Nearly 10 million Sikhs have lost their religion because of this organisation

[angy15]

Just Few Years the President of India gave his nod to the amendment to the Gurdwara Act 1925. The law barring Sehajdhari Sikhs – those who practice the faith without strictly adhering to its five basic tenets – from voting in the Shiromani Gurdwara Prabhandak Committee elections has come into effect retrospectively from October 8, 2003. This means that the last two elections of the top Sikh decision-making body, which were invalidated by the Punjab and Haryana High Court, have also gained legal sanction.

The SGPC has twisted the definition of a Sehajdari, and the body’s stated definition of a Patit – a person initiated into the religion but who violates its precepts – has resulted in the systemic exclusion of a large number of community members from the Sikh religion.

Sikh religious bodies have adopted a patronising attitude in response to recent discussion on social media and in political circles. They say that Sikhs with trimmed hair are only barred from contesting elections – the gurdwaras do not forbid them from visiting.

Of course they don’t. The religious bodies run on donations from Sehajdaris and people from other religions. Why would the gurdwaras give up on the funding they receive from 70 lakh Sehajdaris, which is a third of the Sikh community?

In truth, most Sikhs do not care much for the SGPC elections. They visit the gurdwara because of their faith, not to score political brownie points. They believe that the SGPC uses their dasvandh – contribution of one-tenth of their earnings as per Sikh tradition – for the cause of the community.

Evolved practices

The divide and politics today does not do justice to the religion's origins. The term “Sikh” means shishya, or student. The name of the religion itself is open and inclusive to everyone who wishes to learn.

In popular understanding, male Sikhs take the name Singh and women adopt the name Kaur. However, the first nine Gurus did not conform to that nomenclature.

They had names such as Dev, Das, Rai and Kishen. They may or may not have grown long hair, and there are no records, despite what calendars and art portraying the Sikh Gurus depict. The changes in Sikh philosophy – the followers taking up arms – came in with Guru Hargobind, the sixth Guru. The codification in attire and the five articles of faith were introduced by Guru Gobind, the tenth Guru.

Guru Gobind bequeathed the Sikh holy book, the Guru Granth Sahib, as the immortal Guru to the followers who by now had become a community – Khalsa. The Holy Book does not define the Sehajdhari, Keshdhari or Amritdhari Sikh.

To understand this, consider a large pool of people roughly 500 years ago, who inspired by the teachings of Guru Nanak Dev and the Gurus that followed, gradually give up the rigid caste practices of Brahmanism and the codified rituals of idol worship, and moved towards a deeper understanding of the idea of god echoed by 15 great poets from across the Indian subcontinent.

These poets, by birth, are Muslims, Hindus, and from various castes including Dalits. All of them are in the Sufi/Bhakti tradition, which demolishes narrow sectarian religious boundaries. However, regional rulers and orthodox zealots prosecute these ever-growing people. Feeling the need to defend themselves and rise against injustice, Guru Gobind created a band of armed warriors – the Khalsa, or the pure. The Khalsa is a sub-sect of the Sikhs. Like any army, it has its codes – and codes define armies.

Identity defined

So how did the Khalsa’s code became the norm for the larger Sikh community? There is a lot of history involved, but another court case provides insight into the current game plan of the SGPC.

In May 2009, the Punjab and Haryana High Court ruled in a landmark case on defining Sikh identity. A SGPC-run medical institution, Sri Guru Ram Das Institute of Medical Sciences and Research in Amritsar, denied admission to a young student, Gurleen Kaur, for its MBBS course because she had plucked her eyebrows and was hence “no longer a Sikh”. The institute enjoyed minority status courtesy a Punjab government notification, which enabled the SGPC to reserve 50% of its seats for Sikh students.

Given the sensitive nature of the matter, the court summoned not only lawyers but also Sikh intellectuals and scholars to deliberate. After listening to an array of views, the court concluded that it could take a decision on Sikh identity only according to the Sikh Rehat-Maryada – code of conduct and conventions.

The judgement reads:

‘...they all lead to one unambiguous answer, namely, that maintaining hair unshorn is an essential component of the Sikh religion.’

‘... even an act of dishonouring hair is taken as a tabooed practice. An act of dyeing one’s hair is treated as an act of dishonouring hair. It would, therefore, not be incorrect for us to conclude, that maintaining hair unshorn is a part of the religious consciousness of the Sikh faith.’

The decision cost Gurleen Kaur her seat at the college. The verdict was hailed worldwide, especially in the diaspora, where the Sikh community is engaged in legal cases with foreign governments over the issue of the turbans. However, the court’s decision also split the Sikh community.

Syncretic past

It is clear that the SGPC has divided not only the Sikh community, but polarised the rich and immensely meaningful spectrum of Sikh thought by making followers choose between the legacy of Guru Nanak and Guru Gobind.

In 2008, the SGPC disallowed Bhai Ghulam Mohammad Chand, a descendant of Guru Nanak’s life-long friend and musician Bhai Mardana – arguably the first Sikh – from singing a devotional song in the Golden Temple because he was not Amritdhari.

A few days ago, on Facebook, noted Punjabi writer Waryam Singh Sandhu told the story of Bhai Des Raj from his village Sur Singh. In 1762, Ahmed Shah Abdali had destroyed the Golden Temple and filled up the sarovar, pool of nectar, with human and animal carcasses. In two years, the Sikhs collected money and asked Sikh leader Jassa Singh Ahluwalia to lay the foundation stone of the Temple.

The community gave the responsibility of constructing the current Golden Temple to Gur-Sikh khatri moneylender Bhai Des Raj (Gur-Sikh means the person is a Sikh of the Guru even if he is not practising Sikh). With the current ruling, even Bhai Des Raj won’t be eligible to vote. Neither would one of the most famous poets of Guru Gobind’s durbar, Bhai Nand Lal, be eligible. Nor would Bhai Kanhaiya, well known for responding to Guru Gobind when asked why he serves water to the enemies: “I only saw human beings. Have you not taught us to treat all God’s people as the same?”

There are thousands of such stories of the togetherness of spirit and the syncretic nature of Sikhism thought that are lost on current politicians and merchants of religion.

Split wide open

The current controversy dates back to 1999 – when the Sikhs celebrated the 300th anniversary of the formation of Khalsa. At that time, the lines in community were clear: Shiromani Akali Dal was the political face of the community and SGPC, under its President Gurcharan Singh Tohra, was the religious face.

Sehajdharis were allowed to vote in SGPC elections. That same year, the Shiromani Akali Dal's Parkash Singh Badal finally managed to push out Tohra and gained control of SGPC, and with the Bharatiya Janata Party government in power, the SGPC soon made a case for barring Sehajdharis. This is how one right wing – the rigid Sikhs – played into the hands of another right wing, the Hindutva forces.

These two rulings – the Gurleen Kaur case and the amendment to the Gurdwara Act – have clearly established the divide in the community ever since political and religious power got concentrated in the hands of the Badals.

According to SGPC’s definition in 2008, those born in Keshdhari families but have chosen to not keep their hair long are Patit – apostate or degenerate. They are no longer Sikhs.

Self-defeatist logic

According to the 2011 census, Punjab’s population was 2.4 crore, of which Sikhs comprised about 60%. The SGPC listed 5.5 million Keshdhari voters – a third of the Sikhs in Punjab – as real Sikhs.

The rest of the Sikhs, above 70 lakh in Punjab alone and approximately 1 crore worldwide, who have ever touched a scissor to their bodies, are Patits. This also satisfies another question that the Supreme Court has asked in January this year on another admissions-related case: Is Sikhism a minority religion in Punjab? The answer is a resounding yes and SGPC will enjoy the benefits owing to its minority religion status. Punjab, where a religious minority was a majority, has lost its unique status in the process.

The irony of a Sikh community, known much beyond its numbers for its service and egalitarianism, is that it fights its identity battles in the courts of a secular country and ends up losing in the real sense when it thinks it is winning court battles.

In the 1960s, the Akalis agitated for a Punjabi language state and got a Punjab which is one-seventh of the original region. The cartographers of the nation state carved out Haryana and Himachal Pradesh from their territory. Now, the SGPC has hard-defined Sikhs and the courts have given them a third of the community in Punjab and maybe half of the community worldwide. The rest have lost their identity. What can be more self-defeatist than the beauty and magnificence of a religion being reduced to whether its practitioners have unshorn hair – faith being reduced to a bodily artefact.

The reductive logic in both cases and the definition by those who manage one of the most modern religions in the world is galling. Instead of getting court rulings and decisions, fighting and contesting a battle of faith in front of modern law that goes by logic of arguments, if the SGPC has an iota of decency and honesty, let them publicise widely that Patits and Sehajdharis are no longer Sikhs. That the children born in Sikh families have to keep long hair to qualify as a Sikh and they should not donate to the gurdwaras. Would they ever do that? Your guess is as good as mine.

Amandeep Sandhu is working on a non-fiction book on Punjab

[chatanga1]

4 hours ago, angy15 said:

However, the first nine Gurus did not conform to that nomenclature.

They had names such as Dev, Das, Rai and Kishen. They may or may not have grown long hair, and there are no records,

 

Just want to add here that there is a sakhi in Puratan Janam Sakhi that Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale told of, that spoke of Guru Nanak asking Bhai Mardana to keep his kes. Also there is a sakhi of Baba Sri Chand when visiting Guru Ramdas at Amritsar, asking Guru Sahib why his beard is so long.

[BhagatSingh]

26 minutes ago, chatanga1 said:

Just want to add here that there is a sakhi in Puratan Janam Sakhi that Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale told of, that spoke of Guru Nanak asking Bhai Mardana to keep his kes. Also there is a sakhi of Baba Sri Chand when visiting Guru Ramdas at Amritsar, asking Guru Sahib why his beard is so long.

When was that text written?

[Singh123456777]

Guru nanak dev ji said that a sikh is one who keeps kes.

Bhai bala ji janam sakhi

[BhagatSingh]

There is also this sakhi of Guru Gobind Singh ji -

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਜੀ ਤੁਮ ਪੰਥ ਚਲਾਯੋ ॥ ਬਾਣਾ ਰਚਯੋ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਖਵਾਯੋ ॥
ਗੁਰੂ ਗਰੀਬ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਬਤਾਵਹੁ ॥ ਕਿਸ ਕਾਰਨ ਕਰਿ ਇਨਹੁਂ ਰਖਾਵਹੁ ॥3॥
Nau Nidh Khatri asks “Shri Prabhu ji, you run this path, you have kept your Hair unshorn. Guru Ji, helper of the poor, tell me, why have you kept long hair?"


ਸੁਨਿ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਮੁਖ ਫੁਰਮਾਵਨਿ ਕਰਯੋ ॥ ਤੁਮ ਕੋ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਬਹੁਤ ਬਿਚਰ੍ਯੋ ॥
ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਸ਼੍ਰਵਨ ਮਹਿਂ ਬੈਸ ਬਿਤਾਈ ॥ ਇਹ ਗਤਿ ਲਖੀ ਕਿ ਨਹਿਂ ਤੁਮ ਪਾਈ ॥4॥
Hearing this Guru Ji said, "You have studied many Shastra, many religious texts. You have spent your life listening and reciting the Shastra, yet you have not come to realize the answer”


ਧਰਮ ਰਖਨਿ ਕੇਸ਼ਾਦਿਕ ਭਲੇ ॥ ਸਨਕਾਦਿਕ ਤੇ ਆਵਤਿ ਚਲੇ ॥ ਭਾਰਥ ਖੰਡ ਬਿਖੈ ਸ਼ੁਭ ਦੇਸ਼ ॥ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਾਖਣੋ ਧਰਮ ਬਿਸ਼ੇਸ਼’ ॥5॥
"Adorning long hair is to keep this dharm, this tradition alive, which was started by Sanak, Sanatan, Sanandana, Sanatkumar, and others. In the land of Bharat dwells a great country, here keeping hair unshorn is an important part of our Dharam."


ਸੁਨਿ ਕੈ ਨਉਨਿਧ ਬਹੁਰ ਬਖਾਨਾ ॥ ਆਪ ਕਹਹੁ ਸਭਿ ਸਾਚ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਨਾ ॥ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਕੇਸ਼ ਧਾਰੀ ਸਭਿ ਕੋਈ ॥ ਅਬਿ ਤੌ ਸਮਾ ਰਹ੍ਯੋ ਨਹਿਂ ਸੋਈ’ ॥6॥
Listening to the answer, Nau Nidh replied, “what you have said is true. In the beginning, everyone used to keep their hair unshorn. However, that time is gone”


ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰ ਭਨ੍ਯੋ ‘ਸਮਾ ਕ੍ਯਾ ਕਹੈ ॥ ਸੋ ਰਵਿ ਸੋ ਸਸਿ ਸੋ ਜਲ ਅਹੈ ॥ ਬਾਯੂ ਬੰਨੀ ਬਸੁਧਾ ੳਈ ॥ ਦੋਸ਼ ਸਮੈ ਕੋ ਕ੍ਯਾ ਕਹਿ ਕੋਈ ॥7॥
Guru Ji replied, “What does time have to do with it? The same sun remains, the same moon, water, wind, fire and earth remain. How can anyone blame time?"


ਆਪਨ ਆਪ ਕੋ ਦੋਸ਼ ਲਖੀਜੈ । ਰਾਖੇ ਜਾਇਂ ਨ, ਸਾਚ ਕਹੀਜੈ ॥ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਖਨਿ ਕੀ ਸਮਰਥ ਹੀਨੇ ॥ ਦੋਸ਼ ਸਮੇਂ ਪਰ ਕਲਪਨ ਕੀਨੇ ॥8॥
"Blame yourself and only yourself, speak the truth, you are unable to keep hair. You lack the capability to keep your hair so you blame everything on the time."

[BhagatSingh]

14 minutes ago, Singh123456777 said:

Guru nanak dev ji said that a sikh is one who keeps kes.

Bhai bala ji janam sakhi

I think it is important to find out when it was written because I think it might be written after the arrival of Guru Gobind Singh ji.

There are also Sakhis which state that Guru Nanak Dev ji came up with the Jaikara of Sat Shri Akal.

But we know, as fact, that Guru Nanak Dev ji never used Akal as a noun, which is what it is in Sat Shri Akal, but rather always as an adjective to describe a quality of God.

He used it as an adjective in all of his writings and the usage as noun, came much later during 1700s.

So I have my doubts regarding the dates of these Sakhis of Guru Nanak Dev ji.

[angy15]

2 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

Guru nanak dev ji said that a sikh is one who keeps kes.

What does Bhai Gurdas and Guru Granth Sahib have to say abt it. Well I don't find any mentions of it.

[angy15]

3 hours ago, chatanga1 said:

Also there is a sakhi of Baba Sri Chand when visiting Guru Ramdas at Amritsar, asking Guru Sahib why his beard is so long.

Well great Ancient Mystics,Yogis and Rishis kept beard .

[paapiman]

10 hours ago, angy15 said:

The Khalsa is a sub-sect of the Sikhs. Like any army, it has its codes – and codes define armies.

Identity defined

So how did the Khalsa’s code became the norm for the larger Sikh community?

Khalsa is not a sub-sect of Sikhs. Sri Satguru jee (Tenth Master) ordered all Sikhs to partake Khande da Amrit. Some might not have followed the order.

Baptism is not optional in Sikhism. It is a must. Every person born in a Sikh family should, at one point in his life partake Khande da Amrit. It is optional for people born in non-Sikh families.

If a person feels that he is not ready yet to partake Khande da Amrit (for whatever reason), he should at least try to stay away from the 4 cardinal sins and actively work towards joining the Panth.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

5 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

There is also this sakhi of Guru Gobind Singh ji -

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਜੀ ਤੁਮ ਪੰਥ ਚਲਾਯੋ ॥ ਬਾਣਾ ਰਚਯੋ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਖਵਾਯੋ ॥
ਗੁਰੂ ਗਰੀਬ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਬਤਾਵਹੁ ॥ ਕਿਸ ਕਾਰਨ ਕਰਿ ਇਨਹੁਂ ਰਖਾਵਹੁ ॥3॥
Nau Nidh Khatri asks “Shri Prabhu ji, you run this path, you have kept your Hair unshorn. Guru Ji, helper of the poor, tell me, why have you kept long hair?"


ਸੁਨਿ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਮੁਖ ਫੁਰਮਾਵਨਿ ਕਰਯੋ ॥ ਤੁਮ ਕੋ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਬਹੁਤ ਬਿਚਰ੍ਯੋ ॥
ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਸ਼੍ਰਵਨ ਮਹਿਂ ਬੈਸ ਬਿਤਾਈ ॥ ਇਹ ਗਤਿ ਲਖੀ ਕਿ ਨਹਿਂ ਤੁਮ ਪਾਈ ॥4॥
Hearing this Guru Ji said, "You have studied many Shastra, many religious texts. You have spent your life listening and reciting the Shastra, yet you have not come to realize the answer”


ਧਰਮ ਰਖਨਿ ਕੇਸ਼ਾਦਿਕ ਭਲੇ ॥ ਸਨਕਾਦਿਕ ਤੇ ਆਵਤਿ ਚਲੇ ॥ ਭਾਰਥ ਖੰਡ ਬਿਖੈ ਸ਼ੁਭ ਦੇਸ਼ ॥ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਾਖਣੋ ਧਰਮ ਬਿਸ਼ੇਸ਼’ ॥5॥
"Adorning long hair is to keep this dharm, this tradition alive, which was started by Sanak, Sanatan, Sanandana, Sanatkumar, and others. In the land of Bharat dwells a great country, here keeping hair unshorn is an important part of our Dharam."


ਸੁਨਿ ਕੈ ਨਉਨਿਧ ਬਹੁਰ ਬਖਾਨਾ ॥ ਆਪ ਕਹਹੁ ਸਭਿ ਸਾਚ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਨਾ ॥ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਕੇਸ਼ ਧਾਰੀ ਸਭਿ ਕੋਈ ॥ ਅਬਿ ਤੌ ਸਮਾ ਰਹ੍ਯੋ ਨਹਿਂ ਸੋਈ’ ॥6॥
Listening to the answer, Nau Nidh replied, “what you have said is true. In the beginning, everyone used to keep their hair unshorn. However, that time is gone”


ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰ ਭਨ੍ਯੋ ‘ਸਮਾ ਕ੍ਯਾ ਕਹੈ ॥ ਸੋ ਰਵਿ ਸੋ ਸਸਿ ਸੋ ਜਲ ਅਹੈ ॥ ਬਾਯੂ ਬੰਨੀ ਬਸੁਧਾ ੳਈ ॥ ਦੋਸ਼ ਸਮੈ ਕੋ ਕ੍ਯਾ ਕਹਿ ਕੋਈ ॥7॥
Guru Ji replied, “What does time have to do with it? The same sun remains, the same moon, water, wind, fire and earth remain. How can anyone blame time?"


ਆਪਨ ਆਪ ਕੋ ਦੋਸ਼ ਲਖੀਜੈ । ਰਾਖੇ ਜਾਇਂ ਨ, ਸਾਚ ਕਹੀਜੈ ॥ ਕੇਸ਼ ਰਖਨਿ ਕੀ ਸਮਰਥ ਹੀਨੇ ॥ ਦੋਸ਼ ਸਮੇਂ ਪਰ ਕਲਪਨ ਕੀਨੇ ॥8॥
"Blame yourself and only yourself, speak the truth, you are unable to keep hair. You lack the capability to keep your hair so you blame everything on the time."

Great share b.

Source?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[chatanga1]

7 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

When was that text written? 

Puratan Janamsakhi is reputed to be written before Bhai Bala's.

 

7 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

There is also this sakhi of Guru Gobind Singh ji -

 

That sounds like a part of Sri Gur Sobha. Where is it from?

 

4 hours ago, angy15 said:

Well great Ancient Mystics,Yogis and Rishis kept beard .

 

Yes brother, it was a sign of holiness, udaas etc. But these mystics would also keep their hair if they kept their beards.

[kdsingh80]

8 hours ago, chatanga1 said:

 

Just want to add here that there is a sakhi in Puratan Janam Sakhi that Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale told of, that spoke of Guru Nanak asking Bhai Mardana to keep his kes. Also there is a sakhi of Baba Sri Chand when visiting Guru Ramdas at Amritsar, asking Guru Sahib why his beard is so long.

Bhai Gurdas has written defination of sikh in his vaars , There is no mention of keeping kes

[amardeep]

The sakhi is from suraj Prakash 

[BhagatSingh]

5 hours ago, kdsingh80 said:

Bhai Gurdas has written defination of sikh in his vaars , There is no mention of keeping kes

We don't even have to look that far, even in Guru Granth Sahib there is no mention of keeping hair everytime a Sikh is defined.

Kabir ji even goes as far as saying that when you develop non-dual awareness that is a Love, a vision of God, then it does not matter whether you have hair or shave your head.

We also know that the Saints whose bani is recorded in Guru Granth Sahib, some of them had shaved heads, including Kabir ji's own Guru, Ramanand ji.

[paapiman]

9 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

We don't even have to look that far, even in Guru Granth Sahib there is no mention of keeping hair everytime a Sikh is defined.

There is a mention of keeping Kesh multiple times in Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib jee Maharaaj and also in other Sikh scriptures (Sri Dasam Granth Sahib and Sri Sarabloh Sahib).

Please have a look at the topic below.

 

9 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

Kabir ji even goes as far as saying that when you develop non-dual awareness that is a Love, a vision of God, then it does not matter whether you have hair or shave your head.

That verse has multiple interpretations. In the above link, there is a video of Gyani Ram Singh jee in one of the posts. Please listen to that. That verse can be used to prove that Kesh is a requirement for humans too.

 

9 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

We also know that the Saints whose bani is recorded in Guru Granth Sahib, some of them had shaved heads, including Kabir ji's own Guru, Ramanand ji.

Source?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[angy15]

On 4/29/2018 at 11:55 AM, angy15 said:

The reductive logic in both cases and the definition by those who manage one of the most modern religions in the world is galling. Instead of getting court rulings and decisions, fighting and contesting a battle of faith in front of modern law that goes by logic of arguments, if the SGPC has an iota of decency and honesty, let them publicise widely that Patits and Sehajdharis are no longer Sikhs. That the children born in Sikh families have to keep long hair to qualify as a Sikh and they should not donate to the gurdwaras. Would they ever do that? Your guess is as good as mine.

Well in all our discussion we are missing role of SGPC.They are really letting our community down

[BhagatSingh]

16 hours ago, paapiman said:

There is a mention of keeping Kesh multiple times in Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib jee Maharaaj and also in other Sikh scriptures (Sri Dasam Granth Sahib and Sri Sarabloh Sahib).

There is no mention of keeping kesh in Guru Granth Sahib. I looked through your thread and there is none there either.

16 hours ago, paapiman said:

That verse has multiple interpretations.

It only has multiple interpretations if your ideological disposition is so inflexible that you cannot swallow its actual meaning.

ਕਬੀਰ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਇਕ ਸਿਉ ਕੀਏ ਆਨ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਜਾਇ ॥  
Kabir ji says when one (ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ) loves the Oneness, then the (ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਜਾਇ) feeling of two (the feeling of having a separate and independent sense of self) goes away.
ਭਾਵੈ ਲਾਂਬੇ ਕੇਸ ਕਰੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ ॥੨੫॥ 
It does not matter (ਭਾਵੈ ਲਾਂਬੇ ਕੇਸ ਕਰੁ) whether you keep long hair or matted hair, or whether you (ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ) shave your hair.

ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ does not mean ਘਰ ਮੁੜ ਆਇ - to return home
ਘਰਰਿ means ਰਗੜ ਕੇ and ਮੁਡਾਇ means to shave.

If you understand the nature of self, then you know hair has nothing to do with losing that sense of self and merging into Oneness.

 

16 hours ago, paapiman said:

Source?

ਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ ਮੇਰਾ ਘਰੁ ਧੁੰਧਰਾਵਾ ॥
ਬਿਟਵਹਿ ਰਾਮ ਰਮਊਆ ਲਾਵਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Kabir ji's mother says  - these Shaven-headed Saints have ruined my house, they have caused my son to chant Ram Ram.

ਕਹਤੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਸੁਨਹੁ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਈ ॥
ਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ ਮੇਰੀ ਜਾਤਿ ਗਵਾਈ ॥੨॥੩॥੩੩॥
Kabir ji says - listen mother, these Shaven-headed Saints have actually helped me transcend my condition.

[amardeep]

Some Sikhs pre-Khalsa probably did keep long hair due to to it being an ancient Indian tradition but it was not part of the rahit. 

[paapiman]

11 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

There is no mention of keeping kesh in Guru Granth Sahib. I looked through your thread and there is none there either.

Did you listen to Gyani Avtar Singh jee and Gyani Ram Singh jee's katha in that thread?

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

13 hours ago, BhagatSingh said:

ਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ ਮੇਰਾ ਘਰੁ ਧੁੰਧਰਾਵਾ ॥
ਬਿਟਵਹਿ ਰਾਮ ਰਮਊਆ ਲਾਵਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Kabir ji's mother says  - these Shaven-headed Saints have ruined my house, they have caused my son to chant Ram Ram.

ਕਹਤੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਸੁਨਹੁ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਈ ॥
ਇਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ ਮੇਰੀ ਜਾਤਿ ਗਵਾਈ ॥੨॥੩॥੩੩॥
Kabir ji says - listen mother, these Shaven-headed Saints have actually helped me transcend my condition.

Doesn't state that Srimaan Bhagat Baba Ramanand jee had a shaven head? Many Sadhus would come to visit Bhagat jee. Not all were bald headed.

Many Bhagats/Saints (irrespective of their religion) start growing kesh as they realize its importance in maintaining an energy balance of the body.

Also, according to Amri Bhandar teeka and Prof.Sahib Singh jee (please see below), ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ does not only refer to bald saints.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

21 hours ago, angy15 said:

Well in all our discussion we are missing role of SGPC.They are really letting our community down

SGPC definitely needs improvement, but in this case their decision to bar Patits (or Nigure) is not wrong.

We need to set a minimum criteria for people who can become members of major religious organizations. If a prospective member is a non-Amritdhari, then at least he should be away from the 4 cardinal sins.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

On 4/29/2018 at 3:56 PM, kdsingh80 said:

Bhai Gurdas has written defination of sikh in his vaars , There is no mention of keeping kes

Well, at that time Khande da amrit had not been prepared. The codes of conduct written by famous Sikhs of Sri Satguru jee (Tenth Master) mention that Sikhs must not cut their Kesh.

If Bhai saab jee did not mention it, it does not change the fact that we (in current times) have to follow the orders of the Tenth Master (last Master in human form). Even if some earlier Sikhs did not keep Kesh (under the first nine masters), we have to focus on the current (or the last version of the) law. Laws change with time. People have to follow the latest version of the law concerning a particular subject.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[paapiman]

On 4/29/2018 at 7:00 AM, chatanga1 said:

Just want to add here that there is a sakhi in Puratan Janam Sakhi that Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale told of, that spoke of Guru Nanak asking Bhai Mardana to keep his kes.

It is the Hafizabad wali Janamsakhi.

 

Bhul chuk maaf

[kdsingh80]

13 hours ago, amardeep said:

Some Sikhs pre-Khalsa probably did keep long hair due to to it being an ancient Indian tradition but it was not part of the rahit. 

Long and uncut hair are two different things.I don't think Indians kept uncut hair apart from Rishi muni's

[BhagatSingh]

11 hours ago, paapiman said:

Doesn't state that Srimaan Bhagat Baba Ramanand jee had a shaven head? Many Sadhus would come to visit Bhagat jee. Not all were bald headed.

Many Bhagats/Saints (irrespective of their religion) start growing kesh as they realize its importance in maintaining an energy balance of the body.

Visiting is not the same as Saving. Kabir ji is referring to the Saint that taught him and saved him. And that Saint is Guru Ramanand ji.

Many Bhagats do grow their kesh but many also cut it and shave it.

I promote the keeping of kesh all the time but I don't pretend that all Saints keep it. Many don't and they are just as enlightened if not more.

Enlightenment doesn't come from keeping or shaving hair. Je jaanase Brahmam karmam, sabh phokat nischau karamam.

Quote

Also, according to Amri Bhandar teeka and Prof.Sahib Singh jee (please see below), ਮੁੰਡੀਅਨ does not only refer to bald saints.

Mundiyan means bald headed person. It does not mean bald-headed saint.

In that shabad, Kabir ji's mom is calling Kabir ji's Guru, as a bald-headed person in a derogatory manner.

So we are translating Mundiyan as shaven-headed saints because it is referring to Guru Ramanand ji.

12 hours ago, paapiman said:

Did you listen to Gyani Avtar Singh jee and Gyani Ram Singh jee's katha in that thread?

Wasn't it obvious from my clarification on ਘਰਰਿ ਮੁਡਾਇ ? Are you sure you watched the videos you posted, Paapiman bhra ji