DHANBABANANAK Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 http://www.tapoban.org/phorum/read.php?f=1...286&t=58286 [highlight=red:378c9b7f73]whats ur views on this post? is this true?if ur dasam duar (10th gate is not open) ur soul comes out the 9 holes and body pulled out by yama?[/highlight:378c9b7f73] Author: [glow=red:378c9b7f73]Singhni Miri Piri[/glow:378c9b7f73] Date: 10-26-05 10:03 WaheguruJiKaKhalsaWaheguruJiKiFateh If you committed sins in this lifetime then you are simply going to hell. As your dhasam dhaur is not opened the soul has to come out of the 9 holes in your body and the soul would be pulled out by the yama (angel of death). As the yama pulls you out, the yama will rapidly take you to Dharam Khand which is where Dharam Raj judges you from your good and bad deeds you have committed in your life time. He will be able to see this through Chitar Gupt account which they have been taken of you during your lifetime. If you have committed countless sins then you have to go through many severe punishments including hell. Also, if you’re last dying thought was not of Waheguru which can only occur to someone who is very pure true devotee, and then you will have to live a long life of a form depending on what you last thought before dying. Even then your punishment is not over as you will have to be reborn and before taking this procedure one has to go through the 8.4 million life forms before becoming a human being. During these forms you will suffer in agony and will have complete regret of your life as you did not make any use of it. However, if one has committed an outstanding good deed even though that being was not a true Sikh devotee, then perhaps that being will not have to go through most of the punishments in the hereafter. And if a being has never committed a sin even though he/she hasn’t become united with God then they do not have to be anguished by the Yamas. But there is no way someone will never commit a sin because Guru Ji has no protection over them. Furthermore, the whole society is indulging in evil deeds which can easily manipulate any weak being into committing a sin. chith n aaeiou paarabreham thaa kharr rasaathal dheeth ||7|| But still, if you do not come to remember the Supreme Lord God, then you shall be taken and consigned to the most hideous hell! ||7|| As they are always weak and have never japped Naam then the five evils; worldly attachments, lust, ego, greed and anger can simply take control over them and can encourage them to commit a sin. Naam is the only saviour. Any one will never receive salvation or liberation. koorraa ra(n)g kasu(n)bh kaa binas jaae dhukh roe || The color of the world is false and weak; when it washes away, people cry out in pain. But if one has not committed a sin he/she shall reside in heaven but even in there, there is no liberty found. You are still forever in regret and torment. And it is then in your afterlife when you feel the separation from God and will feel like a fool for not even taking a single glimpse of Waheguru into any consideration. surag narak a(n)mrith bikh eae sabh thio ka(n)chan ar paisaa || Heaven and hell, ambrosial nectar and poison, gold and copper - these are all alike to them. The khalsa is forever free from grief and pain. Those who indulge in falsehood will fall into their own trap and be victims of grief. The Khalsa would not have to go through any severe punishments in the hereafter but if they did not reach any of the 5 Khands, then he/she would have to be reborn. And so that karma will give them a better future in their next life. Although if one has become united with God; there is no punishment waiting for them at all. And when they meet eyes with Dharam Raj he will tear up your account and will have to bow down to you. As a result, you will go to Saach Khand and receive the Robe of Honour. You will receive honour in the court of the lord. WaheguruJiKaKhalsaWaheguruJiKiFateh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niranjana Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 "Hell" - are we christians??? "Oh oh, do your simran and you wont' go to hell" - this simply does sound like Bhakti to me, let alone Sikhi, but hey, I chat 'crap'!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mloco Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 i think hell=narak in this case , how else would you translate it. i think you forget what simran means. Simran is constant remembrance of God. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAadmin Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 "Hell" - are we christians??? "Oh oh, do your simran and you wont' go to hell" - this simply does sound like Bhakti to me, let alone Sikhi, but hey, I chat 'crap'!!! hehe.. i hope she never makes it to do parchar of sikhi...she will probably even put off people who are into sikhi already let alone newcomers to sikhi... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSINGH Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 dam i always thot sikhi was quite simple, iv never believed in heaven or hell, its gettin tooooooooooooooo complicated, sum of those things remind me of islam n christianity! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh47 Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 Naranjana, how else would you translate the terms Nark or Dozak into English? the only word I can think of is 'Hell'. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHANBABANANAK Posted October 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 come answer my question: if ur dasam duar (10th gate is not open) ur soul comes out the 9 holes and body pulled out by yama? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAadmin Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 come answer my question: if ur dasam duar (10th gate is not open) ur soul comes out the 9 holes and body pulled out by yama? that's bullllocks !!!!!!!!!! :roll: yam is dharam raja or yam raja.. it usually devdoot come take you who are good people. This has nothing to do with openin dasam dwara or not. This people don't understand there are levels of spirituality.. not everything black and white as they make out to be.. ...like for example- yogis also get their dasam dwaur opened... but they go to bhram lok instead of sachkhand (complete merge)... tell them to explain that?? I beleive if person who has bhagti intentions and still on the path as an jaaigasuo and does not have his tenth door open..does not go to any hell...people make god as to be wrathful being who just happy with people with certain mindset, do simran certain way, eat food certain way, have intercourse(bhog) certain way, tie their nala certain way, dress up certain way, wear kirpan certain way, talk certain way......!!!!!!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh47 Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 I think that it all depends on ones Karams. If one does not have the Dasam Duar open, but has done bhagti or remembers God in the last moments like how Ajamal remembered Narayan with prem in his last moment, the devduts come to get the soul. But I highly doubt that there are many people in this world who remember Narayan like Ajaml did. Most are taken by Jamdoots. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAadmin Posted October 28, 2005 Report Share Posted October 28, 2005 I think that it all depends on ones Karams. If one does not have the Dasam Duar open, but has done bhagti or remembers God in the last moments like how Ajamal remembered Narayan with prem in his last moment, the devduts come to get the soul. agreed.. also add to that- another example- gangka papan. But I highly doubt that there are many people in this world who remember Narayan like Ajaml did. Most are taken by Jamdoots. don't be soo sure on that..vahiguroo is soo dayualoo anything is possible...all it needs to one arrow shot at sinner's heart..sinner becomes saint just how kauda rakash, rishi balmik becomes mahapursh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHANBABANANAK Posted October 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 29, 2005 thanx for ur replys 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inder Singh Posted October 29, 2005 Report Share Posted October 29, 2005 Naranjana, how else would you translate the terms Nark or Dozak into English? the only word I can think of is 'Hell'. See thats the problem with translations, words that seem similar are used but these two different words have entirely different connotations even if they seem similar on the face of it. This is what misleads neophytes who have little knowledge of Gurmukhi or indian religions. Regarding the article, it seems to be protestant Christian sermon with Sikh terminology inserted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singh47 Posted October 29, 2005 Report Share Posted October 29, 2005 Inder Singh Then can you please tell me what Nark is if not Hell? Dozak is a farci/Islamic term and has also been used in Gurbani as a synonym for Nark. The Islamic concept of Hell is not too different from the Christian concept of hell. Correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t Gurbani also mention how Jamdoots beat and tortures Paapi souls in Nark? Also dont the Catholics, Jehova witnesses, Jews all use the term 'Hell' in their books? then how is it just a 'protestant' Christian sermon? and isn't the term 'neophytes' also a socalled 'protestant' christian term? just curious to know. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inder Singh Posted October 30, 2005 Report Share Posted October 30, 2005 My interpretation (it is only that) is that narak and hell are not the same because they are part of two very different philosphies. Narak is not to be taken literally it is a metaphor - "One thing conceived as representing another; a symbol" - Gurbani uses these strong images to show us the correct path to Akaal. Also dont the Catholics, Jehova witnesses, Jews all use the term 'Hell' in their books? then how is it just a 'protestant' Christian sermon? Of course they do i never said they did not. It was an opinion not a universal statement. and isn't the term 'neophytes' also a socalled 'protestant' christian term? it can be used in that way but it also can be used in the way i meant it to be used neophyte A recent convert to a belief; a proselyte. A beginner or novice: a neophyte at politics. Roman Catholic Church. A newly ordained priest. A novice of a religious order or congregation. hell often Hell The abode of condemned souls and devils in some religions; the place of eternal punishment for the wicked after death, presided over by Satan. A state of separation from God; exclusion from God's presence. The abode of the dead, identified with the Hebrew Sheol and the Greek Hades; the underworld. Word History: Hell comes to us directly from Old English hel. Because the Roman Church prevailed in England from an early date, the Romanthat is, Mediterraneanbelief that hell was hot prevailed there too; in Old English hel is a black and fiery place of eternal torment for the damned. But because the Vikings were converted to Christianity centuries after the Anglo-Saxons, the Old Norse hel, from the same source as Old English hel, retained its earlier pagan senses as both a place and a person heav·en The sky or universe as seen from the earth; the firmament. Often used in the plural. Christianity. often Heaven The abode of God, the angels, and the souls of those who are granted salvation. An eternal state of communion with God; everlasting bliss. Any of the places in or beyond the sky conceived of as domains of divine beings in various religions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHANBABANANAK Posted October 30, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2005 Neo what is bhram lok? differernce between this term and sach kand? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAadmin Posted October 30, 2005 Report Share Posted October 30, 2005 brham lok is abode of yogis. This realm is below sachkhand. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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