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British Sikh Regiment

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http://www.arrse.co.uk/Forums/viewtopic/t=82686/

my mate just sent me this old link, and what a shocker it is. supposedly this seabass is an officer in the hindustani army too (though why he's on the British Army forum, i dont know). seems those slumdog shitheads are trying to stop our community from performing any proper role in britain. come on people, prove people like seabass wrong. get a good education, join the TA/other armed forces, and show that we are a part of britain, rather than 'indians'.

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This was discussed here before. My first thought was that it has to be Bahadur writing that. But then other forum members here said that it must be a former member of this forum who went by the name of Singho. He was a brainwashed chela of Bahadur.

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Leave the thread alone. Its been dead for ages. Plus I noticed many of the reposnses were generally balanced. It is true that Sikhs have to be careful of participating in certain "morally questionable" conflicts such as Iraq right now.

Was talking to a young British Turkish guy recently. He told me that he is going to Turkey to do his national service. It is a shame Sikhs have no equivalent. Not good! I guess it is the result of the Khalsa going from a genuine military force to one which now incorporates heavy military symbology.

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lets make a british sikh regiment and create khalistan muhahahahaha

yep. 700 british sikhs against the 1 million strong hindustani army. i almost feel sorry for them, dont they know we sikhs kick ass?

btw, i was told it was an indian of some sorts who put that on the ARRSE site as he has posted under other names with similar topics.

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Was talking to a young British Turkish guy recently. He told me that he is going to Turkey to do his national service. It is a shame Sikhs have no equivalent. Not good! I guess it is the result of the Khalsa going from a genuine military force to one which now incorporates heavy military symbology.

But there is a "Sikh equivalent". Join the TA or the Regulars. Join the Emergency Services (ie POlice, Fire etc) or join and train with the Voluntary Sector such as RedCross/Crescent, St Johns, Int.Rescue Corp. Its all part of Desh Bhaghti

All this talk of only doing things if there is a Sikh Equivalent, or for Khalistan or or for the Sikh Kaum is just an excuse for sheer laziness! (Khalistan fantasy is not happening any time soon).

Its the same as people saying "I will do Amrit Shak when I am bit more mature". "I will start doing Path when I have more time". "I will donate to charity when I have made at least a million!" Excuses, Excuses, Excuses!!!! If youreally wanted to do something,you would have been doing it already.

yeah .....and long live Hind!

:)

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But there is a "Sikh equivalent". Join the TA or the Regulars. Join the Emergency Services (ie POlice, Fire etc) or join and train with the Voluntary Sector such as RedCross/Crescent, St Johns, Int.Rescue Corp. Its all part of Desh Bhaghti

All this talk of only doing things if there is a Sikh Equivalent, or for Khalistan or or for the Sikh Kaum is just an excuse for sheer laziness! (Khalistan fantasy is not happening any time soon).

I agree that Khalistan is not going to happen anytime soon, if it does happen. Your explantion of the Sikh equivalent to what I originally mentioned is pindufied to the extreme! How does a Sikh fighting for Johnny Saxon equate to to member of the Turkish diaspora training for war in Turkey?

I know people in the police force, they tell me it is very racist. Last night I watched a BBC program with parents of some those killed in Iraq/Afghanistan, they were lamented the fact that their kids died on the basis of a WMD lie. And you think Sikhs should follow goray into that type of thing? You talk of desh bhagti...what......for this desh???

We are not the simple village folks our forefathers were, I like to think we can get on without having to sell our souls to white imperialism.

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Dal-Singh Ji, I assume you live in the UK?

If so why do you take advantage of Imperial educations, Imperial employment and if you work, why do you fund the Imperial regime so that the Imperialists can pay other parents children to die for their cause...

Just some food for thought...

A Sikh working in the emergency services be it the NHS or Police Force is playing a very active Khalsa role to the best of his/her ability, instead of just talking about it or dressing the part.

Re the Army, where else will Sikhs get modern warfare skills, culture, psychology, tactic, stratagam, mindest and experience? Not at a gatka campa, thats for sure.

The big thing that has changed in terms of Fauji rvaaj and rehni behni in western panthic circles is that we have all become middle class and try to live off the glory of our 'Pindu' forefathers. we all talk the talk but don't walk the walk. For the number of Islamophobes I see in the western youth today, I would have thought there would have been a rush to go and join the army!

National service is a great idea, no matter what country one lives in, it teaches boys how to become men in many aspects. The Army is not fighting one war or providing one service, if you don't like a particular situation, you can ask to transfer somewhere else, if thats not possible, then leave.

Regarding racism, all public sector institutions used to be racist, where as minorities have now become heavily visible in administrative PS roles (Inc top positions - i.e. the Mayor of Londons current Sikh Director of Transport - I know many other Sikhs in senior Govt roles), the Army is lagging hugely behind, the Police still need to heavily increase non-white numbers also.

Through integration, ignorance is slowly removed, this has certainly happened in the administrative PS, which is actually a great place to work on th elarge part - with your employers bending backwards to meet your every 'cultural/religious' need. I once had an interview at MI6 HQ (no not to become a Spy), and decided to tell them about my concealed kirpan (just in case). I explained i would not remove it, or even show it to them (upon their request to see it). They politely had me wait 5 mins, then called someone to escort me to the meeting room, I was unescorted on the way back.

To me, that was good experience of change - I doubt the same would have happened (with such politeness) 15 years ago...

Although I do not agree with everything the Govt does, I am not believer in the big conspiracies, simply because I don't believe they are clever enough. I believe that they are greedy (as most Govts are) and make stupid mistakes, and perhaps do suffer some Imperialistic hangover (which Civilisation doesn't)?

The respect the Gurkhas get in UK is amazing, it makes me sad to think that the Sikhs once got much more respect than this for their courage and warrior reputation...

I salute the Gurkhai - the true Warrior essence still exists in their culture/faith!

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Shaheediyan,

If I live here does it mean I must agree with everything done by the indigenous people? Wake up, the real reason our parents came here was economic upliftment. So as I am of foreign extraction my objections to white supremacism is some sort of disloyalty is it? If an indigenous person is anti capitalist/war, are they being disloyal? If I had a choice I would not fund imperialism, sadly we have no real choice in this though do we.

I agree that the Khalsa need to revert back to older practices in relation to military training but your suggestion of getting into bed with whoever to do this is narrow minded. We had a heavy presence in the British army of the past but this still did not prevent Panjab being torn apart and an uncountable amount of Sikhs being butchered at partition. Don't be so naive about our hosts. Did you not hear of the BNP Euro election wins?

You said:

The respect the Gurkhas get in UK is amazing, it makes me sad to think that the Sikhs once got much more respect than this for their courage and warrior reputation...

I for one am glad that Sikhs have moved on from being storm troopers for Anglo-Saxons. That respect is conditional on being canon fodder. Is that what you see as a good option for Sikhs? Is that what you think the Khalsa are?

Are you one of those apologist Sikhs for white civilisation?

BTW, the real reason we lost our intrinsic military power was directly due to its diversion for British imperialism. This made many Sikhs lose their original purpose and became mercenary.

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"If I had a choice I would not fund imperialism, sadly we have no real choice in this though do we."

Brother you do have choice, we always do, don't fund 'imperialism', emigrate to somewhere you think is better i.e. our old friend Bahadur Shah moved to Iran after taking advantage of Western Schooling. I find it the height of hypocrisy for people to be funding the same actions they are criticising (with all due respect).

"Don't be so naive about our hosts. Did you not hear of the BNP Euro election wins?"

Our 'hosts' are not all BNP, in fact the majority of the 'indigineous' population hates the BNP - which is why they are not our Government!

"I for one am glad that Sikhs have moved on from being storm troopers for Anglo-Saxons. That respect is conditional on being canon fodder. Is that what you see as a good option for Sikhs? Is that what you think the Khalsa are?"

I am not an apologist I am a realist, pragmatic and grateful. You have it so easy here, you have no idea - UK is the easiest country in the whole world to be Sikh in my experience - on all levels. You can carry a kirpan, you can obtain a shotgun licence, you can compete economically, you can set up your own political party, you can write or talk about whatever you wish...

We should stop living in the past. If you were to join the British Army now (I am not saying you should) you would be on equal foot with 'British' soldiers. Don't forget, being a soldier is simply being an employee, even Sardar Jassa Singh Ramgharia and other Gursikhs Warriors, were in the employ of Mughal forces (later maintaing relations with them), until there was a personal conflict.

My great great grandfather and his son fought together in Basra in WW1, that was there trade, that was there job, thats how they put food on the table. Things are not as simple s you make out, I don't like the way you simply class hundreds and thousands of brave dead Sikhs as Pindus. They were Sikhs - they had Gurmat (more so than you or me) and war was their trade. A soldiers upbringing and mindset cannot be comprehended by the likes of us.

Are you one of those apologist Sikhs for white civilisation?

I am not an apologist for anyone, nor am I obsessed with the past. 'Whites' are not the only people to dominate and expand civilisations, try reading the history of the world. Man is man - we are all the same given the same circumstances.

Anyway, I am not interested in an arguement - I simply wanted to say, that if you hate the actions of this country so much, you have the option to leave - in fact, being a UK Citizen - makes it easy to emigrate pretty much to any country in the world - assuming you have a half decent education and job experience.

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hmm, dalsingh, i see where your coming from. but unless you have a better alternative, then i think the end justifies the means. there is nothing wrong with joining the army, as long as you dont compromise who you are. give it a go, go to you local army careers office and become a part-time reservist in the TA, as that is the option (if i'm right) that means you wont have to go to a warzone. every sikh needs to know how to be a soldier.

also, jatt boot , what is the meaning of your name? it makes me think of a sikh submarine for some reason :wacko:

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Check your facts. If you join the TA you're gonna get called up for service in a warzone. Currently most soldiers territorial and regular have done not one but several tours of duty in the middle east, running consecutively with very little break in between. If you join the regulars you may not leave until your time is up. If you join the TA you may not leave after being called up for a tour of duty.

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actually maybe you should check your facts. several consecutive tours in the TA? no. it depends on what you do and what you want to do. and as for not leaving if you've been called up for a tour of duty (which might not even be afghanistan) you can still leave, as if you dont want to go, the army just kicks you out. simple. also, there are some special exemptions http://www.army.mod.uk/structure/15272.aspx . i've noticed a lot of upset people at the thought of sikhs having military training and fighting - why are you lot crying so much? you bloody well moan and whinge about khalistan/NWF sikhs/violent racism all day, but none of you have the balls to do anything to protect sikhs when we are attacked. if you dont like it, sod off and enjoy your decadent lives.

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actually maybe you should check your facts. several consecutive tours in the TA? no. it depends on what you do and what you want to do. and as for not leaving if you've been called up for a tour of duty (which might not even be afghanistan) you can still leave, as if you dont want to go, the army just kicks you out. simple.

Nope, nope and nope. Oh boy...

:rolleyes:

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I find it the height of hypocrisy for people to be funding the same actions they are criticising (with all due respect).

Like I have a say in how my taxes are spent! lol

Anyway, although I get your point about training (HSD), we should also be a bit astute about getting involved in drawn out, ill conceived and possibly unwinnable wars. I mean, what moron thought they could change Afghanistan into some democratic, gender equal state?

but none of you have the balls to do anything to protect sikhs when we are attacked.

I've known plenty of Sikhs who do do something. It is a shame the majority bury their heads in the sand. That's the crux of the matter also. What can you do for your own people if you are stuck fighting other people's wars. If the majority of Singhs just had common street smarts and some tuttay in general, that would be a damn good start, forget using bandooks etc. The problem we are having is a psychological one, not a training one, in my opinion.

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What can you do for your own people if you are stuck fighting other people's wars. If the majority of Singhs just had common street smarts and some tuttay in general, that would be a damn good start, forget using bandooks etc. The problem we are having is a psychological one, not a training one, in my opinion.

Psychological change usually occurs through physical training, Singh. It's quite difficult to change the mental habits of a lifetime and to overcome the emotional conditioning of one's childhood through mental effort alone.

It's a bit different for the next generation. If they are brought up to be men and not chooay, they will not face the same problems as our generation (a large part of which seems to have been raised by - and disciplined at the hands of - women or ineffectual male role models).

The armed forces offer excellent training. One can't run to mummy ji's lap there when the drill seargeant is being mean.

Regards,

K.

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I would agree that typical Sikh upbringings need to be changed. We have become a nation of office workers........that is ALL we aim for now.

I can't see this changing....this will only increase. Used to be a time when a Panjabi man was anakhi by nature....wdf happened?

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I would agree that typical Sikh upbringings need to be changed. We have become a nation of office workers........that is ALL we aim for now.

I can't see this changing....this will only increase. Used to be a time when a Panjabi man was anakhi by nature....wdf happened?

We became middle class - we have too much to lose now to risk giving it up for little things like self-respect, dignity and honour. I also feel that '84 had a huge impact on the collective psyche of the Sikh male, making them more solitary, disillusioned and more spiritually aware and withdrawn.

But, in the end, it doesn't really matter what the reasons are. The question is what we are going to do to change this.

K.

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yes dalsingh, afghanistan is an ill conceived war and is possibly unwinnable. everyone knows that. but thats life - even if the end you want looks impossible doesnt mean you just give up and wonder off. i have no faith in our 'panthic' leaders or the possibility of the under-20s becoming competent enough to secure sikhi and look after themselves. but hey that doesnt mean i can give up and say its none of my business or not my problem. we all have to face a baptism of fire one day, and its better to have the training and do it in a small war then wait until later life and have it happen outside your front door when you have no idea what your facing.

also, yes there are a few sikhs who do something, but most are moneh/keshdhari and get ostracised by the rest of the sikh community. this leads to them getting disillusioned and not building on what they did when they were young. then another generation grows up facing the same problems, and goes through the same mistakes/experience as the one before it. we need to break that cycle, lose the nepotism and create institutions/attitudes that can be used to get each generation up to speed. one way i believe is for every sikh to have military experience. its a means to an end. i'm not a stormtrooper for john bull, mainly because john bull does not own the parade ground anymore - uncle sam issues all our orders now! our elders fought in WW1/WW2 and now in india the sikhs there are literally the 'stormtroopers of henry hindustan'. we think things are getting better but really they have hardly changed. having more sikhs in the army will be a PR (something most sikhs get wrong) victory and help to dispel the myth all brown british people are lazy/stupid/have loyalties elsewhere and stop the bnp from forming support in the army. if griffy gets the army behind him, we would be in seriously deep ****. also, by having large numbers of sikhs in the army, it shows that sikhs are not tied to india. that'll really upset those slumdogs over there. and as for getting killed, well if we want khalistan, if we want to retaliate to the encroachment of islam or we want to hit back at racism, then we will take some losses. we just have to make sure they died for something rather than just giving up and living for the sake of existence.

sorry for this fairly incoherent post, but i hope you see the points i'm trying to make.

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That's cool HSD. I think we are broadly barking up the same tree. I would strongly suggest and encourage Sikhs join the Canadian forces.

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We need lots of true patriots. Everyone has been brainwashed into the modern Jatt/Panjabi capitalist mentality thing now. They see anything outside of stacking money as foolish. On the other side we have paper praying tigers. All sant - no sipahi.

So many sell outs in Amritsar has seriously hurt us.

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lol, aww poor guy, you're all upset someone disagrees with you? aww let me get you a tissue.

The armed forces are not for everyone, particularly people who tend to take things personally when someone points out they're wrong. It's not for me to get in the way of your grandstanding here or to point out the obvious but you're wrong on the facts. It's that simple. If you speak to an officer like that you will be in for a rough ride, whether in the TA or regulars. If you're serious about it, you need to tone down the ego.

If you fail to call-up as an enlisted TA soldier when you're required to, you will be deemed AWOL. After that, you will either be dishonourably discharged or charged by a court martial (locked up in military prison and with a criminal record). Either way it's not a happy outlook.

Another thing: don't expect 6 weeks of basic training to turn you into a killing machine or anything. Knowing how to use an SA80 assault rifle is only useful if you're serving in the British armed forces as only the British armed forces use this weapon. If you want to be an all-round tough guy, a 'fighter' you should apply for Parachute Regiment, RAF Regiment, Royal Marine Commandos or similar.

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ego? really? how about you answer my pm and we'll see who knows more. and as for the sa80, could you tell me what the paras and the marines do different? they use the sa80 too. and its actually the pathfinders and a few other regiments that use american equipment as well rather than an sa80. but what this has to do with usefulness and the british armed forces, i'm not sure as most of your points are way off. also the raf reg is a craphat regiment, so i'm not sure why your putting them up as the best in the armed forces.

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