How Do We Go About Starting Jhatka In The Uk

[dalsingh101]

Well the BNP got hammered here recently, they seem to be falling apart in front of our very eyes.

The only other thing is street armies of youngish semi-literate English yobs in the form of the EDL. I have to say they have numbers but are less of a threat than the NF were in the old days. Plus the Muslims are organised and brave enough to deal with them if it came to it I reckon.

Britain is shrinking its military so it wont be able to easily jump into any dubious conflicts in future, which is a good thing as Muslims don't take that stuff lying down anymore.

A new emerging Pan-European identity may form in time and if the past is anything to go by, I'd say they will base this identity of differentiating themselves from some 'other'. We can probably guess who this other may be....

Other than that, like I said, until it is a attractive business prospect for some farmers, I can't see that jhatka thing being anything other than a private arrangement with some farmers.

Edited October 21, 2010 by dalsingh101

[kdsingh80]

Same old dumb stuff from apnay about joining x, y and z.

Agreed don't have much knowledge about UK.But on the other hand how is it fair for sikhs living outside India comment daily on Indian issue's.Many sikh sites

discuss From Ayodhya to Kashmir,to Human rights voilation in India on daily basis.Just turn the table and please tell me How much fair it is for Sikhs living outside India to comment on Indian politics.

[dalsingh101]

Agreed don't have much knowledge about UK.But on the other hand how is it fair for sikhs living outside India comment daily on Indian issue's.Many sikh sites

discuss From Ayodhya to Kashmir,to Human rights voilation in India on daily basis.Just turn the table and please tell me How much fair it is for Sikhs living outside India to comment on Indian politics.

Fair point.

You have to say though, Indian politics does seem to scrape the very bottom of the barrel. With politicians who openly kill their own citizens. Breathtaking poverty practically ignored. Inequalities of the extreme kind.

I think some of us out here, really sincerely wish for back home to get its act right because whether we like it or not, these negative things being highlighted in the west, can effect perceptions people have of those from that region of the world.

[amardeep]

Did'n the BNP recieve more votes nationally than earlier but due to your complicated elections system they did'n recieve as many seats in the parlament?

[kdsingh80]

Fair point.

You have to say though, Indian politics does seem to scrape the very bottom of the barrel. With politicians who openly kill their own citizens. Breathtaking poverty practically ignored. Inequalities of the extreme kind.

I think some of us out here, really sincerely wish for back home to get its act right because whether we like it or not, these negative things being highlighted in the west, can effect perceptions people have of those from that region of the world.

Well I am not talking about you or some other knowledgeable people but 90% of comments I read on sikh sites are from youngsters who hardly have any knowledge

about India or its culture.For them most of the hindu's are attending RSS shakhas and forcing sikhs to become hindu's.Badal is the Living Devil on earth

whose main aim is just to destroy sikhism.

Even Sikh media outside india never forget to mention issue's related to modi,advani or other issue's Which are not even remotely linked to sikhs

Actually many times I have a good laugh when I read comments on India by sikhs

living outside India

[dalsingh101]

Amandeep

I think serious internal bickering in the party put people off. One head guy has been accused of sexual harassment by a female colleague. Nick Griffin (the head honcho) had a disastrous mainstream TV debut. Their head legal advisor resigned the party. Earlier their publicity guy left after he sabotaged their website. They lost what they thought was a sure bet in Barking in the recent local elections.

People describe it as an implosion.

The steam from their movement seems to have run out (for now).

People aren't in the mood for 'foreign' stuff now. I think the natives would revolt at the idea of jhatka as yet more foreignness in Blighty.

Edited October 21, 2010 by dalsingh101

[amardeep]

ah.. lets hope their misfortune spreads to other countries. The right wing parties in Holland, Denmark and Sweden seem to be doing quite well but they are also governed in a good way by their leaders

Edited October 21, 2010 by amardeep

[dalsingh101]

Actually many times I have a good laugh when I read comments on India by sikhs

living outside India

I know what you mean.

I find the Canadian teenager perspective especially skewed in this respect.

The RSS is like some ubiquitous entity everywhere Sikhs try and do anything, trying to thwart them. No Sikhs can do any wrong (especially khalistanis) and everything wrong is the result of some plot against them.

Actually I just had a chat with some brothers from back home in the Gurdwara today and they were talking crazy as well. They actually believed all Muslims know of Guru Nanak and/or Sikhi..... that Guru Nanak is famously worshiped by hordes in Baghdad? That the drug problem is in Panjab so that soon every last Sikh will detest drugs...

All that said and done, I have to admire and take on their chardhi kala though. lol

Even if their worldview seems seriously limited and skewed.

[dalsingh101]

ah.. lets hope their misfortune spreads to other countries. The right wing parties in Holland, Denmark and Sweden seem to be doing quite well but they are also governed in a good way by their leaders

Yeah but look at those countries. They haven't got hordes of thug, caveman types like the English have. They are probably still generally polite even with their racism in comparison?

I mean Holland....

and Sweden......

I don't even know what Denmark is famous for?

These people seem quite sophisticated and civilised compared to urban working class Brits, but maybe I am under some misapprehension?

[chatanga1]

can we stick to the topic guys?

[dalsingh101]

Sorry....

Anyway to summise what I was saying before. I think jhatka will only be available by a private arrangement with some farmers right now. I know I met one person years ago (who I have lost contact with since), who told me that her cousins had such an arrangement with a farmer.

Trying to mass produce jhatka is problematic in that you would need some permanently employed Singh(s) as a butcher.

Unless Sikh families take up livestock farming in the UK I can't see it happening.

Besides I wonder if the RSPCC or any other similar animal rights agencies would cause a stink over the matter?

So who wants to be a farmer then?

I'd buy off you if it was affordable. lol

[jaikaara]

lets all be kasai ourselves ! i can come to england and haeva jhatka training institute...what an idea sir ji !

[vijaydeep Singh]

Gurfateh

Term Kasai is meant for Kasab/Kureshi doing Halal, term in us is Jhatkai.There is community called Jhatkayia Sikh, while in Hindus mostly this work is done by khatiks.

[jaikaara]

nowadays even khatiks are leaving their profession

[kdsingh80]

Just a question to UK sangat .How many of practicing sikhs in UK actually believe that Jhatka meat is allowed in sikhism?

[chatanga1]

i think most would think that you have to be vegetarian, but as Akal Takht maryada says otherwise, i dont think they would have aleg to stand on. But even if they accepted Akal Takht maryada, it wouldnt mean they would eat it. My dad accepts Akal Takht maryada on meat, and he hasnt eaten any for 25 years.

However I would think that more people would accept this, if they had open mind on the subject.

[kdsingh80]

i think most would think that you have to be vegetarian, but as Akal Takht maryada says otherwise, i dont think they would have aleg to stand on. But even if they accepted Akal Takht maryada, it wouldnt mean they would eat it. My dad accepts Akal Takht maryada on meat, and he hasnt eaten any for 25 years.

However I would think that more people would accept this, if they had open mind on the subject.

Well From past 5 years I have seen that any new youngster sikh from west join sikh site compare Eating meat with other 3 kurhits .Many says that after becoming Religious they have stopped eating all kinds of meat,so it means majority their believe that meat eating prohibited in Sikhism,that is why I am asking this question because if you people could not get support of your own people then it could become very difficult for you to ask for Jhatka meat.

[DSG]

Just a question to UK sangat .How many of practicing sikhs in UK actually believe that Jhatka meat is allowed in sikhism?

Good question ,, my thoughts on this is that , even thouig Akal Takht have authorised eating jatka meat , I think the biggest problem is we are trying to compare ourselves with the Gurus , and the period in which the Gurus Lived by quoting scriptures according to our own thoughts but common sense prevails you take any animal if you try to approach it , it will either run away , or prepare itself for being attacked therefore will either attack first or defend itself , so for survial reasons as the animals do I believe it is "just" but again there are survial techniques which involve eating plant like things which are enough to survive , how many of us go in the jungle to "hunt" for plants that are edible ? so believe due to our own tastes we adopt to eat meat .. today. I believe its an individual thing .

Secondly , peforming jatka , cooking and eating dont go besides meditating and doing paart , you want to focus your mind on waheguru , do simran to control your 5 senses , how can this be done if constantly in your mind you see the poor animal pouring outs its blood and guts ... no way can it be done , you are just adding another barrier to illiminate when doing naam simran i.e. scenario ..... I was doing naam simran , couldnt focus my mind kept seeing the goat .... )

Finally I believe the more paart you do , the more love you show towards waheguru , your mann will automatically put you off eating meat , I knew a guy clean shaven , use to do the whole lot .. eat meat , drink ... by wahegurus kirpa he saw the light , now gets up amrit vela , does seva , ( you can tell by speaking to the guy , that he is practising Sikhism.... we went to a close family wedding where they were serving meat and alchohol , I saw him sitting in his car , and approached him and asked why he wasnt inside .... his answer was the smell of the meat is getting to me , making me feel sick ) ... so I believe waheguru will show you the correct path , if paart and simran are done with sharda ( which we all hope to achieve)

[Xylitol]

the idea of jhatka stores is based solely upon desire for taste and some sort of nostalgia.

incredibly few sikhs even have a decent handle on their kaam, i don't think adding tamsic food (or super rajsic depending on your viewpoint) will help with that. And it won't add any warrior spirit to them either, despite deluded claims to the contrary.

[dalsingh101]

For me the whole issue resolves around the point about variance. Meat isn't that important me me, I can do with or without. But the real issue is one where one section of the panth likes to dictate to another in minute detail.

The way this becomes a central issue for so many apnay when we have other VERY SERIOUS issues with regard to drugs problems, apathy to heritage/faith, female foeticide etc. etc.

I do find it hard to grasp why apnay go mental over an issue like this when evidence clearly point at Singhs eating meat and hunting in the 18th century?

The vast majority of the Amritdhari community is vegetarian, pro-vegetarians should be happy about this.

Edited October 24, 2010 by dalsingh101

[kdsingh80]

Good question ,, my thoughts on this is that , even thouig Akal Takht have authorised eating jatka meat , I think the biggest problem is we are trying to compare ourselves with the Gurus , and the period in which the Gurus Lived by quoting scriptures according to our own thoughts but common sense prevails you take any animal if you try to approach it , it will either run away , or prepare itself for being attacked therefore will either attack first or defend itself , so for survial reasons as the animals do I believe it is "just" but again there are survial techniques which involve eating plant like things which are enough to survive , how many of us go in the jungle to "hunt" for plants that are edible ? so believe due to our own tastes we adopt to eat meat .. today. I believe its an individual thing .

DSG ji

Not all meat is consumed for taste.If you go to coastal area's you will find people eating Fish because it is cheaply available in plenty.Also meat is excellent source of proteins and amino acids.In CWG the largest items that was consumed by Athletes was Chicken and we all know that Athletes don't eat for taste.They all have to eat what their coach recommend them.

As far taste arguement is concerned I find it quite hilarious because more and more people make langar extremely tasty.I still remember as a Child sometimes the sole motive of going to some akhand paath in this and that rich sikh house was langar because we all knew that their Langar was going to be extremely tasty, sometimes cooked by expensive chefs.

Secondly , peforming jatka , cooking and eating dont go besides meditating and doing paart , you want to focus your mind on waheguru , do simran to control your 5 senses , how can this be done if constantly in your mind you see the poor animal pouring outs its blood and guts ... no way can it be done , you are just adding another barrier to illiminate when doing naam simran i.e. scenario ..... I was doing naam simran , couldnt focus my mind kept seeing the goat

I think that is your experiance.Just a question do you have a same feeling when you see a skiny Ox pulling a heavy cart or Diary buffalo tied to rope.If not why ?those animals are suffering ,sometimes much more than goat yet many don't have same feeling toward them

[DSG]

I'm pretty certain that if they tried hard enough the atheletes could find an alternative for protein in meat. The expense/afforable issue is a different ball game altogether , if they cooked daal for example , it would probably last them longer than meat/fish hence save them money in the long run ( only a minor point i know , but all counts)

The OX pulling the cart , is cruelty to animals , once in india i saw a poor donkey , pulling a cart , then on top of the cart 2 people , and 3 steel long gurders. This kind of cruelty I believe you will only see 3rd world countries , the value of life is not much compared to most developed countries.

But anyway , i believe the most important is each individual including me ,read Gurbani , practice Gurbani , do seva etc... whole heartedly ... Waheguru will defintely show you the correct path and give you the strength to help others .... end of the day the buck stops with us .

[jaikaara]

what i belive is this is a question related to our emotions in regards to meat, now if we jump to naam simran and meditation....we r done ..that would mean each and everything should end like this...the panth has a prob ..chchaddo yaar..simran karo ..assannu ki?....sikh gals are targetted and converted to islam...chchaddo yaar..simran karo...

this is pure escapism..this issue should be understood before expressing and expecting people to rate yor chardikala...you maybe spiritual ..but talking of meat doesnt make one less spiritual ..doesnt gurbani say..maas maas kar murakh jhaggre..so what does that mean ? that u shouldnt argue and accept all that shit in the market?? eat kutha and do simran ? or just turn yor head and be vegeterian and do simran ????

with this attitude we will never be sikhs we shall be hindus part 2...they had had this attitude..and to protect humanity and hindustan KHALSA had to take birth.

[Guest zulu]

personally for me I think its down to what path you follow....if your a jungi....shastardhari, learn shastar vidiya, you follow the ksatriya way then its fine to eat chatka but for average day folks who dont follow that path there isnt any need to eat it.

Thats how I see it.

[dalsingh101]

This is full on. So be warned. It seems to show a halal abattoir in France (by the sounds of it). I think we should have some understanding of what goes on when slaughtering animals, both kutha and other methods.

Don't watch if you are of a delicate disposition: