chatanga1

Basics of Sikhi have done a 30 odd minute video, on the 10th Kings' Granth. It is a really good video, and although short, it provides a very good understanding of the Granth, and addresses some of the issues that have been discussed here on Sikhawareness i.e. authorship, status, and whether we can bow to it etc.
 
 

Yes, I at that particular time, the Dal Panth were planning and re-planning every possible scenario in order to achieve their goal, which was to not let the invader return with 100% of his loot.
 
The Sikhs were helped in this regard by the route that Nadir took on his return. Nader wanted to avoid the stifling plains so took a route futher north towards the mountain footholds. This favoured the Sikhs because the mountains provided excellent cover and secure base, but also because the speed of the river was much greater than on the plains with the greater decline of the land going downhill. The river was also a heavier at this time because of the season.
 
Yes everything was in place and the strike had to be quite "surgical." The logs had to be released at a time, where they would catch the rear-end of the train. If it was too early, there would be more of an amry to fight. Too late and there would be none.
I was quite impressed by this operation, which is why I started this topic and asked the question in the title.
 
From what I've read on this Nadir empire was attacked by Pathans from Kandahar and kabul. These places were under the Moghal empire. Nadir sought redress from Delhi but when none was forthcoming he decided to invade.

Hi all. Wanted to bump this thread again and bring everyone news of a dismaying situation in Lahore, with the ShaheedGanj of Bhai Taru Singh being taken over by Barelvi muslims. Some years ago, a sect of muslims took over this Gurdwara and painted one of the domes green, although it has been repainted white.
This article mentions the same guy behind the recent attempt on 26th July, Sohail Butt. He is the same guy who made the video on the 26th threatening Sikhs in Pakistan.
https://www.tribuneindia.com/2007/20070827/main8.htm
 

sending sewadars always gets tricky whenever india and pakistan have a spat over something, and the indians arent very keen on the sikhs forging closer ties with Pakistan. After Pakistan gave permission for the corridor to Kartarpur Sahib, across the Ravi, which meant that the Sikhs ould go there from east panjab whenever they wanted, but the indian govt refused to allow this.

i think sending sewadars may be a second option, first would be to get sikhs living there organised to do as much as they can, with the diaspora filling in as and where needed.

Bhaji, i think it would be difficult to ignore the religious issue, and this is a very important religious aspect of the Panth, and the political issue would also present dangers, as the "SIkh" party, the Akalis, would be vying with the congress(who i know would be very keen to join the fray) over who resurrected this crumbling heritage, and therefore should be worthy of Sikh votes.

But as long as it didnt spill over into Indo-pak political issues, it might not, cause any harm.

At the moment i have only got tears and bucket loads of them.

But since you ask...we have to look at this logically and create a strategy that is feasible.

The first step is to raise awareness amongst the Sikhs outside of Pakistan by usual means, ie Gurdwaras, Sikh media, social networking etc. Make them aware that such a heritage exists, and we are in danger of losing it.

The second step would be to canvass the Sikhs living in Pakistan to see what support they can give, as most likely they will be left with the responsibility of maintaining such shrines. Are they happy and in a position to do so?

Then if we can say that we have the capability to look after such shrines, we can make the move to restore them.




If the East Panjab govt did step up to the mark, we would have a much easier job here, but realistically if Badal helped he would most likely want SGPC jurisdiction over the shrines, and given the state of Indian gurdwaras, im not sure that is such a good step. If east panjab govt help was limited to diplomacy in getting the shrines restored, probably that would be better.

Nankana Sahib, the birthplace of my Guru, is always on my mind. So are the other historical gurdwaras that are crumbling in Pakistan. What is the future of these Gurdwaras?

I have always despised facebook, but have since joined because i saw this guy, Syed Sarmad Sajjad, working for the restoration of these Gurdwaras.

What are the obstacles facing restoration?

What obstacles face the Sikhs after restoration, if we were to acheive it?

What will the Sikhs in 100 years time, feel about us Sikhs today, and our handling of this situation, if the Gurdwaras and their identities were to vanish from the face of this earth?

Get your thinkingTurbans on peeps.

What are your thoughts?


I am going to start with mine. The restoration is definitely possible from a financial point. The main obstacle would be getting the work done. Would it be done as per tradition as Kaar Sewa, or do we get contractors in. IF Kaar Sewa, is the Pakistan Govt going to allow thousands of Sikhs to cross the border to enter West Panjab?

Lets move on a step. Once/if they are restored, who is going to look after them?

Is Parkash going to happen?

What if we western Sikhs. paid Pakistani Sikh families to re-locate to these gurdwaras and maintain them.

But then the question begs, what about the sangat?

What would be the viability of running a gurdwara where the same 4 or 5 people of one family came twice or thrice a day?

Some gurdwaras have been turned into schools, and colleges, some police stations, what are the chances of getting those back? Maybe we would have to purchase them back?

For each gurdwara you would also need a granthi.

What about langar?

To run a gurdwara is not very easy. But what is the alternative for these Gurdwaras?


http://www.facebook.com/savethegurdwaras

GHANI KHAN and his brother Nabi Khan, Pathan horse dealers of Machhivara in present day Ludhiana district of the Punjab, were admirers of Guru Gobind Singh whom they had visited at Anandpur and to whom they had sold many good animals. When they learnt that, travelling in a lonely state after the battle of Chamkaur (1705), the Guru had come to Machhivara, they at once turned out to meet him and offered their services. They provided him with a blue coloured dress and carried him out of Machhivara in a palanquin disguised as a Muslim divine. They declared him to be Uchch da Pir, the holy man of Uchch, an old seat of Muslim saints in south-west Punjab.
They escorted him thus up to Hehrari, a village near Raikot in Ludhiana district, where a group of Sikhs relieved them. The Guru dismissed Ghani Khan and Nabi Khan with his blessings and a hukamnama meant to be a letter of commendation which was reverently preserved by their descendants. The family migrated to Pakistan in 1947. Their house in Machhivara is now a gurudwara known as Gurdwara Uchch da Pir.
References : Sikh Encylopaedia
1. Kuir Singh, Gurbilas Patshahi 10. Patiala, 1968
2. Padam, Piara Singh, and Giani Garja Singh, eds. Guru klan Sakhian. Patiala, 1986
3. Macauliffe, Max Arthur, The. Sikh Religion. Oxford, 1909

Below:
Zahoor Ahmed Khan, the descendant of Ghani Khan and Nabhi Khan who once assisted Guru Gobind Singh Ji in escaping the Mughal forces, here shows a hukamnana bestowed upon his ancestors by Guru Sahib Ji.
 

 
 

http://scroll.in/article/810934/how-the-sikh-religion-evolved-from-the-time-of-its-founding-guru
 
Driving down the Multan Road Highway, exploring Pakistan's Sikh heritage
A visit to some ancient gurudwaras across the border.
Image credit:  Haroon Khalid | A gurdwara dedicated to Guru Nanak in Manga in Pakistan's Lahore district. Jul 01, 2016 · 06:30 pm  Updated Jul 01, 2016 · 11:23 pm Haroon Khalid 4.8K Total views     Email   Print     Email   Print The gurdwara before us was in a dismal state – only its pillars and outer structure still stood. The facing pool reflected this depressing sight.
Soaked in sweat, a labourer digging up mud from near the pool – to widen it, perhaps – dropped his shovel and walked up to us. “This is the gurdwara of Guru Nanak,” he said.
“Who was he?” I asked, to ascertain what, if anything, Guru Nanak meant to him.
“He was a Sikh Guru.” That’s all he knew.
My companion, Iqbal Qaiser, my mentor and the one who introduced me to Sikhism, offered some more insight: “This gurdwara was burned at the time of Partition. The priests here were refusing to leave, so the mob burned it down.”
The plot on which the gurdwara stands was allotted to it by Maharaja Ranjit Singh, the founder of the Sikh Empire. We walked around this enclosed space, which now contains a fish farm under the Pakistani Fisheries Department. The land abutting the gurudwara is occupied by a school. The Multan Road Highway passes through the gurdwara’s gate, while the Pakistani town of Manga is across the road.
Back to the beginning
“Manga is about 1,000 years old,” Qaiser told me. It did looked ancient, but more because of how run-down it was. There was filth, junkies and stray dogs on the streets.
This is a small town, the last of Lahore district as one heads south towards Multan. The river Ravi once used to flow across the western boundary of Manga.
“Guru Nanak crossed the Ravi and stayed at Manga for a little while,” Qaiser told me. “Here, he preached his message and then came to this spot, where the Gurdwara was later constructed.”
“Did anything special happen here?” I asked.
“No,” Qaiser said. “Nanak, along with his companions, Mardana and Bhai Bala, sat here under the shade of a tree and then moved on. Come to think of it, some people are remembered for the buildings they have constructed – Shah Jahan, for example, would always be remembered for summoning the Taj Mahal – and then there are those in whose memory a place, even in a jungle like this, becomes sacred.”
I wondered if Nanak, or his devotees, knew then what an important role he would play in the cultural and religious history of Punjab. Walking around, wearing a saffron chola – a long, loose shirt – he must have looked like an ordinary mendicant.
It is believed that Guru Nanak was incarcerated by the invading forces of Babur after he defied the king’s orders and refused to pray for his success. Babur could not have foreseen that Nanak, in the centuries to come, would become one of the most revered mystic poets of India and hailed as the first guru of Sikhism.
“Isn’t it ironic, Iqbal Sahib, that Nanak spoke vehemently against institutionalised religion and today, Sikhism is an institutionalised religion with its own rites and rituals?” Qaiser asked.
A few years ago, when I was working with the Sikh community in the city of Nankana Sahib, an incident with a boy has been imprinted on my mind. I was sitting with my back towards the Gurudwara Janam Asthan there – considered the birth place of Guru Nanak. “Don’t sit with your back towards the shrine,” the young Sikh boy warned me. I politely heeded to his demand, but I found it ironic that I had been asked to do so, given Guru Nanak’s own beliefs.
The story goes that Guru Nanak went to Mecca for the Hajj pilgrimage and slept with his feet towards the Ka’aba – a structure in the Grand Mosque that is considered the most sacred Muslim site in the world. When someone complained, he changed the direction of his feet, but the Ka’aba, too, moved. “Tell me, where should I direct my feet?” Nanak is said to have asked. “In which direction does God not reside?”
The story may be apocryphal story but its essence – of questioning the rituals and traditions we uphold in the name of religion – still stands.
Moving ahead
The gurudwara at Beherwal. We drove a few kilometres from Manga to the small village of Beherwal. Here, we were greeted by another empty building. “This gurdwara is associated with Guru Arjan, the fifth Sikh Guru,” Qaiser said.
The building's walls, however, were intact and made of thick brick, which indicated that it was constructed during British rule.
It was here that Guru Arjan is said to have performed a miracle by turning brackish water from a well sweet. The well still exists inside the premises of this building, which was locked. “This is a government institute now,” a man from the village told us. “It is shut on Sundays. If you want to see it from the inside, you should return tomorrow.”
Sikhs believe that the nine gurus that followed Guru Nanak all spread his message and that the tenets of Sikhism that were formalised by the tenth Sikh Guru, Guru Gobind Singh, in the form of Khalsa – a body of initiated Sikhs – were based on Guru Nanak’s teachings. In other words, it is believed that all gurus had the essence of Guru Nanak in them.
I, on the other hand, think that as is the case with many other religious movements, the form that Sikhism took after Guru Nanak’s time is something he may not have associated with.
Time and transitions
For example, Nanak, instead of appointing his son as his spiritual descendant, chose his most talented student, Angad Dev. Following this tradition, Guru Angad appointed his student instead of his son as the next guru – Amar Das.
However, after this it became a family fiefdom. Guru Amar Das appointed his son-in-law Ram Das as the next Guru, who then appointed his son, Arjan.
The subsequent gurus were from the same family, clearly a departure from Nanak’s heritage.
“Iqbal sahib, isn’t it true that Guru Nanak believed in non-violence?” I asked as we headed back to Lahore.
“Yes,” Qaiser said.
“On the other hand, Guru Gobind Singh was a warrior and he told his warriors that it is right to fight a just war through force. Do you think Guru Nanak would have agreed with this philosophy?” I asked.
We still debate this. There is no black or white answer. The political realities facing the tenth guru were different from those of the first guru.
However, there is also no doubt that, increasingly, after Guru Nanak, Sikh masters were engaged in politics, taking the side of certain dissenting princes. For example, Guru Arjan allegedly gave his blessings to Jahangir’s son Khusrau when he rebelled against his father. Guru Har Rai, the seventh Sikh Guru, sympathised with Dara Shikoh, the brother of the tyrannical Mughal emperor, Aurangzeb.
Every year, on the occasion of Guru Nanak’s festival at Nankana Sahib, a banner is put up with all the Sikh gurus – with Guru Nanak on one end and Guru Gobind Singh, the tenth spiritual master, on the other.
Nanak is depicted as a mystic dressed in a saffron chola, while Guru Gobind is shown wearing a tiara adorned with pearls, a silk garment and pearl necklaces. The pictures of the eight gurus in the middle trace the transition of gurudom.
Haroon Khalid is the author of the books In Search of Shiva: A study of folk religious practices in Pakistan and A White Trail: A journey into the heart of Pakistan’s religious minorities.
We welcome your comments at letters@scroll.in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-55265286
 
image copyrightWolverhampton Council image captionThe sculpture is due to be unveiled in Wednesfield on the 124th anniversary of the battle on 12 September 2021 The final design of a statue to 19th Century Sikh soldiers has been unveiled as the last stage of work begins.
The 3m-high (10ft) sculpture, by artist Luke Perry, is due to be erected in Wednesfield, Wolverhampton, in September.
The clay model will be painted in wax before being cast in bronze.
It commemorates the Battle of Saragarhi. Although little-known, it is considered by some military historians as one of history's great last-stands.
During the battle on 12 September 1897, 21 Sikhs died defending a British army post from 10,000 Afghan tribesmen.
image copyrightWolverhampton Council image captionOnce complete, the statue will stand 10ft (3m) tall Sikhs make up almost 10% of Wolverhampton's population - almost 23,000 people - and it has been an ambition of councillor Bhupinder Gakhal to share the story for decades.
He said he was "thrilled" by the "wonderful memorial" and hoped it would encourage others to learn more about Saragarhi.
Latest news and updates from the West Midlands It is due to be unveiled in Well Lane, near the Guru Nanak Gurdwara, on 12 September 2021, the anniversary of the battle.
Mr Perry has previously made a commemorative statue to honour the South Asian service personnel who fought for Britain during World War One.
That sculpture has been displayed in neighbouring Smethwick since 2018.
"With artworks like Saragarhi I want to create sculptures that are a visible marker of the under represented but vital, real people in our communities," Mr Perry said.
"Because when you represent people you empower them."

good work by some brothers.

Has anyone heard of the ongoing "Trojan Horse" case in Birmingham.

If so, any thoughts/views ?

Listen to this "news" anchor trying to drag Sant Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale into the movement, thereby trying to criminalise the agitation.
 
 

Got these books a few days ago. @dalsingh101 you mentioned a book concerning Banda Bahadur, was it the Rajasthani one?
 

hehehehehe, no bro, just got a little busy trying to get some things done for gurdwara, should have done them ages ago, but never got round to it.

i will have a look at doing some more on tuesday. note i havent said which tuesday.

I beleive that Ustad Harji nder Singh Lallie runs a class in Birmingham.

I beleive that Ustad Harji nder Singh Lallie runs a class in Birmingham.

I say I can't stand that bihari farsi hybrid langauage.

im hovering around you Neo Bhaji as well. Are people still looking on this forum,a dn just not posting, or are they just not coming on at all?

" I found myself asking, “Why is Pakistan so important to me?” I responded simply: I was born there. Many of family members are there. My ancestry is there."

they think they are the only ones.

i would say most members are the children of people from india, lborn in the west. But we certainly have experience of their lives and upbringing whilst still in india.

I will start this, with a simple word: escape. escape from what? poverty and tough lives. Life in india still is a struggle for many millions every day.

My parents came with a view initially to make money and improve their lives back in india, but whilst here seeing that they could never have these lives back in india, eventually ended up staying. i will add this soon.

This charitar is a very interesting charitar. There is the main theme at play, but also I noticed a sub-theme in this story about the value of sons. How sons are are there to fight and protect Kingdoms etc. Very interesting.
 
From this charitar, I see that the Shah's wife Chittar Prabha is a very self-confident and assured woman. She knows the goldsmith is an accomplished thief and has a reputation for being so, yet has the temerity to have him come and work for her. Plus with her husband absent, she knows that she won't have any support from him, so she has to be able to manage by herself.
The charitar tells us that the goldsmith tried many methods to swindle some gold from her but she was always alert to his practices and prevented him from doing so. This tells us that Chittar Prabha has great knowledge in the art of deceit already.
 
When the goldsmith fails in all his tried and trusted methods he turns to an emotional ploy, lamenting the death of his son. I think this is to gain sympathy from Chittar Prabha so she will not be vigilant with him. But the death of the son also resonates with the root story of how sons are there to honour their fathers and to also protect their kingdoms.
Chittar Prabha is wise to this and her plan to reveal the hidden pipe filled with gold is the exact reverse method the goldsmith used to hide it in the first place.
Then as punishment the goldsmith had to give the same exact amount of gold to Chittar Prabha as he tried to steal from her.
 

will be watching this. Its about time we got airplay, Sikhs were one of the first to bring this to public notice.

Great vid bro.
 

This is sad to hear. More and more of the old skool Nihangs are passing away leaving the Dal Panth more divided than ever.