gsingh00

they used to learn in Taksal while Sant Gurbachan Singh was jathedar

im not from UK, so I wouldnt know. to tell you the truth I have no 'issues' with kookay. The fact that I don't consider them Sikhs, doesn't mean i got some sort of hatred or agenda or against them. I don't consider muslims to be sikhs either, but that doesn't mean I hate muslims. My issue is what seems to me as distortion on bani.

i never knew u expected sikhs to look as bani distortion as a 'petty difference' anyways, i've said all i wanted to, people can read and decide for themselves.

this has nothing to do with excluding people or hating people, all it has to do with is respecting dhur kee bani. Everyone is quick to say 'have respect for other people's faith' but how about the faith of people that look at Guru Granth Sahib as Guru? Did it not hurt mahapurkhs when people tried changing around manglacharans? Did it not hurt Sikhs when Babu Teja Singh altered Guru Granth Sahib and Dasam dee bani? Does it not hurt Sikhs when people try changing aorund lagumantars? In the same way, do you not expect it to hurt sikhs when gurmeet/baljit either skip the line and move on to the next one as if it never existed, or change bani aorund AT A GURDWARA? Gurmeet and Baljit must have a lot of respect for the beliefs of others...

i think pooran avtar refers to ram chandar jee and krishna jee, because they had 16 gun/qualities (cant remember the exact thing rite now, if you want me to check it up in the japjee sahib steek though, i can). Before Guru Nanak Dev Jee came these avtars were looked as being pooran, or having all the qualities. Guru Nanak Dev Jee did not lack any of these qualities, but instead had even more that the previous avtars didnt have (once again, cant remember them of my memory right now). Listen to Sant Gyani Gurbachan Singh Jee's katha on japjee sahib on gurmatveechar.com, he talks about all this stuff in the first or 2nd file, or if you have the jap jee sahib steek by Sant Gurbachan Singh, you can check it up in there. I think Kam translated this part of the steek into english and posted it on this site once.

the issue as I see isnt whether or not non-amritdhari's, or anyone for that matter should be allowed to do keertan in gurdwaray, but instead whether or not people that distort bani from Guru Granth Sahib Jee should be allowed to do keertan in the hazoori of Guru Granth Sahib Jee. Last I checked, it is written in Guru Granth Sahib Jee "Neel Bastar lae kaprae pehirae" and not "neel bastar lae kaprae pharey" kookay can say watever they want about what kavi bhai santokh singh wrote, but the bottom line is that if Guru Gobind Singh Jee wanted to change pehirae to pharey, Guru Sahib would have done so in the Damdami Saroop...there are many changes between the kartarpuri bir and the damdami saroop, and if this was meant to be a change, it would have been put into the damdami saroop as such. To tell you the truth, this isn't even a debate, it's common sense. If I started going on stage tomorrow and saying "Ik Oankaar saach naam kartaa pursh", I would deserve to get kicked off stage for altering dhur kee bani. It makes no sense how UK Sikhs allow this type of stuff to go down in gurdwarae.

there is a lot of katha about guru gobind singh jees ithaas here http://ikirtan.com/index.php?q=f&f=%2F...aatshahi_Dasvin not having listened to it myself, I cant say what the katha is about/

I've never considered kookay to be sikhs in the first place, so I guess calling them modern day ram raiay wouldn;t be accurate. But either way, Sikhs in UK need to stop giving these guys keertan time in gurdwarey. Listen to their distortion of bani in these files. http://www.yousendit.com/download/bFFQRFFkbThiV3g1VEE9PQ http://www.yousendit.com/download/bFFQc0x6MGNrWTk1VEE9PQ

or read the end of this file the last 20-25 pages are the scanned meanings of raag mala http://www.khalsaforce.net/downloads/pdf/RaagMaala.pdf

true, but the fact that pannu is a horrible host really took away from the debate. He was too biased towards baba hari singh. Baba Hari Singh would have won the debate either way, but pannu really took away from it's credibility by barely letting the missionary/afghana people talk. I'm glad they brought up these topics tho, especially the bhai bala one. This particular topic needs to be given more attention, before it's too late and people start forgetting about our history and the historical context of many shabads.

i think all the sikhi hubs are dead, the only ones left that you may find something related to sikhi are the bhangra ones

the giani pooran singh speech is wickked... just a question tho to kam, is this the same gyani pooran singh whose katha is on gurmatveechar.com? I thought it was teh same, but the voice sounds really different,

After watching the video the question that strikes me is....why do people consider kala afghana a vidhvaan? He isn't able to answer any questions, nor is he able to make any real arguements. This debate didnt really address any important issues either. They start talking about dasam granth, but I didn't really see much of a conclusion other then 'take it up with SGPC'. The questions pertaining to the garbage Kala Afghana writes in his book weren't even brought up.

http://www.sfsikhcenter.org/ this site has the Guru Granth Sahib Jee katha that Baba Avtar Singh Jee is currently doing in Dallas it also has the Guru Granth Sahib Jee and Sooraj Prakash katha that Gyani Takhur Singh has started. The sooraj prakash katha starts right at the start of Sri Nanak prakash. you can also listen to the Gurdwara programs from el sorbante and dallas grudwara everyday where Gyani Takhur Singh and Baba Avtar Singh do katha daily. I haven't listened to much of the Guru Granth Sahib Jee katha from that site, so i cant reallly comment on how good it is, but the Guru Granth Sahib Jee katha on gurmatveechar.com by Sant Gyani Gurbachan Singh is amazing.

just type in 'satluj font download' or something along those lines in yahoo or google, and one of the sites that come up will have it

Have you found anywhere to host these files yet? If not, can you let me know the file size of each of the pdf files, and i'll see if i can find a place to get it hosted, atleast temporarily, if not permanently.

i find it funny that panthic.org accuses anyone else of hindu paranoia.

The above quote (jagmat jot biraj rahee)... where is it from? I always hear it being said, but i've never known where it was written.

who cares, read the rest of sooraj prakash, an enjoy it...its wickked or listen to the katha...there is a bunch done by gyani takhur singh on the internet (Nanak Prakash and also a bunch of Guru Gobind Singh Jee), as well as gyani jangbir singh (amazing katha about the jangs against paharhee rajae), and also some good ones done by baba hari singh

lsiten to it live at http://www.akalmultimedia.com/

incase anyone is from GTA area, there is larreevaar santhia available

lol, its funny that you still support the rebuilding of akaal takhat even after baba santa singh peshed at akaal takhat for doing it.

yes, quite chardi kala to see that right after u heard indira say that the government wants it rebuilt so it doesn't remain a monument to remember the carnage. how charhdi kala!!

once again i ask you what did you mean when you said 'Gurus have experienced the Shabad also dying.' It seems from your last post that you think it means that it is the merging into its true origin........in this case it is not the shabad tht has died, it is the persons mind that has died (lost all false desires and ego) through the shabad

please explain to me how sabad(i) does not mean 'through the shabad' please explain why there i siharee on the end of shabad, and what this is meant to mean. Guru sahib used viakaran in bani for a reason, it gives you the most basic meanings of the shabad. By completely ignoring it, you are just showing your ignorance of viakaran. Even if you listen to peoples katha that do much deeper arth of bani, they still begin at the most basic arth, or the arth given by viakaran. Also, once again I ask you, how can the shabad die? Please explain this instead of going around in circles.