biological concepts or giving examples of theories on life,doesn't change the basic principles of spirituality.I mean as I said it's one's own choice.but bachans of great mahapurkhs too make sense.

For  a spiritual seeker( based on individuality) ,he only knows his progress/ awastha /kamai ,so if his inner soul (which  is under maharaj's control) allows him to consume that things ,then fine.So all depends upon our inner voice.If Maharaj blesses a person and takes control of his inner soul then whatever he consumes,does is right.So we cannot say this is right or wrong unless we experience direct  control of Maharaj on our wishes/preferences.

Gur fateh!

 

[paapiman]

Once you do these things as prescribed in the shabads you can eat 20 goats and 10 elephants and it still won't affect you but if don't follow the true guru even eating dals and vegetables the mind will be affected.

According to your line of thinking, one can even say that having sex with hundreds of women, drinking alcohol, smoking, etc, won't affect us, after following the shabads which you posted.

Paaji, we cannot talk like Brahamgyanis. This type of talk will only misguide people. Rehat Maryada (Code of conduct) has been made for a reason. We need strict rules, for our minds to stay within limits.

Bhul chuk maaf

[Singh123456777]

Bro the guru did not want us to eat meat. There is no meat in unfertilized eggs that are available in the west. Some nihangs eat eggs and they call them raam ladoos. 

[sukrit kaur]

 Some nihangs eat eggs and they call them raam ladoos. 

Big lol!!

[Singh123456777]

Big lol!!

 

I'm totally serious lol

[Guest]

Nihangs are much cooler than rest of panth. They don't take this life seriously take it as drama as gurbani states. 

Relax be a nihang with green leafs should be new t-shirt design. Hehe 

[paapiman]

Bro the guru did not want us to eat meat. There is no meat in unfertilized eggs that are available in the west. Some nihangs eat eggs and they call them raam ladoos. 

Hen's menstrual waste = Raam Laddu - wth is going on?....lol

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited August 31, 2015 by paapiman

[CdnSikhGirl]

Everywhe you look there is life...

On each and every vegetable, there is bacteria, which can be considered meat.  Insects who lay eggs... as Paapiman had called them menstrual waste of insects.  Washing won't remove all of this.  Life exists everywhere and you can not avoid it.  Eat a head of lettuce and you unknowingly ate several bugs along with it! 

Guru Nanak Dev Ji spoke of the hypocrisy of such thinking...

First Mehl:
The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom.
What is called meat, and what is called green vegetables? What leads to sin?
It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering.
Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night.
They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom.
O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people? They cannot answer, or even understand what is said.
They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts.
They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat.

Panj Pyaras during Amrit Sanchar explained this hypocrisy and that meat is not forbidden but it must be jhatka and not kutha.  The reasoning is causing an animal unnecessary suffering and sacrifcing something to God which also has the same divine light within (essentially what good does it do, to sacrifice part of God to God, of which we are also part of).  It's clear when you read Gurbani that it's the hypocrisy (false show) which is being spoken against and not the act of eating meat itself. 

So its your choice to eat meat or not.  Its your choice to eat eggs or not (which are not even considered to be meat but instead a product of an animal the same as dairy) Its your choice to eat dairy or not.  Again if one refrains from eating eggs and is staunch on that stance, but they drink milk, then they too are a hypocrite!  There have been studies also whcih have shown that plants do have a consciousness (rudimentary) and can react to pain by way of electrical signals... similar to a nervous system, which is actually measurable by scientific instruments. Life is everywhere... the divine light is everywhere.  Again, Gurbani focuses on our intent, our actions towards others (including plants and animals) and not so much on what we eat to sustain ourselves in this world.  Another example of this hypocrisy would be someone who refuses meat on the basis of spiritual reasons, but then goes and cuts down a forest to use the wood from the trees leaving destruction in their wake.  Certain tribal cultures in contrast, have existed in harmony with the environment, eating meat, but never leaving a trace they had even been to a location, because they take only very little from their surroundings, and replace what has been taken by replanting etc.  Who is more worthy of spiritual progression? The hypocrite who refuses all meat but destroys a forest, or the tribal person who lives in absolute harmony with their environment, while eating meat (providing the animal is killed quickly to minimize pain)???

Myself I am vegetarian not for spiritual reasons.  I prefer not to kill animals. I do eat eggs, and dairy.  I prefer not to eat vegetables where the plant itself is the meal (ie the plant dies). I try to eat vegetables where the part you eat is the seed pod, or flower etc. which falls of leaving the original plant to still live and provide more food. But if I do eat some plant which died to provide me food, I try to stick to organic, buy from farmers which continually contribute to regrowth etc. and don't just exploit the environment.

This is perfectly in harmony with SRM. Nihangs eat jhatka meat... they are also perfectly in harmony with Rehet Maryada.

I am trying to not be the hypocrite Guru Nanak Dev Ji warned us about.



 

 

[SAadmin]

Here is the video of baba nihal singh ji explaining four kurahits including kutha mass (meat in a hallal way) 

https://www.facebook.com/652447751445011/videos/952023628154087/

[paapiman]

Evidence to prove that only meat slaughtered (ritualistically) by the Sikh way, can be consumed by a Sikh.

Quote

‘Don’t shame us by wondering in shops, restaurants, market places etc eating meat, refrain from doing this! Perform Jhatka with your own hands and go hunting for prey. Only then are we permitted to eat meat’ (Nihang Jathedar Baba Santa Singh, Pracchin Panth Parkash Steek. Please refer to this text in the list further below). 

Unquote [1]

[1] - http://www.sikhnet.com/discussion/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=7622&start=10

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

Comparing eggs (menstrual waste) to milk (amazing drink) is imprudent. Cow has been given the status of motherhood in Vedas. The milk produced, is meant for humans.

Gurbani clearly states that we can consume dairy products.

ਦਾਲਿ ਸੀਧਾ ਮਾਗਉ ਘੀਉ ॥

Lentils, flour and ghee - these things, I beg of You.

Ghee (butter oil) is made from milk. Even, the amount of milk produced by cows and buffaloes is a clear indication that it is not just meant for the calves. Other animals don't produce that much milk.

 

Female menstrual waste is used in magic. Please have a look below:

http://spellshelp.com/articles/magic/genitals-in-magic/

This might be one of the reasons for Saints to prohibit the consumption of eggs, which is also related to menstruation. Gurparsaad, Daas will try to ask a scholar about it and provide more details.

There is not even a single tuk in Gurbani, which clearly approves eating of eggs. If one want to eat eggs, it is their wish, but it is a big sin to justify it using Gurmat. Personal human weaknesses must never be justified using Gurmat. One must admit his/her faults and wrongdoings.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

 

Edited September 22, 2015 by paapiman

[CdnSikhGirl]

Maybe you should take a look at this Paapiman, if you turn a blind eye to the 'missing dairy calves' most of which are sold into the beef industry or salughtered in their first week of life.  Milk is not on demand on tap... a cow must become pregnant to produce it.

If you think that dairy farmers keep the male calves and feed them milk they require while 'sharing' the leftoever milk for human consumption, you are sadly mistaken!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.animalsaustralia.org/issues/dairy-cows.php

Further to this, the dairy cows are kept pregnant continuously (you seriourly didn't think they just produce that much milk on their own did you?)... pregnancy after pregnancy after pregnancy... just to satisfy our wants for a product (milk) that human adults were never meant to consume anyway.  (There is a reason why many people are lactose intolerant!) HUman babies were meant to consume human milk only and only in infancy!

The dairy industry is in many ways even more cruel than the beef industry.  The milk was never 'meant for human consumption' as you stated.  You have a seriously flawed line of thinking.

 http://health.howstuffworks.com/wellness/food-nutrition/facts/environmental-health-reasons-dairy.htm

You are part of the hypocrisy that Guru Nanak Dev Ji spoke about!

What happens to the cows after their weak bodies give out after being impregnated over and over, milked continouosly to the point that their udders suffer infections (the pus from which makes its way into milk humans consume - yes there is an actual 'allowance' for this in the industry), filled with antibiotics to combat the infections, the antibiotics enter humans, and cause super bugs to become resistant to antibiotics from the overuse.  http://foodmatters.tv/articles-1/how-many-pus-cells-are-in-your-milk

Hypocrite!

http://www.nzdairy.org/thelifeofadairycow.htm

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[paapiman]

Ultimate source for Sikhs is Gurbani and Gurbani clearly allows us to consume dairy products. Even, dairy products were used in Langar during the times of Satguru jee. Most likely, all Sikhs saints consume dairy products too.

If we start going into minute details of such topics, it can result in confusion.

It is very difficult to achieve 100% hygienic conditions for ordinary household people. Does that mean we should stop taking showers, washing hands, etc.

Bhul chuk maaf

 

 

[CdnSikhGirl]

Further that shabad you posted, is Simply a plea for wordly things... it's not saying these things are acceptable. For exmaple, he begs also for 'fine clothes' - yet we are supposed to dress simply are we not?? A 'fine' horse... he even begs for a 'wife' to clean his house, speaking of that wife as a simple servant or comodity, no different than the other things he begs for in the same shabad... It's hardly a free license to consume ghee!! Learn to read entire shabads instead of one liners Paapiman! It will do you some good! This shabad is simply him begging God for pleasures in life who he refers to as the 'arranger of the affairs'

ਧੰਨਾ ॥ धंना ॥
Ḏẖannā. Dhannaa: 
ਗੋਪਾਲ ਤੇਰਾ ਆਰਤਾ ॥
Gopāl ṯerā ārṯā.
O Lord of the world, this is Your lamp-lit worship service. 
ਜੋ ਜਨ ਤੁਮਰੀ ਭਗਤਿ ਕਰੰਤੇ ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਕਾਜ ਸਵਾਰਤਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Jo jan ṯumrī bẖagaṯ karanṯe ṯin ke kāj savāraṯā. ||1|| rahā▫o.
You are the Arranger of the affairs of those humble beings who perform Your devotional worship service. ||1||Pause|| 
ਦਾਲਿ ਸੀਧਾ ਮਾਗਉ ਘੀਉ ॥ 
Ḏāl sīḏẖā māga▫o gẖī▫o.
Lentils, flour and ghee - these things, I beg of You. 
ਹਮਰਾ ਖੁਸੀ ਕਰੈ ਨਿਤ ਜੀਉ ॥
 Hamrā kẖusī karai niṯ jī▫o.
My mind shall ever be pleased. 
ਪਨ੍ਹ੍ਹੀਆ ਛਾਦਨੁ ਨੀਕਾ ॥ 
Panĥī▫ā cẖẖāḏan nīkā.
Shoes, fine clothes, 
ਅਨਾਜੁ ਮਗਉ ਸਤ ਸੀ ਕਾ ॥੧॥ 
Anāj maga▫o saṯ sī kā. ||1||
and grain of seven kinds - I beg of You. ||1|| 
ਗਊ ਭੈਸ ਮਗਉ ਲਾਵੇਰੀ ॥
Ga▫ū bẖais maga▫o lāverī.
A milk cow, and a water buffalo, I beg of You, 
ਇਕ ਤਾਜਨਿ ਤੁਰੀ ਚੰਗੇਰੀ ॥
Ik ṯājan ṯurī cẖangerī.
and a fine Turkestani horse. 
ਘਰ ਕੀ ਗੀਹਨਿ ਚੰਗੀ ॥
Gẖar kī gīhan cẖangī.
A good wife to care for my home - 
ਜਨੁ ਧੰਨਾ ਲੇਵੈ ਮੰਗੀ ॥੨॥੪॥
Jan ḏẖannā levai mangī. ||2||4||
Your humble servant Dhanna begs for these things, Lord. ||2||4|| 
 

[paapiman]

just to satisfy our wants for a product (milk) that human adults were never meant to consume anyway.  (There is a reason why many people are lactose intolerant!) HUman babies were meant to consume human milk only and only in infancy!

 

The milk was never 'meant for human consumption' as you stated.  You have a seriously flawed line of thinking.

 

 

The above statements are against Sikhism. Most likely, even our Satgurus drank milk. This person is trying to prove (indirectly) that Vedas, Gurbani and our Satgurus are wrong.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited September 22, 2015 by paapiman

[SAadmin]

I think drinking milk back in Guru's were different than drinking milk now due to deplorable conditions animals go through now. This is clear distincation..we should not confuse the two. 

[CdnSikhGirl]

 I am trying to show you the hyprocisy of rejecting eggs and meat, while still drinking milk, as Guru Nanak Dev Ji pointed out.  But you are too thick headed to understand what he was saying!

As I said earlier, it's not about is this allowed or not, it's about the hyprocisy!  Eat meat, eat eggs, drink milk if you want... but don't be a hypocrite saying you do this or refuse that for spirituality while still causing suffering through your actions.  Be vegetarian, or even vegan if you want.... but don't make a show of it to say 'see how religious I am' while on the other hand still doing things which contribute to destroying th environment or causing pain and suffering to animals.

Consuming dairy while saying meat is forbidden for spiritual reasons, while fully knowing the baby calves the milk was meant for are salughtered anyway so you can drink that milk, is being a hypocrite!!! The same hypocrisy that Guru Nanak Dev Ji spoke against in the shabad above!!!!

 

Edited September 22, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[paapiman]

I think drinking milk back in Guru's were different than drinking milk now due to deplorable conditions animals go through now. This is clear distincation..we should not confuse the two. 

So stop drinking milk now? What about the Gursikhs, of high spiritual states in today's times - Do they drink milk or not? Has any saint issued any Hukam, to not drink milk?

Bhul chuk maaf

[SAadmin]

So stop drinking milk now? What about the Gursikhs, of high spiritual states in today's times - Do they drink milk or not? Has any saint issued any Hukam, to not drink milk?

Bhul chuk maaf

I am not suggesting that I am saying you want to apply argument against this for eggs/meat yet milk you are ok with it you are just accepting milk to uphold  just because saint did so...either accept all or deny milk as well..sorry you cannot have both ways with your logic.