A question

[Guest A Humanbeing]

I want to ask a question....

 

God does NO wrong. He DOES NOT even think wrong.

Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?

[SAadmin]

This may answer your question:

source: Discourse on beyond II by Sant Waryam Singh Ji Ratwara sahib

 

~ Know your Real Self ~

 

 

First descended from Waheguru (God), a transparent ray, the conscious reality, which combing with nature took the epithet of living being. Round this ray, spread a mini globe- like substance, and the ray became resplendent. This state has been termed as the first separation (isolation) of atma(soul) from god(paratma) and has been called the sheath of bliss. After this, with the coming of thinking, one automatically moves into second circle of Maya (illusion). This is Miracle of Intellect. It was named the intellect of sheath. Descending lower still, there awakened the idea of making some achievement of producing something new. Affections and allurements brought this being under their control and pushed him into countless programmes, which are ever-expanding, so that the chain is never broken. The state of mind has been called the mental sheath. One was caught in the circle of resolution and repudiation. Beyond this stage, the cosmic energy pushed it still further down and called it the circle of power or the vital sheath. This power was born out of the relationships of the illusion. After this, it assumed some form and went on assuming different forms. As Guru Maharaj has ordained-

 

For several births thou became a worm and a moth.

In several birth thou wert an elephant, a fish and a deer.

In several births thou became a birth and a snake.

In several births thou were t yoked as a horse and a ox. SGGS JI- 176.

 

This cirlce of different bodies is called "Annmayee Kosh". Kosh the sheath of food.

 

In this way, this pure consciousness (drop) went on amassing around it tendencies towards illusions. It forgot its real nature and completely lost thought of the fact as to Who I am, and wherefrom I have come. Not recognizing oneself as the pure (divine) light, one started looking on oneself as just the body, which is made of five elements which is subject to all sorts of ills. The wise called this circle as sheath of food. It forsook it's real state of supreme happiness and considering oneself as the being of dust, it from the time immortal, has been going through the circle of births and deaths and has been experiencing untold miseries. He has been weeping and crying and lamenting. He does not realize how could he reunited with his original source(God), Who is all truth, all super consciousness and never ending bliss; and return to his original stage. So caught in miseries, he keeps on lamenting.

 

The seers, the prophets, the saints and sages, philosophers, and those who have known the secrets of the Divine have told man many supernatural ways to the real true path. These prophets having coming out of the source of all purity appeared in the most holy forms. They by their saying gave to man the gospel of vedas and puranas, bible and holy writ all of which assumed their loftiest form in the shape of Siri Guru Granth Sahib.

 

The fifth emperor of the world Guru Arjan Dev has commanded thus, to free his being from the circle of world of woe-

 

Sing the praise of the lord, O friendly saints, with alertness and single mindedness. SGGS JI - 295

 

This is a very simple path, treading on which man, over coming countless obstacles one can merge into his real self, which is all light. To achieve this goal, concentration of mind is extremely necessary. So long as one does not know how to achieve concentration of mind, that long all his prayers and other efforts remain fruitless. There are some tendencies of mind, which do not allow one to achieve concentration of mind. Of these, the first tendency is named Mentality of Evidence.

 

1. Mentality of Evidence (Parman Birthi/Regarding the outward world as the Supreme reality)- Whatever is the spread that is visible, they may be children, wife, parents, one's own body the different relationships of the bodies, friends, enemies, things that brings joys or sorrows remaining engrossed in all these things is termed Mindset of evidence. To withdraw the mind from this world of sights and sounds seems extremely difficult. Till one gets the guidance of a perfect Guru, one cannot be liberated from this visible world. Guru Maharaj's sermon is-

 

All that is seen, shall go not with thee, O Man. So abandon thou thy self-conceit and worldly attachment SGGS Ji- 1230

 

This being knows that he is not to stay in this world for all time, nor are sons and daughters, wife, parents eternal in the world, yet when one of them dies, he is over-whelmed with unbearable grief at their separation and can't rise above this slush.

 

2. The reverse mindset ( viparje birthi)- The second type of mentality is named the Reverse Mindset. In this stage, everything appears the opposite of what it is; things non-existent appear to have existed, and things existing seem non-existing. It is like the example of a traveling in summer through the desert, where man being tortured by thirst is desperately in need of water to quench his thirst. In the desert land, he has mirage that a river over-flowing with cold water is flowing at some distance from him. This deception seems to give to him some feeling to be a true fact. But when he reaches that place, he finds nothing there. It was just a mirage. Similarly, everyday he sees the world with his eyes and hears it with his ears and regards this outward world as full truth.

 

Before our very eyes, this world is seen passing away. SGGS JI - 325

 

Still he regards the world as a true reality. On the other hand Waheguru Ji, who is omnipresent and is immanent everywhere-

 

Wherever I see, there I see him present. He, my master, is never far from any place.

O my soul, ever remember him, who is contained in everything. SGGS Ji- 677

 

In the earth, in the sky

There pervades a light in all.

It can't be added to, nothing can be subtracted from it.

It permits no change (Akal Ustati, Siri Dasam Granth).

 

 

According to this holy write, inside and outside, all is full of good. With his power, go on the entire operation of the world; with the power of his name, the world appears, man regards this all pervading spirit as untrue. There is not trace of doubt in such a person. He feels that the world around him is all truth and God, who is All-perfection, spread all-round in the Universe is untrue. This mentality is called opposite Mindset. Guru Maharaj makes reference to it-

 

This world is the mountain of smoke.

What thought has made thee deem it real? SGGS Ji- 1187.

 

3. The sleeping mentality (niranda birthi)- The third type of mentality is called sleeping mindset. Man knows all and reads all, still he keeps lost under the power of sleep. This stage of forgetting the Reality is called the sleeping mentality.

 

4. Alternative Mentality (vikalp birthi)- The four kind is named Alternative mentality. Man does small good acts such as giving charity, the recitation of the bani and holy singing, and with the aid of these small items, he has hope of great fruit. In other words, under the influence of this mentality, one feels the great effect of desires. Little service and alternative mentality does not allow the mind to achieve full concentration in the prayers to God.

 

5. Remembering Mentality (Simriti Birthi)- The fifth type is the Remembering Mentality. When a person begins prayer and obeisance to God, when he starts recitation of the gospel, and when he tries to unite his consciousness with God's name, he has memories of long-forgotten things. This memory mindset does not allow him to offer prayers whole heartedly; his reading of the holy texts won't bear fruit.

 

Try to understand this fact by means of a parable. When Guru Nanak, the emperor of the world, while bathing in the Bein River plunged into water and came out after three days, he was repeating only one saying-

 

I am Neither a Hindu, Nor a Muslim.

My body and soul belong to Him, who is called God of Muslims and the lord of Hindus. SGGS Ji- 1136

 

[ibrute]

Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?

There is no fun in that for god. Just think like god was alone and bored, so he programmed a single player game called "The life" which has drama, sex, bliss, sorrow, joy all that. We are all players in this game, There are levels in this game, the final level is human body. Goal is to finish game on individual level and got out of game and reward is eternal bliss and cup of tea in the company of god. The game finishers individuals will never have to play this game again. If you did not finish the game in human lifetime, what level you have to start playing again only god knows.

Bottom line is god is very kind, the moment game start from level 1, lets call it big bang and when it reaches human level say X, then the kindness of god comes into play, at that moment onwards from time to time, he sends cheat codes and manuals lets call them saints to tell the game players the goal of the game and ways to complete it. But we don't listen, thats how strongly he coded the game.

Edited June 10, 2015 by ibrute

[Guest]

This may answer your question:

source: Discourse on beyond II by Sant Waryam Singh Ji Ratwara sahib

 

~ Know your Real Self ~

 

 

First descended from Waheguru (God), a transparent ray, the conscious reality, which combing with nature took the epithet of living being. Round this ray, spread a mini globe- like substance, and the ray became resplendent. This state has been termed as the first separation (isolation) of atma(soul) from god(paratma) and has been called the sheath of bliss. After this, with the coming of thinking, one automatically moves into second circle of Maya (illusion). This is Miracle of Intellect. It was named the intellect of sheath. Descending lower still, there awakened the idea of making some achievement of producing something new. Affections and allurements brought this being under their control and pushed him into countless programmes, which are ever-expanding, so that the chain is never broken. The state of mind has been called the mental sheath. One was caught in the circle of resolution and repudiation. Beyond this stage, the cosmic energy pushed it still further down and called it the circle of power or the vital sheath. This power was born out of the relationships of the illusion. After this, it assumed some form and went on assuming different forms. As Guru Maharaj has ordained-

 

For several births thou became a worm and a moth.

In several birth thou wert an elephant, a fish and a deer.

In several births thou became a birth and a snake.

In several births thou were t yoked as a horse and a ox. SGGS JI- 176.

 

This cirlce of different bodies is called "Annmayee Kosh". Kosh the sheath of food.

 

In this way, this pure consciousness (drop) went on amassing around it tendencies towards illusions. It forgot its real nature and completely lost thought of the fact as to Who I am, and wherefrom I have come. Not recognizing oneself as the pure (divine) light, one started looking on oneself as just the body, which is made of five elements which is subject to all sorts of ills. The wise called this circle as sheath of food. It forsook it's real state of supreme happiness and considering oneself as the being of dust, it from the time immortal, has been going through the circle of births and deaths and has been experiencing untold miseries. He has been weeping and crying and lamenting. He does not realize how could he reunited with his original source(God), Who is all truth, all super consciousness and never ending bliss; and return to his original stage. So caught in miseries, he keeps on lamenting.

 

The seers, the prophets, the saints and sages, philosophers, and those who have known the secrets of the Divine have told man many supernatural ways to the real true path. These prophets having coming out of the source of all purity appeared in the most holy forms. They by their saying gave to man the gospel of vedas and puranas, bible and holy writ all of which assumed their loftiest form in the shape of Siri Guru Granth Sahib.

 

The fifth emperor of the world Guru Arjan Dev has commanded thus, to free his being from the circle of world of woe-

 

Sing the praise of the lord, O friendly saints, with alertness and single mindedness. SGGS JI - 295

 

This is a very simple path, treading on which man, over coming countless obstacles one can merge into his real self, which is all light. To achieve this goal, concentration of mind is extremely necessary. So long as one does not know how to achieve concentration of mind, that long all his prayers and other efforts remain fruitless. There are some tendencies of mind, which do not allow one to achieve concentration of mind. Of these, the first tendency is named Mentality of Evidence.

 

1. Mentality of Evidence (Parman Birthi/Regarding the outward world as the Supreme reality)- Whatever is the spread that is visible, they may be children, wife, parents, one's own body the different relationships of the bodies, friends, enemies, things that brings joys or sorrows remaining engrossed in all these things is termed Mindset of evidence. To withdraw the mind from this world of sights and sounds seems extremely difficult. Till one gets the guidance of a perfect Guru, one cannot be liberated from this visible world. Guru Maharaj's sermon is-

 

All that is seen, shall go not with thee, O Man. So abandon thou thy self-conceit and worldly attachment SGGS Ji- 1230

 

This being knows that he is not to stay in this world for all time, nor are sons and daughters, wife, parents eternal in the world, yet when one of them dies, he is over-whelmed with unbearable grief at their separation and can't rise above this slush.

 

2. The reverse mindset ( viparje birthi)- The second type of mentality is named the Reverse Mindset. In this stage, everything appears the opposite of what it is; things non-existent appear to have existed, and things existing seem non-existing. It is like the example of a traveling in summer through the desert, where man being tortured by thirst is desperately in need of water to quench his thirst. In the desert land, he has mirage that a river over-flowing with cold water is flowing at some distance from him. This deception seems to give to him some feeling to be a true fact. But when he reaches that place, he finds nothing there. It was just a mirage. Similarly, everyday he sees the world with his eyes and hears it with his ears and regards this outward world as full truth.

 

Before our very eyes, this world is seen passing away. SGGS JI - 325

 

Still he regards the world as a true reality. On the other hand Waheguru Ji, who is omnipresent and is immanent everywhere-

 

Wherever I see, there I see him present. He, my master, is never far from any place.

O my soul, ever remember him, who is contained in everything. SGGS Ji- 677

 

In the earth, in the sky

There pervades a light in all.

It can't be added to, nothing can be subtracted from it.

It permits no change (Akal Ustati, Siri Dasam Granth).

 

 

According to this holy write, inside and outside, all is full of good. With his power, go on the entire operation of the world; with the power of his name, the world appears, man regards this all pervading spirit as untrue. There is not trace of doubt in such a person. He feels that the world around him is all truth and God, who is All-perfection, spread all-round in the Universe is untrue. This mentality is called opposite Mindset. Guru Maharaj makes reference to it-

 

This world is the mountain of smoke.

What thought has made thee deem it real? SGGS Ji- 1187.

 

3. The sleeping mentality (niranda birthi)- The third type of mentality is called sleeping mindset. Man knows all and reads all, still he keeps lost under the power of sleep. This stage of forgetting the Reality is called the sleeping mentality.

 

4. Alternative Mentality (vikalp birthi)- The four kind is named Alternative mentality. Man does small good acts such as giving charity, the recitation of the bani and holy singing, and with the aid of these small items, he has hope of great fruit. In other words, under the influence of this mentality, one feels the great effect of desires. Little service and alternative mentality does not allow the mind to achieve full concentration in the prayers to God.

 

5. Remembering Mentality (Simriti Birthi)- The fifth type is the Remembering Mentality. When a person begins prayer and obeisance to God, when he starts recitation of the gospel, and when he tries to unite his consciousness with God's name, he has memories of long-forgotten things. This memory mindset does not allow him to offer prayers whole heartedly; his reading of the holy texts won't bear fruit.

 

Try to understand this fact by means of a parable. When Guru Nanak, the emperor of the world, while bathing in the Bein River plunged into water and came out after three days, he was repeating only one saying-

 

I am Neither a Hindu, Nor a Muslim.

My body and soul belong to Him, who is called God of Muslims and the lord of Hindus. SGGS Ji- 1136

 

I have read in detail what you have posted...

I think a good being like God WOULD NEVER create illusion that is able to take people away from him.

If He has to create someone, He would keep him/her/it with him only so that they never leave the state of pure happiness in the very first place.

Making someone and then putting him to test (when you can make him 'evil proof' just like yourself) does not seem to be the work of a 'good being'.

In this world 'life eats life' for survival. We kill others (plants and animals in order to survive and then only we are able to do religious/ good deeds). This scheme of things seems to be a work of some evil entity.

By the way, I myself believe in God but have many questions unanswered.

 

One thing more, if Nanak said, there is no Hindu and no Muslim, it also means that there is no Sikh....All are humanbeings only.

[Guest]

Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?

There is no fun in that for god. Just think like god was alone and bored, so he programmed a single player game called "The life" which has drama, sex, bliss, sorrow, joy all that. We are all players in this game, There are levels in this game, the final level is human body. Goal is to finish game on individual level and got out of game and reward is eternal bliss and cup of tea in the company of god. The game finishers individuals will never have to play this game again. If you did not finish the game in human lifetime, what level you have to start playing again only god knows.

Bottom line is god is very kind, the moment game start from level 1, lets call it big bang and when it reaches human level say X, then the kindness of god comes into play, at that moment onwards from time to time, he sends cheat codes and manuals lets call them saints to tell the game players the goal of the game and ways to complete it. But we don't listen, thats how strongly he coded the game.

A perfect being cannot get bored....

A perfectly good being can never create a game that has evil in addition to good. His game would be a perfectly good game by default.

[ibrute]

Dude, the analogy I used is just a funny way to say things, off course god is not bored though he created everything out of fun, why ? because he can. If you want to know for yourself. You need a teacher, who can show you the answer to the puzzle called as life, that teacher in sikhism is Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee Maharaj.

 

[Guest]

Dude, the analogy I used is just a funny way to say things, off course god is not bored though he created everything out of fun, why ? because he can. If you want to know for yourself. You need a teacher, who can show you the answer to the puzzle called as life, that teacher in sikhism is Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee Maharaj.

 

That's why i have posted this question on a religious forum, because people here read, study and research their holy book and are therefore better equipped to answer such questions...

[Guest]

This shabad pretty much clears it up, this gurbani mahavak is been used by our traditional parcharikhs to point out absolute reality and also presented as transcedence discourse for a seeker who is stuck in transient form (relative reality):

 

http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=736

 

ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥ ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥

Ik▫oaʼnkār saṯgur parsāḏ. 

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

 

ਬਾਜੀਗਰਿ ਜੈਸੇ ਬਾਜੀ ਪਾਈ ॥ बाजीगरि जैसे बाजी पाई ॥ 

Bājīgar jaise bājī pā▫ī. The actor stages the play,

 

ਨਾਨਾ ਰੂਪ ਭੇਖ ਦਿਖਲਾਈ ॥ नाना रूप भेख दिखलाई ॥ Nānā rūp bẖekẖ ḏikẖlā▫ī.

playing the many characters in different costumes;

 

ਸਾਂਗੁ ਉਤਾਰਿ ਥੰਮ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਪਾਸਾਰਾ ॥ सांगु उतारि थम्हिओ पासारा ॥ 

Sāʼng uṯār thamiĥa▫o pāsārā. but when the play ends, he takes off the costumes,

 

 

ਤਬ ਏਕੋ ਏਕੰਕਾਰਾ ॥੧॥ तब एको एकंकारा ॥१॥

Ŧab eko ekankārā. ||1|| and then he is one, and only one. ||1||

 

ਕਵਨ ਰੂਪ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿਓ ਬਿਨਸਾਇਓ ॥ कवन रूप द्रिसटिओ बिनसाइओ ॥ 

Kavan rūp ḏaristi▫o binsā▫i▫o.

How many forms and images appeared and disappeared?

 

ਕਤਹਿ ਗਇਓ ਉਹੁ ਕਤ ਤੇ ਆਇਓ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ कतहि गइओ उहु कत ते आइओ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ Kaṯėh ga▫i▫o uho kaṯ ṯe ā▫i▫o. ||1|| rahā▫o. 

Where have they gone? Where did they come from? ||1||Pause||

 

ਜਲ ਤੇ ਊਠਹਿ ਅਨਿਕ ਤਰੰਗਾ ॥ जल ते ऊठहि अनिक तरंगा ॥ Jal ṯe ūṯẖėh anik ṯarangā.

Countless waves rise up from the water.

 

ਕਨਿਕ ਭੂਖਨ ਕੀਨੇ ਬਹੁ ਰੰਗਾ ॥ कनिक भूखन कीने बहु रंगा ॥

Kanik bẖūkẖan kīne baho rangā. Jewels and ornaments of many different forms are fashioned from gold.

 

ਬੀਜੁ ਬੀਜਿ ਦੇਖਿਓ ਬਹੁ ਪਰਕਾਰਾ ॥ बीजु बीजि देखिओ बहु परकारा ॥

Bīj bīj ḏekẖi▫o baho parkārā. I have seen seeds of all kinds being planted -

 

ਫਲ ਪਾਕੇ ਤੇ ਏਕੰਕਾਰਾ ॥੨॥ फल पाके ते एकंकारा ॥२॥ Fal pāke ṯe ekankārā. ||2||

when the fruit ripens, the seeds appear in the same form as the original. ||2||

 

ਸਹਸ ਘਟਾ ਮਹਿ ਏਕੁ ਆਕਾਸੁ ॥ सहस घटा महि एकु आकासु ॥ Sahas gẖatā mėh ek ākās.

The one sky is reflected in thousands of water jugs,

 

ਘਟ ਫੂਟੇ ਤੇ ਓਹੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਾਸੁ ॥ घट फूटे ते ओही प्रगासु ॥

Gẖat fūte ṯe ohī pargās. but when the jugs are broken, only the sky remains.

 

ਭਰਮ ਲੋਭ ਮੋਹ ਮਾਇਆ ਵਿਕਾਰ ॥ भरम लोभ मोह माइआ विकार ॥

Bẖaram lobẖ moh mā▫i▫ā vikār. Doubt comes from greed, emotional attachment and the corruption of Maya.

 

ਭ੍ਰਮ ਛੂਟੇ ਤੇ ਏਕੰਕਾਰ ॥੩॥ भ्रम छूटे ते एकंकार ॥३॥ Bẖaram cẖẖūte ṯe ekankār. ||3||

Freed from doubt, one realizes the One Lord alone. ||3||

 

 

[Guest]

This shabad pretty much clears it up, this gurbani mahavak is been used by our traditional parcharikhs to point out absolute reality and also presented as transcedence discourse for a seeker who is stuck in transient form (relative reality):

 

http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=736

 

ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥ ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥

Ik▫oaʼnkār saṯgur parsāḏ. 

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

 

ਬਾਜੀਗਰਿ ਜੈਸੇ ਬਾਜੀ ਪਾਈ ॥ बाजीगरि जैसे बाजी पाई ॥ 

Bājīgar jaise bājī pā▫ī. The actor stages the play,

 

ਨਾਨਾ ਰੂਪ ਭੇਖ ਦਿਖਲਾਈ ॥ नाना रूप भेख दिखलाई ॥ Nānā rūp bẖekẖ ḏikẖlā▫ī.

playing the many characters in different costumes;

 

ਸਾਂਗੁ ਉਤਾਰਿ ਥੰਮ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਪਾਸਾਰਾ ॥ सांगु उतारि थम्हिओ पासारा ॥ 

Sāʼng uṯār thamiĥa▫o pāsārā. but when the play ends, he takes off the costumes,

 

 

ਤਬ ਏਕੋ ਏਕੰਕਾਰਾ ॥੧॥ तब एको एकंकारा ॥१॥

Ŧab eko ekankārā. ||1|| and then he is one, and only one. ||1||

 

ਕਵਨ ਰੂਪ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿਓ ਬਿਨਸਾਇਓ ॥ कवन रूप द्रिसटिओ बिनसाइओ ॥ 

Kavan rūp ḏaristi▫o binsā▫i▫o.

How many forms and images appeared and disappeared?

 

ਕਤਹਿ ਗਇਓ ਉਹੁ ਕਤ ਤੇ ਆਇਓ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ कतहि गइओ उहु कत ते आइओ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ Kaṯėh ga▫i▫o uho kaṯ ṯe ā▫i▫o. ||1|| rahā▫o. 

Where have they gone? Where did they come from? ||1||Pause||

 

ਜਲ ਤੇ ਊਠਹਿ ਅਨਿਕ ਤਰੰਗਾ ॥ जल ते ऊठहि अनिक तरंगा ॥ Jal ṯe ūṯẖėh anik ṯarangā.

Countless waves rise up from the water.

 

ਕਨਿਕ ਭੂਖਨ ਕੀਨੇ ਬਹੁ ਰੰਗਾ ॥ कनिक भूखन कीने बहु रंगा ॥

Kanik bẖūkẖan kīne baho rangā. Jewels and ornaments of many different forms are fashioned from gold.

 

ਬੀਜੁ ਬੀਜਿ ਦੇਖਿਓ ਬਹੁ ਪਰਕਾਰਾ ॥ बीजु बीजि देखिओ बहु परकारा ॥

Bīj bīj ḏekẖi▫o baho parkārā. I have seen seeds of all kinds being planted -

 

ਫਲ ਪਾਕੇ ਤੇ ਏਕੰਕਾਰਾ ॥੨॥ फल पाके ते एकंकारा ॥२॥ Fal pāke ṯe ekankārā. ||2||

when the fruit ripens, the seeds appear in the same form as the original. ||2||

 

ਸਹਸ ਘਟਾ ਮਹਿ ਏਕੁ ਆਕਾਸੁ ॥ सहस घटा महि एकु आकासु ॥ Sahas gẖatā mėh ek ākās.

The one sky is reflected in thousands of water jugs,

 

ਘਟ ਫੂਟੇ ਤੇ ਓਹੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਾਸੁ ॥ घट फूटे ते ओही प्रगासु ॥

Gẖat fūte ṯe ohī pargās. but when the jugs are broken, only the sky remains.

 

ਭਰਮ ਲੋਭ ਮੋਹ ਮਾਇਆ ਵਿਕਾਰ ॥ भरम लोभ मोह माइआ विकार ॥

Bẖaram lobẖ moh mā▫i▫ā vikār. Doubt comes from greed, emotional attachment and the corruption of Maya.

 

ਭ੍ਰਮ ਛੂਟੇ ਤੇ ਏਕੰਕਾਰ ॥੩॥ भ्रम छूटे ते एकंकार ॥३॥ Bẖaram cẖẖūte ṯe ekankār. ||3||

Freed from doubt, one realizes the One Lord alone. ||3||

 

 

Again, a perfectly good being will never create something that is an illusion/maya. This would be against His very true nature. 

If we think that maya is somehow beyond the control of the true creator, then the above shabad makes sense.....that we have to free ourselves from maya to reach upto God.

but....if God Himself has created this play of maya...this raises questions at His truely good nature.  A good being CANNOT do such a thing. He would be in principle against any kind of illusion or falsehood. IMO

[DSG]

Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?

Good question very deep .

 

I don't think you will ever find an answer to this question there will  be further questions from the answers sort. But I believe we are here to make a connection with the almighty. That relationship is unique for every individual , no one else . So my experiences may be different than the next persons and so on , and its this relationship we need to make strong by meditating, seva , gurbani santhyia etc.. and when done from the heart one will experience wonders, things will start making sense , questions answered etc.. This relationship is the key and is between you and god only not you the neighbour and his cousin and god , just you and god no one can take that away, so you will know if you have a connection, or none at all, or getting one , or want to obtain one . I believe we must act on the Gurus word ( this i know is very hard to do, easier said than done )  We/I try to find answers first rather than doing , but if we do/act on the Gurus word( sri Guru Granth sahib Ji) then answers will be obtained by mere actions and wahegurus Kirpa and if one goes on the spiritual path , i believe Waheguru will guide us all the way through happy and tough times, it may noit be immediately apparent but when reflected upon after some one will realise the truth.

Just my 2p's worth may be relevant/irrelevant.

 

 

[Guest]

Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?

 

He already made us like himself. Due to ignorance, we feel separation but in reality we are all ONE, there is no difference between us-atma and paratma as mentioned in gurbani and also as mentioned in gurbani after self realization one rises above from paap(sin) and paun(good deed) all that becomes relatives as one lives life from absolute point of view which is everything is expression of vahiguroo, vahiguru expressing itself via creation, preservation and destructions all gunas(sato,rajo, tamo). Anyway here is profound discourse of sri guru gobind singh ji to his sikhs and to all as to what we all are. Question is are we ready to un-identify with our thoughts, false identify, ignorance and identify with our real saroop in spontaneous recognition like spontaneous flash in the sky? In order to be prepared to have that spark of knowing oneself or have that spark of recognition, grace of vahiguru is required but grace is here and now in present moment that has to recognized by naam simran (Truth remembrance) all the time, truth remembrance as to what is really true? our identification with our real self or identification with ignorance? One feel really at home other one enormous suffering and pain-rebirths. 

 

ਚਰਿਓ ਆਤਮਾ ਪਰਾਤਮਾ ਸੰਗ ॥ ਉਤਭੁਜ ਸਰੂਪ ਅਬਿਗਤ ਅਭੰਗ ॥

उचरिओ आतमा परातमा संग ॥ उतभुज सरूप अबिगत अभंग ॥

The soul said to the Higher Soul; the Germinating Entity, Unmanifested and Invincible;

 

ਇਹ ਕਉਨ ਆਹਿ ਆਤਮਾ ਸਰੂਪ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਅਮਿਤ ਤੇਜ ਅਤਿਭੂਤਿ ਬਿਭੂਤਿ ॥੨॥੧੨੭॥

इह कउन आहि आतमा सरूप ॥ जिह अमित तेज अतिभूति बिभूति ॥२॥१२७॥

What is this Soul Entity? Which hath indelible glory and which is of queer substance."2.127.

 

ਪਰਾਤਮਾ ਬਾਚ ॥

परातमा बाच ॥

The Higher Soul said:

 

ਯਹਿ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਆਹਿ ਆਤਮਾ ਰਾਮ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਅਮਿਤ ਤੇਜਿ ਅਬਿਗਤ ਅਕਾਮ ॥

यहि ब्रहम आहि आतमा राम ॥ जिह अमित तेजि अबिगत अकाम ॥

This Soul is itself Brahman;" Who is of Everlasting Glory and is Unmanisfested and Desireless.

 

ਜਿਹ ਭੇਦ ਭਰਮ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਮ ਕਾਲ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਸਤ੍ਰ ਮਿਤ੍ਰ ਸਰਬਾ ਦਿਆਲ ॥੩॥੧੨੮॥

जिह भेद भरम नहीं करम काल ॥ जिह सत्र मित्र सरबा दिआल ॥३॥१२८॥

Who is indiscriminate, actionless and deathless; Who hath no enemy and friend and is Merciful towards all.3.1228.

 

[Guest]

Good question very deep .

 

I don't think you will ever find an answer to this question there will  be further questions from the answers sort. But I believe we are here to make a connection with the almighty. That relationship is unique for every individual , no one else . So my experiences may be different than the next persons and so on , and its this relationship we need to make strong by meditating, seva , gurbani santhyia etc.. and when done from the heart one will experience wonders, things will start making sense , questions answered etc.. This relationship is the key and is between you and god only not you the neighbour and his cousin and god , just you and god no one can take that away, so you will know if you have a connection, or none at all, or getting one , or want to obtain one . I believe we must act on the Gurus word ( this i know is very hard to do, easier said than done )  We/I try to find answers first rather than doing , but if we do/act on the Gurus word( sri Guru Granth sahib Ji) then answers will be obtained by mere actions and wahegurus Kirpa and if one goes on the spiritual path , i believe Waheguru will guide us all the way through happy and tough times, it may noit be immediately apparent but when reflected upon after some one will realise the truth.

Just my 2p's worth may be relevant/irrelevant.

 

 

That's why i ask such questions on religious forums. 

Aren't people on these forums travelling on the spiritual path...What answers have THEY GOT to such questions after following the spiritual path for such a long time????

[Guest]

 

He already made us like himself. Due to ignorance, we feel separation but in reality we are all ONE, there is no difference between us-atma and paratma as mentioned in gurbani and also as mentioned in gurbani after self realization one rises above from paap(sin) and paun(good deed) all that becomes relatives as one lives life from absolute point of view which is everything is expression of vahiguroo, vahiguru expressing itself via creation, preservation and destructions all gunas(sato,rajo, tamo). Anyway here is profound discourse of sri guru gobind singh ji to his sikhs and to all as to what we all are. Question is are we ready to un-identify with our thoughts, false identify, ignorance and identify with our real saroop in spontaneous recognition like spontaneous flash in the sky? In order to be prepared to have that spark of knowing oneself or have that spark of recognition, grace of vahiguru is required but grace is here and now in present moment that has to recognized by naam simran (Truth remembrance) all the time, truth remembrance as to what is really true? our identification with our real self or identification with ignorance? One feel really at home other one enormous suffering and pain-rebirths. 

 

ਚਰਿਓ ਆਤਮਾ ਪਰਾਤਮਾ ਸੰਗ ॥ ਉਤਭੁਜ ਸਰੂਪ ਅਬਿਗਤ ਅਭੰਗ ॥

उचरिओ आतमा परातमा संग ॥ उतभुज सरूप अबिगत अभंग ॥

The soul said to the Higher Soul; the Germinating Entity, Unmanifested and Invincible;

 

ਇਹ ਕਉਨ ਆਹਿ ਆਤਮਾ ਸਰੂਪ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਅਮਿਤ ਤੇਜ ਅਤਿਭੂਤਿ ਬਿਭੂਤਿ ॥੨॥੧੨੭॥

इह कउन आहि आतमा सरूप ॥ जिह अमित तेज अतिभूति बिभूति ॥२॥१२७॥

What is this Soul Entity? Which hath indelible glory and which is of queer substance."2.127.

 

ਪਰਾਤਮਾ ਬਾਚ ॥

परातमा बाच ॥

The Higher Soul said:

 

ਯਹਿ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਆਹਿ ਆਤਮਾ ਰਾਮ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਅਮਿਤ ਤੇਜਿ ਅਬਿਗਤ ਅਕਾਮ ॥

यहि ब्रहम आहि आतमा राम ॥ जिह अमित तेजि अबिगत अकाम ॥

This Soul is itself Brahman;" Who is of Everlasting Glory and is Unmanisfested and Desireless.

 

ਜਿਹ ਭੇਦ ਭਰਮ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਮ ਕਾਲ ॥ ਜਿਹ ਸਤ੍ਰ ਮਿਤ੍ਰ ਸਰਬਾ ਦਿਆਲ ॥੩॥੧੨੮॥

जिह भेद भरम नहीं करम काल ॥ जिह सत्र मित्र सरबा दिआल ॥३॥१२८॥

Who is indiscriminate, actionless and deathless; Who hath no enemy and friend and is Merciful towards all.3.1228.

 

I am sorry u haven't followed my point.....

God has NO ignorance whatsoever.....why hasn't He made us like Him so that we are also NOT ignorant and NEVER DO anything wrong.

If u have to make somebody and u are perfectly good, WOULD YOU make him susceptible to ignorance and evil?....tell me....

[Singh123456777]

In my lowly opinion I think god is a being with both good and bad. I cannot attribute god to only good cause then that would mean that there is some other entity that controls the bad such as how the Christians say satan is the controller of bad. That would mean that something can challenge god. In my opinion i want a god to be all powerful. God is good and bad. God is kind and cruel. We are trying to put god into a box and label it. God is the king and god is the monk and god is the prey and god is the predator etc. 

[Guest]

Exactly here bij mantar sums it up quite well, there are no distincations between good and bad:

Ik Oankar - One universal Eternal Absolute unchanged Awareness Being-Light-Knowledge- God- all in one, one in all-  expressing itself in its movement - creating, preserving and changing-destruction creation spontaneously effortlessly

 

[das]

See first of all, it is only The God who can provide you with clearcut and correct answer. Rest of us can only answer as per our own real understanding (which may or may not be correct or in-between).

That been said, here is what I understood till this point in my journey (since all the previous births). In future this understanding could be more refined or replaced by another understanding depending upon the stage. But always bottom line is: We should try to go towards the source and anything that brings you closer to Source or makes you more determined to go to Source is always good.

Apart from your question "Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?" there are other couple of questions like the following which made me think what and where are we in reality.
Why lot of people are suffering (especially children)?
Why there are so many problems in this world: mainly WAR, HUNGER, DISEASES?
Why the corrupt/manipulators are the top leaders or almost all countries?

And before people jump and say, oh these are the karmas; please understand that I do believe in karma and yes, it is because of karma. But from where karma comes? and what was the original bad karma that got worse? and so on..........just see the following images, my heart melts to see anyone suffering..........As Guru Nanak Dev Ji says...... "Tain Ki Dard Na Aaya......"

Hunger:

WAR:

So, my understanding is that: The working of this universe including all the necessary Laws (including karma) is being handled by some entity (call it Negative power (in sense of hindering Soul's Spiritual progress) , Kaal, Mind, Time, etc.). He is the owner of this universe. He is not kind. His sole intention is to keep its resources (Souls) trapped in his world. Most of the people, refer him as God by mistake. Some more knowlegable call the other side of the coin (Positive force) as God but real God is beyond them. Actually, Kaal (Negative power) as well as Positive power (Akal) were created by HIM (real Truth/God). Kaal was given the ownership and knowledge of this universe by the God.

Now, the question remains why the hell real God gave the ownership to the Kaal? and Why God didn't interfere in the world's problems directly?
- The way I understood is that: God is bound by his bhagats (you can find references in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji). Kaal is the bhagat of God and he had done very hard meditation on real God and then got all this. He (real God) does took pity (and at the same time honoring Kaal's promise) and send various Gurus and Saints to remind us our real home. But Gurus and Saints are also bound by the rules, so they can't just take everyone with them. They can only tell us the real stuff and then if anyone is willing to trust and work, then he can use his free-will and get out of this Kaal's world. Kaal is also bound by one rule that: He cannot stop anyone from going beyond but he can play tricks to lead us to false source.

So, here is the condensed version of my thinking:
1. This whole universe is run by Kaal (Negative power) and Maya (Illusion). But the real God's Essence is always present everywhere. Nothing can operate without that Essence.
2. Rules are this universe are setup in such a way that noone can go beyond the Mind. e.g If one wants to get God by his meditation alone then it is not possible; because when we die, many millions of living creatures (germs etc.) also die within our body and due to this we've to pay the karma etc.
* Understanding the first 2 points are very important because it means that whatsoever we can see, feel is fake and we should be determined to go beyond. Now, the next steps are: *
3. The God allows all this play because Kaal is HIS bhagat and he took promises from God. or May be God really wants us to experience this. Only God knows.
4. The only way out is via Guru's Kirpa. e.g Karmas cannot take us beyond; therefore the whole hope is Guru who will take the seeker slowly via Middle path.
5. Regularly real God sends the liberated ones (real Saints) to remind us our truth home.
6. We do NOT have to find the Guru. Guru will find us once the seeker is ready. i.e after exhausting all the possible ways and hard work.
7. So, what we can do NOW is: Naam, Daan, and Isnaan. Keep meditating with longing for HIM; give charity (not only money but help people in need).

One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.

But these days, it is very hard to find a real Brahmgyani and therefore it seems like 2nd point is the best of both worlds and a time will come (may be in this birth or next) when one will meet the True Guru. Till then, just keep trying.

If you want to learn more, then the following are the best:
- http://www.santmat-thetruth.de/tl_files/allgemein-content/schriften/pdf/books/anurag-sagar-en.pdf
- The Matrix movie 1 and 2: this basically shows how could illusion could work. This particular movie has many many very deep concepts but one could understand only that resonates with one's current level.

das

[Lucky]

Excellent post Das!!

Appreciate the length and effort that has been inserted.

[Guest]

In my lowly opinion I think god is a being with both good and bad. I cannot attribute god to only good cause then that would mean that there is some other entity that controls the bad such as how the Christians say satan is the controller of bad. That would mean that something can challenge god. In my opinion i want a god to be all powerful. God is good and bad. God is kind and cruel. We are trying to put god into a box and label it. God is the king and god is the monk and god is the prey and god is the predator etc. 

If you say God is both good and bad, then we have to drop the idea that He is a perfectly good being.....

I don't understand why all of us are so crazy about power. We want God to be all powefull, even if we have to attribute some evil to Him for this....

I think, supremely good nature of God should be our concern, rather than power....

[Guest]

See first of all, it is only The God who can provide you with clearcut and correct answer. Rest of us can only answer as per our own real understanding (which may or may not be correct or in-between).

That been said, here is what I understood till this point in my journey (since all the previous births). In future this understanding could be more refined or replaced by another understanding depending upon the stage. But always bottom line is: We should try to go towards the source and anything that brings you closer to Source or makes you more determined to go to Source is always good.

Apart from your question "Why hasn't He made us like Himself so that we also neither think wrong nor do wrong?" there are other couple of questions like the following which made me think what and where are we in reality.
Why lot of people are suffering (especially children)?
Why there are so many problems in this world: mainly WAR, HUNGER, DISEASES?
Why the corrupt/manipulators are the top leaders or almost all countries?

And before people jump and say, oh these are the karmas; please understand that I do believe in karma and yes, it is because of karma. But from where karma comes? and what was the original bad karma that got worse? and so on..........just see the following images, my heart melts to see anyone suffering..........As Guru Nanak Dev Ji says...... "Tain Ki Dard Na Aaya......"

Hunger:

WAR:

So, my understanding is that: The working of this universe including all the necessary Laws (including karma) is being handled by some entity (call it Negative power (in sense of hindering Soul's Spiritual progress) , Kaal, Mind, Time, etc.). He is the owner of this universe. He is not kind. His sole intention is to keep its resources (Souls) trapped in his world. Most of the people, refer him as God by mistake. Some more knowlegable call the other side of the coin (Positive force) as God but real God is beyond them. Actually, Kaal (Negative power) as well as Positive power (Akal) were created by HIM (real Truth/God). Kaal was given the ownership and knowledge of this universe by the God.

Now, the question remains why the hell real God gave the ownership to the Kaal? and Why God didn't interfere in the world's problems directly?
- The way I understood is that: God is bound by his bhagats (you can find references in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji). Kaal is the bhagat of God and he had done very hard meditation on real God and then got all this. He (real God) does took pity (and at the same time honoring Kaal's promise) and send various Gurus and Saints to remind us our real home. But Gurus and Saints are also bound by the rules, so they can't just take everyone with them. They can only tell us the real stuff and then if anyone is willing to trust and work, then he can use his free-will and get out of this Kaal's world. Kaal is also bound by one rule that: He cannot stop anyone from going beyond but he can play tricks to lead us to false source.

So, here is the condensed version of my thinking:
1. This whole universe is run by Kaal (Negative power) and Maya (Illusion). But the real God's Essence is always present everywhere. Nothing can operate without that Essence.
2. Rules are this universe are setup in such a way that noone can go beyond the Mind. e.g If one wants to get God by his meditation alone then it is not possible; because when we die, many millions of living creatures (germs etc.) also die within our body and due to this we've to pay the karma etc.
* Understanding the first 2 points are very important because it means that whatsoever we can see, feel is fake and we should be determined to go beyond. Now, the next steps are: *
3. The God allows all this play because Kaal is HIS bhagat and he took promises from God. or May be God really wants us to experience this. Only God knows.
4. The only way out is via Guru's Kirpa. e.g Karmas cannot take us beyond; therefore the whole hope is Guru who will take the seeker slowly via Middle path.
5. Regularly real God sends the liberated ones (real Saints) to remind us our truth home.
6. We do NOT have to find the Guru. Guru will find us once the seeker is ready. i.e after exhausting all the possible ways and hard work.
7. So, what we can do NOW is: Naam, Daan, and Isnaan. Keep meditating with longing for HIM; give charity (not only money but help people in need).

One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.

But these days, it is very hard to find a real Brahmgyani and therefore it seems like 2nd point is the best of both worlds and a time will come (may be in this birth or next) when one will meet the True Guru. Till then, just keep trying.

If you want to learn more, then the following are the best:
- http://www.santmat-thetruth.de/tl_files/allgemein-content/schriften/pdf/books/anurag-sagar-en.pdf
- The Matrix movie 1 and 2: this basically shows how could illusion could work. This particular movie has many many very deep concepts but one could understand only that resonates with one's current level.

das

Thans for an elaborate answer.......but.....

1. If only God can give the real answer, why do all the religions keep on saying that their respective religious books have all the answers????

 

2. The concept of 'Karma' that you mentioned seems flawed to me.....if we had been made completely good by God, we would never have indulged in any kind of bad karma TO BEGIN WITH....So, the onus falls on God only for all the bad karmas originating in the world.....

BTW, the living beings (plants, i suppose you don't eat animals) that you eat for your survival also comes under bad karma ( even if we cannot do anything about it.

 

3. The concept of Kaal being a devout bhagat and then gaining control of the world also raises questions at the goodness and wisdom of God. If God is all knowing, He/She/It must have foreseen the ulterior motives of Kaal and would never have given him the control of the world. A good being would never give power to a trickster, no matter how devout he is....especially when that devout bhagat has to unleash evil, pain and suffering in the world. Again, GOD IS THE ONE TO BLAME.

 

4.God's plan of sending the 'liberated ones' to this earth seems a farce because it id God only who has allowed all the evil to enter the world. If we think that God is somehow under some kind of compulsion and CANNOT REMOVE evil from this world, then the onus falls on us that we have to reach upto God and transcend this evil world to reach upto a 'SUPREMELY GOOD BEING' who 'MAY NOT BE ALL POWERFULL'. Why so much craze for power????????

[DSG]

That's why i ask such questions on religious forums. 

Aren't people on these forums travelling on the spiritual path...What answers have THEY GOT to such questions after following the spiritual path for such a long time????

Is good to discuss and find out other peoples journeys , good for motivation but I think rather than answers one needs actions , i.e. what steps one needs to take whilst on the spiritual journey and enhance ones journey, this will be more beneficial and  only the one taking actions will reap the rewards , and I believe each individuals journey will be unique 

[das]

GUEST:

I might be wrong, but to me it seems like your intention is not to understand. Something like people who oppose all religions but at the same time don't pursue the real Truth; their sole intension is to prove all religions wrong. I'm not saying that everything written in religions is truth. What I'm saying is that: the indicator of truths are mentioned in religions but it is YOU who have to find the truth. So, proving all religions wrong (ritualism and dogmatic stuff) is fine BUT that should be balanced with the search within self. Otherwise, you'll just end up going nowhere.

e.g There are directions written on boards/signs on the highway, the boards in itself are NOT the truth. The boards/signs are merely the indicators where Truth might exist. It is US who have to reach the truth by taking the help from signs or search yourself (do not read the boards). Either way, the whole game is to reach the Source. Now, replace the boards with religions. Religions are good only as long as they are taking you towards the Source but at the same time religions are bound to be corrupted after some time with dogmatic stuff. So, use Common sense; and move forward instead of just gripping about everything.

At last, religious books does NOT have all the answers. They are just pointing where one could find the answers.

Edited June 12, 2015 by das

[DSG]

Beautiful shabad i believe answers the doubts , so beautiful 

myry swihbw kauxu jwxY gux qyry ]

maerae saahibaa koun jaanai gun thaerae ||

O my Master, who can know Your Glorious Virtues?

 

This Shabad is by Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Raag Gauree on Pannaa 156

gauVI cyqI mhlw 1 ]

gourree chaethee mehalaa 1 ||

Gauree Chaytee, First Mehla:

kq kI mweI bwpu kq kyrw ikdU Qwvhu hm Awey ]

kath kee maaee baap kath kaeraa kidhoo thhaavahu ham aaeae ||

Who is our mother, and who is our father? Where did we come from?

Agin ibMb jl BIqir inpjy kwhy kMim aupwey ]1]

agan bi(n)b jal bheethar nipajae kaahae ka(n)m oupaaeae ||1||

We are formed from the fire of the womb within, and the bubble of water of the sperm. For what purpose are we created? ||1||

myry swihbw kauxu jwxY gux qyry ]

maerae saahibaa koun jaanai gun thaerae ||

O my Master, who can know Your Glorious Virtues?

khy n jwnI Aaugx myry ]1] rhwau ]

kehae n jaanee aougan maerae ||1|| rehaao ||

My own demerits cannot be counted. ||1||Pause||

kyqy ruK ibrK hm cIny kyqy psU aupwey ]

kaethae rukh birakh ham cheenae kaethae pasoo oupaaeae ||

I took the form of so many plants and trees, and so many animals.

kyqy nwg kulI mih Awey kyqy pMK aufwey ]2]

kaethae naag kulee mehi aaeae kaethae pa(n)kh ouddaaeae ||2||

Many times I entered the families of snakes and flying birds. ||2||

ht ptx ibj mMdr BMnY kir corI Gir AwvY ]

hatt pattan bij ma(n)dhar bha(n)nai kar choree ghar aavai ||

I broke into the shops of the city and well-guarded palaces; stealing from them, I snuck home again.

Aghu dyKY ipChu dyKY quJ qy khw CpwvY ]3]

agahu dhaekhai pishhahu dhaekhai thujh thae kehaa shhapaavai ||3||

I looked in front of me, and I looked behind me, but where could I hide from You? ||3||

qt qIrQ hm nv KMf dyKy ht ptx bwjwrw ]

thatt theerathh ham nav kha(n)dd dhaekhae hatt pattan baajaaraa ||

I saw the banks of sacred rivers, the nine continents, the shops and bazaars of the cities.

lY kY qkVI qolix lwgw Gt hI mih vxjwrw ]4]

lai kai thakarree tholan laagaa ghatt hee mehi vanajaaraa ||4||

Taking the scale, the merchant begins to weigh his actions within his own heart. ||4||

jyqw smuMdu swgru nIir BirAw qyqy Aaugx hmwry ]

jaethaa samu(n)dh saagar neer bhariaa thaethae aougan hamaarae ||

As the seas and the oceans are overflowing with water, so vast are my own sins.

dieAw krhu ikCu imhr aupwvhu fubdy pQr qwry ]5]

dhaeiaa karahu kishh mihar oupaavahu ddubadhae pathhar thaarae ||5||

Please, shower me with Your Mercy, and take pity upon me. I am a sinking stone - please carry me across! ||5||

jIAVw Agin brwbir qpY BIqir vgY kwqI ]

jeearraa agan baraabar thapai bheethar vagai kaathee ||

My soul is burning like fire, and the knife is cutting deep.

pRxviq nwnku hukmu pCwxY suKu hovY idnu rwqI ]6]5]17]

pranavath naanak hukam pashhaanai sukh hovai dhin raathee ||6||5||17||

Prays Nanak, recognizing the Lord's Command, I am at peace, day and night. ||6||5||17||

 

[Guest]

Thank you all for your responses and advice.

I think i will not get answers here. BTW, i am trying at my own level also...

Anyways, thanks a lot....Bye Bye...God Bless You All!

[CdnSikhGirl]

We are told in Gurbani that there really only exists the ONE.

The ONE becomes / is conscious. And since there is nothing but itself... not even space, time, form, etc. it has nothing to contemplate.

The reality we know is compared to a dream many times over in Gurbani. We can compare this to our dreams at night:
We fall asleep, and find ourselves immersed within the dream. While in the dream, we do not realize we are dreaming (usually).  We play the part of a character int he dream and interact as if that is all reality.  We have forgotten our true nature.  But when we wake up in the morning, we realize that it was dream. And not only were we playing the part of one character, but ALL characters were really ourselves.  In fact every blade of grass, every rock and every tree etc were all us.  It was all created by our own consciousness. 

Similarly, God is always creating this reality as a dream... consciousness creates matter (and even science is now seeing this).  But it's all taking place within ONE universal consciousness.  

But just like we don't actively think about every single blade of grass in our dream (even though every blade of grass is created by us) but I don't think every single aspect of creation is being consciously created at all times.  

In fact, I think its more like this:  One Universal Consciousness is becoming self aware, and the only way to do that is by immersing itself within its own creation (by sleeping and dreaming), and the creation evolving to the point where the characters within the dream start to ask those very questions:  Who am I and why am I here.  From the formless state, the creator can not understand itself. Its only be looking from another perspective that it can understand.

So when we the characters are asking "who am I" it's actually the creator asking this question of itself...