Marijuana and Nihangs

[Xylitol]

http://www.mrsikhnet.com/index.php/2008/03...na-and-nihangs/

[video width=400 height=350:be5fa3a852]http://www.mrsikhnet.com/index.php/2008/03/07/marijuana-and-nihangs/[/video:be5fa3a852]

"Most Sikhs have heard of Nihangs and their usage of marijuana/sukha/bang/etc. But most don’t know why, and that in the pure tradition of the Nihangs this plant was a tool in the warrior tradition of the Sikhs. Many just hear about Nihangs using it and think that they are abusing this drug. During last years Jaap Sahib course we had Question and Answer sessions every day and participants would ask all kinds of questions. One of the questions was asked by a youth about how Nihangs justify their usage of marijuana. Jugat Guru Singh and Sadasat Simran Singh (Chardikala Jatha) give their opinion and understanding of this issue. Basically they share their experience, that while some Nihangs do abuse this tradition and use it as an intoxicant it is a real tool in the tradition of the Nihangs"

[antinang]

excuses excuses.

dharam rai will not tolerate people who do beadbi of mahraj's roop by doing such deeds while wearing it.

[unbreakable]

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[vinegar]

What have you got against marijuana? Any stigma that you may have is undoubtedly a product of growing up in western society where it is considered 'bad', which has nothing to do with Sikhism.

On what logical basis are you saying there's something wrong with it as opposed to, say, caffeine which is a lot more addictive?

[unbreakable]

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[antinang]

actually ive grown up in a pretty rubbishy area where most of my childhood friends are now on weed and most other drugs, so no I havent developed any stigma against it.

I'm against it because

1)Guru Sahib has told me it is foolish

2)Naam rass is way better

3)Mahapurash are against it.

To be honest, the Singhs of old wouldnt even have used it if even in pain, as that would be kurehit.

I know this because simply looking at their jeevan it is an insult to say that they were able to take the pain using DRUGS.

I feel extremely hurt when people say this, because you are putting these Khalsa warriors level sooo loww.

These werent people, they were PURE WAR MACHINES, THEY COULD FITH 250,000 at a time, you think they needed LOWLY DRUGS.

The guys nowadays are such JOKERS, they fight great battles against goats and then they need bhang to deal with paper cuts lmao.

Infact this use of bhang is an insult to naam. Real singhs use naam not drugs. Believe me im a lowly c*ap, but naam has even helped me through alot of physical things.

Ive been through a beating and not felt pain thanks to the lgreat dhan naam.

So you saying that these AMAZING khalsas needed weed? ppffft.

Anway, even if that argument is true, I dont see why these jokers need it now, exactly what injuries are they dealing with, apart from the ones they gained while high and out of it?

what the hell do you guys think is the kurehit anyway?

[jassasingh]

Ive been through a beating and not felt pain thanks to the lgreat dhan naam.

u said it all shriman antinang mahapursh ji brhamgeyani ...

[unbreakable]

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[vinegar]

I said that the stigma against it has nothing to do with Sikhism, not that the drug has any formal place in Sikhism. My point is that marijuana use is being demonised because people growing up in the west learn about it from the media and politicians.

Case in point - the person that was ranting about 'lowly drugs', the only way they can make that claim without being a hypocrite is if you turn down drugs that are legal/sanctioned by government too.

Most of Sikh history is passed along by oral tradition, and I have more respect for Sikh oral tradition than the opinion of some 'scholar' that I can cite, so I don't have any references to give you, but I have heard many Mahapursh mention that bahng was kept in the langar as part of sakhis teaching something else.

Marijuana in itself has no standing in Sikhism, and as such has no sanction or approval within the framework of Sikhi - my point is that recreational use in order to slightly alter the state of mind through marijuana is no different than drinking coffee to wake up in the morning, or red bull to stay awake etc.

[jassasingh]

I don't understand why people have to resort to cheap shots. Whats up, your brain not functioning, better stay off the "nihung juice".

[schild=13 fontcolor=000000 shadowcolor=C0C0C0 shieldshadow=1]cheap shoots[/schild]

say it openly u dont want anyone to write what u dont wanna hear ...

look at the itehas of panth ... have u heard of misl bhangiya ??? how they got the name what have they done for panth in vadda ghalughara ... what role they played in khalsa raj ... what status hari singh bhangi had in guru khalsa panth ???

if bhang was not allowed how come singhs like baba deep singh would have even allowed such misl to be made ... ragra was the part of panth since times of guru gobind singh ji ... in every day 5 patta tradition is there in jungs gara ragra is allowed ... not only allowed it was used ...

[antinang]

jassasingh,

what do you believe are the four kurehits?

do you think Guru Sahib would not help one of his sikhs doing simran, who are in pain?

[Maha Kharag Singh]

antinang ur soooooooooooooo in AKJ fairyland!

[jassasingh]

jassasingh,

what do you believe are the four kurehits?

do you think Guru Sahib would not help one of his sikhs doing simran, who are in pain?

are four kurehats different for different jathebandis ??? i dont think so ... kess katal par istri sabhog jagat jhoot sevan and kutha shakna are 4 kurehats according to me ....

and yes why not guru sahib help sikhs doing simran ... whats the point ??

[shaheediyan]

antinang,

Your arguements are really bordering Brothers Grimm territory.

In all seriousness, God forbid you were in a war tomorrow, and you got a limb blown off and your unattended wound caused gangrene and you were decaying to death, you seriously saying you wouldn't take medication? Bhang taken in the small quantities (5 pattai) was nothing more than a medicinal recovery and pain tolerance mechanism for the Nihang Singhs who were training (real training i.e. attaining injuries) and fighting real, bloody, vicious wars... it's really childish to judge a real tradition based on your ignorenance of pain/injury, medicine and reality or by some of the moorakh admin cut Singhs that have given this tradition a bad name by being drugged up 7 days a week for no reason.

Also, your comment on jatka makes me laugh, people that have never had a real fight (life and death), never seen blood or guts and never killed anyone, think that anyone can become a deadly soldier overnight and take the realities of war in his stride. Swinging a stick around really fast aimlessly and hitting a shield turn by turn whilst shouting Vaheguru as fast as you can does not prepare one for real war or give them the confidence to challenge sava lakh.

If you were to join any modern army today, you would be laughed at.

Also, you should read some Sikh history.

It's time to take the red pill:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8Zq_iWuFg

[antinang]

look ,living in inner london, and facing yoots, chavs,racists and the like pretty much everyday gives you enough fighting experience, more than a goat. NO im not saying street fighting is war experience but is much more than chopping off the head of a goat being held by two other people.

Anyway, naam power can make you do ANYTHING, this is Vaheguroo himself, also chandi di vaar power, you dont need anything else if you have bharosa.

Im not saying not to train either, but killing a goat does not help at all.

A compassionate warrior can easily kill a dusht but doesnt make them any less of a soldier if they feel daya for a defenceless animal.

Nihang Avtar singh brahma rode two horses and hit a target at full speed, with no prior practice in that.

Ever heard of the sakhi of the fat brahmin (forgotten the name) who had never fought, but with power of naam he went straight into jung without training?

Also remember reading abotu baba harnaam singh ji randomly getting amazing strenght after abhiyaas

However shaheediyan i will swallow my ego and say you made an extremely valid point about bhang as recovery, that makes alot of sense . Previously, the people I had spoken to would say that singhs would take the bhang before entering the battle field, that I found very insulting as it makes it seem like the singhs were more cowardly. I can understand the bhang as medicine after being wounded, like anesthetic, medicine etc.

However, what reason to take it now??

[Maha Kharag Singh]

ur soooooooo deluded antinang, seriously naam can eradicate kaarmic dosh which leads to physical pain but not on the battlefield.

Yudh Bhoomi is a completely different khand where different karmic laws apply as pointed out by Shri Krishna Avtaar.

The thing is you live in a fairyland where you think that by chanting "waheguru" a magical forcefield appears and stops a speeding bullet. If that were the case then no Singhs would have died on the battle field.

Antinang the real admin cut here is you, as you have blatant disrespect for anyone elses views and opinions.

[antinang]

sorry for any hurt ive caused. I have ego which is a huge problem for me, and it causes me to insult gursikhs, sorry.

But ive actually been told by mahapurash (not akj or nanaksar either)this power of naam that it gives physical protection, Ive experienced it first hand.

How do you think Singhs of old survived without food for so long, trapped in fortresses for months?

Death is the hukam of mahraj, and its also the hukam of mahraj in which way naam works at a certain time.

The naam protected the warriors while they were alive from physical harm, and at the time which was pre-written for their death, the naam gave the protection from jamdoots.

Sri Krishan Ji Avtar gave the right stuff for his time, but Guru Sahib came and turned everything around for his Gursikhs, no laws but Akal Purakh's apply to a complete khalsa (not any average joe singhs like me).

For example simply having uncut kesh and doing jap ji sahib under guru sahib's hukam makes one exempt from hell (this is a belief of bhindranvale sants also), so these are different rules for a sikh, even if they have commited sins, these hukams of Guru Sahib let them break the karmic rules.

Read more bani to understand the extent of naam. Naam is Vaheguroo himself, and Vaheguroo has no limits whatsoever.

ਪਿੰਗੁਲ ਪਰਬਤ ਪਾਰਿ ਪਰੇ ਖਲ ਚਤੁਰ ਬਕੀਤਾ ॥

Pingul parbaṯ pār parė kẖal cẖaṯur bakīṯā.

The cripple crosses over the mountain, the fool becomes a wise man,

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ਐਸੀ ਭਗਤਿ ਗੋਵਿੰਦ ਕੀ ਕੀਟਿ ਹਸਤੀ ਜੀਤਾ ॥

Aisī bẖagaṯ govinḏ kī kīt hasṯī jīṯā.

Such is devotional worship of the Lord of the Universe, that the ant can overpower the elephant.

check out the whole shabad on ang 809

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ਭੈਰਉ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

Bẖairo mehlā 5.

Bhairao, Fifth Mehl:

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਅੰਤਰਜਾਮੀ ॥

Nām hamārai anṯarjāmī.

The Naam, the Name of the Lord, is the Inner-knower of my heart.

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਆਵੈ ਕਾਮੀ ॥

Nām hamārai āvai kāmī.

The Naam is so useful to me.

ਰੋਮਿ ਰੋਮਿ ਰਵਿਆ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ॥

Rom rom ravi­ā har nām.

The Lord's Name permeates each and every hair of mine.

ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪੂਰੈ ਕੀਨੋ ਦਾਨੁ ॥੧॥

Saṯgur pūrai kīno ḏān. ||1||

The Perfect True Guru has given me this gift. ||1||

ਨਾਮੁ ਰਤਨੁ ਮੇਰੈ ਭੰਡਾਰ ॥

Nām raṯan mėrai bẖandār.

The Jewel of the Naam is my treasure.

ਅਗਮ ਅਮੋਲਾ ਅਪਰ ਅਪਾਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Agam amolā apar apār. ||1|| rahā­o.

It is inaccessible, priceless, infinite and incomparable. ||1||Pause||

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਨਿਹਚਲ ਧਨੀ ॥

Nām hamārai nihcẖal ḏẖanī.

The Naam is my unmoving, unchanging Lord and Master.

ਨਾਮ ਕੀ ਮਹਿਮਾ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਬਨੀ ॥

Nām kī mahimā sabẖ meh banī.

The glory of the Naam spreads over the whole world.

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਪੂਰਾ ਸਾਹੁ ॥

Nām hamārai pūrā sāhu.

The Naam is my perfect master of wealth.

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਬੇਪਰਵਾਹੁ ॥੨॥

Nām hamārai bėparvāhu. ||2||

The Naam is my independence. ||2||

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਭੋਜਨ ਭਾਉ ॥

Nām hamārai bẖojan bẖā­o.

The Naam is my food and love.

ਨਾਮੁ ਹਮਾਰੈ ਮਨ ਕਾ ਸੁਆਉ ॥

Nām hamārai man kā su­ā­o.

The Naam is the objective of my mind.

ਨਾਮੁ ਨ ਵਿਸਰੈ ਸੰਤ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥

Nām na visrai sanṯ parsāḏ.

By the Grace of the Saints, I never forget the Naam.

ਨਾਮੁ ਲੈਤ ਅਨਹਦ ਪੂਰੇ ਨਾਦ ॥੩॥

Nām laiṯ anhaḏ pūrė nāḏ. ||3||

Repeating the Naam, the Unstruck Sound-current of the Naad resounds. ||3||

ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਤੇ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਉ ਨਿਧਿ ਪਾਈ ॥

Parabẖ kirpā ṯė nām na­o niḏẖ pā­ī.

By God's Grace, I have obtained the nine treasures of the Naam.

ਗੁਰ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਤੇ ਨਾਮ ਸਿਉ ਬਨਿ ਆਈ ॥

Gur kirpā ṯė nām si­o ban ā­ī.

By Guru's Grace, I am tuned in to the Naam.

ਧਨਵੰਤੇ ਸੇਈ ਪਰਧਾਨ ॥

Ḏẖanvanṯė sė­ī parḏẖān.

They alone are wealthy and supreme,

ਨਾਨਕ ਜਾ ਕੈ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਿਧਾਨ ॥੪॥੧੭॥੩੦॥

Nānak jā kai nām niḏẖān. ||4||17||30||

O Nanak, who have the treasure of the Naam. ||4||17||30||

[SAadmin]

MKS veer i m interested to know about karmic laws discussed by krishan maharaj? Please shed some light on this?

[antinang]

The thing is you live in a fairyland where you think that by chanting "waheguru" a magical forcefield appears and stops a speeding bullet. If that were the case then no Singhs would have died on the battle field.

I think Sri Prahlad ji would beg to differ on that as would Bhagat Kabir Ji!

Baba Thakur singh ji and Singhs once became invisible to the Indian police

[Matheen]

Antinang, the things you speak of can only be experienced by those who have pure faith and prem for Maharaj Ji.

Even during Guru Ji's times these were in the minority, as Bani tells us.

One thing i don't get is how is the following shabad to be interpreted: (Ang 1377)

kbIr BWg mwCulI surw pwin jo jo pRwnI KWih ]

kabeer bhaa(n)g maashhulee suraa paan jo jo praanee khaa(n)hi ||

Kabeer, those mortals who consume marijuana, fish and wine

qIrQ brq nym kIey qy sBY rswqil jWih ]233]

theerathh barath naem keeeae thae sabhai rasaathal jaa(n)hi ||233||

- no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, they will all go to hell. ||233||

[Maha Kharag Singh]

see again your ego comes in the way of reality.

but Guru Sahib came and turned everything around for his Gursikhs, no laws but Akal Purakh's apply to a complete khalsa

Forgive me mahapurush Antinang, so its you who understands the hukkam of Satguru Sachepatshah and therefore you must dictate to us idiots his hukkam. So you must surey know Akaal purukhs hukkam then, please shower us with your kirpa and reveal this Bhramgyaan.

these hukams of Guru Sahib let them break the karmic rules

Nothing can break prakriti da vidhaan, only Lord Akaal purukh has that power, and our Satgurus clearly said that they are not God but servants of the Allmighty

The naam protected the warriors while they were alive from physical harm, and at the time which was pre-written for their death, the naam gave the protection from jamdoots.

You was there wasnt you to see the magical forcefield of naam round the warriors.

As i have said before, Yudh Bhoomi is a different khand therefore different karmic laws apply, singhs such as Bhai Mani Singh Ji did not die on the battlefield therefore the khand in which they passed on was different and in that khand boundaries can be broken, naam can stop pain etc.

When Ran Chandi is summoned she doesnt care who's blood she is drinking, may it be of the righteous or the wicked.

So please give it a rest antinang, go read up on some real books on Bhakti, Naam, Karam etc not fairytales (and no im not referring to the sakhia as fairytales)

[antinang]

We clearly have a difference of opinion, and there really is no need for sarcasm, I am willing to apologoise and call it quits, because I dont think fellow sikhs should let it go this far (well on my side anyway).

Im only talking about what mahapurash have told me, and these mahapurash (Non jathebandi, and ragmalla believer) have told me naam and moolmantar jaap infact causes protection around the reciter.

Bhull chukk maaf (and i really mean that scincerly, I hope you can all accept)

Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh

[Maha Kharag Singh]

MKS veer i m interested to know about karmic laws discussed by krishan maharaj? Please shed some light on this?

Veerji im on about Geeta Updesh by Shri Krishna Avtar, where the laws of the world are turned upside down on the battlefield. where the warriors on the side of the wicked even gain ran gatti for dying on ran bhoomi.

Shri Krishna tries to explain to Arjun that there is no such thing as paap or punya on the battlefield only death and pain.

In the veda texts if one slayes their father, uncle, brother its considered Mahapaap, but on the battlefield it counts for nothing. Because those who die on the battlefield dont get judged on what side they were on but on how valiantly and with how strong of a warrior heart they fought.

[Maha Kharag Singh]

We clearly have a difference of opinion, and there really is no need for sarcasm, I am willing to apologoise and call it quits, because I dont think fellow sikhs should let it go this far (well on my side anyway).

Im only talking about what mahapurash have told me, and these mahapurash (Non jathebandi, and ragmalla believer) have told me naam and moolmantar jaap infact causes protection around the reciter.

Bhull chukk maaf (and i really mean that scincerly, I hope you can all accept)

Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Thank you and accept on my behalf too.

I would suggest to understand our point of view is to read up on the concept of karma on Yudhbhoomi.

And another thing Gurbani is poetry, try understanding it by looking at it from that perspective. Eg when gurbani says with naam an ant can lift an elephant, this is poetic beauty, its a metaphore.

If we took the poetic beauty of gurbani to its literal meaning wed have sants and mahapurush in this world who could fly and have laser vision LOL

[Maha Kharag Singh]

Neo Paji i reckon tirath veerji would be the best person to expand on the Geeta Updesh argument