Is Naam The Anahad Naad?

[Sahib]

not only radhaswamis,udasis,osho,yogis but now many cults are in this belief that naam in shri guru granth sahib is the soundless sound or the anahad naad .onkar is said to be the name of this sound..what are your thoughts guys?

Edited August 25, 2014 by Sahib

[Ragmaala]

I guess only Guru Parmeshwar Ji and his true bhagats know the answer to this question. This is something to be experienced. Rest we can only give theories by using commentaries of others.

Or this question is pertinent to those who have reached that stage and are in need of guidance as to how to proceed further.

[BhagatSingh]

Most Indian religions, sects and cults believe this, yes. In Guru Granth Sahib, Ram naam is the name of the Anhad naad. Onkar is another name. And there are other countless names.

But this is only lip service.To truly understand the answer you have to meditate on Naam, ie do naam simran, and find out yourself!

Guru Ramdas ji says

ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਬੋਲਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮਾ ਮਿਲਿ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਹਰਿ ਤੋਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

[CdnSikhGirl]

All is ONE, and ONE is ALL

The ONE contemplated itself. It had nothing else to contemplate, and in that contemplation, the 'spark' of creation.

The ONE we know is formless, yet possesses all forms. How can this be?

If we look at quantum physics, we know that the base of all the Universe is vibration... pure frequency.

Light, heat, radio, radiation, colour, sound, even matter itself all exists through vibration. Thought too, is pure frequency and brainwaves can be measured by EEG.

Why is this important? The clues MUST be within the Universe itself... consciousness, is formless, yet can possess all forms (dreams, imagery, thought, creativity) Thoughts do not take up 'space' they create space (imagine yourself dreaming, how can you quantify the space your dream takes?)

This is important, because the base of all existence is pure frequency. At the lowest end is said to be sound... Every major religion in the world, speaks of a primal sound or 'word' that created the Universe. Most go beyond that and say that the word or sound itself IS God.

My thoughts on anahad naad, is that it's the direct experience of this primal 'sound' - which goes way beyond simply hearing a sound... as you yourself are created into existence by this same force, then the experience going within and interacting directly with the source, is overwhelming. It's not just hearing something, but actually experiencing the base truth of existence. And that truth is ONEness. That everything we know as matter, separateness, even our own identity is an illusion. It's no longer belief... it's knowing.

By going within, you are actually dissolving the illusion and discovering the truth of your existence. You do hear an audible sound... which itself is indescribable, and I have only gotten to this stage and also OBEs, but beyond this is only actually merging with it. Laying down your whole built up identity and becoming one with it. I have not reached that stage.

These thoughts are only my own, I in no way purport to be any sort of expert...

[Lucky]

On ‎8‎/‎25‎/‎2014 at 4:26 PM, BhagatSingh said:

Most Indian religions, sects and cults believe this, yes. In Guru Granth Sahib, Ram naam is the name of the Anhad naad. Onkar is another name. And there are other countless names.

But this is only lip service.To truly understand the answer you have to meditate on Naam, ie do naam simran, and find out yourself!

Guru Ramdas ji says

ਹਰਿ ਜਨ ਬੋਲਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮਾ ਮਿਲਿ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਹਰਿ ਤੋਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Totally agree.

Because there is no one single definition to describe naam, shabad and naad,.. they are sometimes used interchangeably.

You have to experience it for yourself and you will know when ''Naam'' begins to get pargat and then how you start getting attuned to it.

A simple way of helping yourself to understand it is to think of the naad, shabad, oung....as being a vibration- just like everything else in the Universe.

As per physics; we know that to graph a vibrational wave with peaks and troughs, there is always some source or origin where it begins or originates from.....and if we eliminate this source of origin, then the vibrational wave ceases to exist.

A wave of vibration, as we understand is also what connects the source of origin to the receiver/perceiver.

....bearing this mind, I like to think of -

-Naam as being the source of origin... or the infinite/unknown. aad jugadh, ajuni source

-Naad or shabad as being the vibrational wave that is active in all of creation.... this is analogous to a sound wave, but not like the one's on this physical plane where they diminish in amplitude over a distance. The NAAM is continuous and is not affected by any resistive forces.

As per anand sahib....'Naam jin kai mann vasia, vajey shabad ganerey''....... the Naam becomes pargat or manifests when one hears/feels the shabad vibrating within the mind. This goes on 24/7. If it's not 24/7, then it is not pargat yet.

We could also say that one begins to get taste and feel this naam state of mind by connecting with the shabad/naad

 

Getting back to the OP question

''Is Naam the Anhad Naad?"......

Well, anhad naad is a form of the naam or a manner in which one experiences naam. Strictly speaking, it's impossible to configure or describe in words unless one begins to experience it through naam kamayee. And all abyasees will tell you the same.

You will also understand that Naam is not something that can be initiated by master whispering into initiates ear.. .as sometimes understood by some Naam is also not inured or obtained in amrit sanchar either

We have to earn all of these with free will and efforts (Kamayee)

[Sahib]

I am not doubting anything or else..i too believe its better to be practical and meditate rather than getting into philosophies..i just wanted to know your what you guys conclude so far.

So what you all mean is that naam it is is something very deep.and anahad naad is just the part of the naam..

when i read sggs even i feel like naam is been refered to the very lord 'the source of bliss..i

[Sat1176]

Only a person who makes it to the finishing line and been through all the stages can answer that question Sahib.

I'm now beginning to understand that true anhad sounds are very powerful, loud and distinct. They are not the subtle background sounds we hear from time to time but you can use them as indicators that your mind is becoming more and more still.

[Sahib]

Ya..the initial sounds are just helpful for concentration...anhad sounds are loud and uplifiting ..they uplift your surt very fast in sukhmana nadi which gives us a flying like sensation

[BhagatSingh]

Totally agree.

Because there is no one single definition to describe naam, shabad and naad,.. they are sometimes used interchangeably.

Lucky bhaji as I understand it, the meaning of naam, shabad and naad is name, word and sound current, respectively. They is obviously more to it, in guru granth sahib these words become loaded with certain concepts, but I don't think the base meaning ever changes. Can you share some examples where the base meaning is different?

[Sahib]

But its also mentioned to chant the name..naam japna..so sometimes it also mean gurmantar...they are some saints like ishar singh who say that it is good to concentrate on initial sounds.but i ve also met one saint who used to say that these sounds a re disturbing..and they distract you from the jap..

Edited September 2, 2014 by Sahib

[BhagatSingh]

But its also mentioned to chant the name..naam japna..so sometimes it also mean gurmantar...

Sahib, calling the name a gurmantar doesn't change the definition of name.

they are some saints like ishar singh who say that it is good to concentrate on initial sounds.but i ve also met one saint who used to say that these sounds a re disturbing..and they distract you from the jap..

Both are correct for different reasons.

Imagine the Y axis is the depth of concentration, how deeply you focus on the mantra.

And X is the breadth of concentration, this is exploring phenomenon that arises.

Sant Ishar Singh ji is correct to say that it is good to explore the phenomenon that arise in the space of one's consciousness. (travelling on the X axis)

The other saint is also correct to say that is is good to deepen the space of one's consciousness. (travelling on the Y axis)

However...

You don't want to get stuck exploring the X axis when you think you are going deep into Y. And similarly, you don't want to get stuck going deeper into Y axis thinking you are exploring the X. You gotta be able to recognize where you stand. Only you can be the judge of your own progress and you have to learn to make the distinction. This is part of the learning process.

I have an analogy.

If you go into a jungle and you see a cave. Going in the cave is Y, and exploring the jungle is X. Both are good but....

...you should know where you are on the map!

Does that make sense?

[Sahib]

Ya i guess..indirectly you mean to say both are the diferent roads to the same destination..but one has to be sure about his road and continue that

[BhagatSingh]

Ya i guess..indirectly you mean to say both are the diferent roads to the same destination..but one has to be sure about his road and continue that

No that's not what I am saying.

You have to deepen your concentration and you have to explore the contents of your mind. They are both important.

[chzS1ngh]

Ya..the initial sounds are just helpful for concentration...anhad sounds are loud and uplifiting ..they uplift your surt very fast in sukhmana nadi which gives us a flying like sensation

Thanks you ji for your post...

i have read many other posts from people wondering if they are hearing anhad sounds, they are not sure so they concentrate on some of them and it gives a blissful experience and seems to take you deeper into meditation (concentration), others wonder in meditation to various parts of the head...

many sounds can be heard..giving signs that i am progressing...but then out of the blue appear other sounds like you describe...for me they were loud also and they grab hold of your attention and pull you up very fast....upon hearing no one will need to ask the question any further of it's significance...these sounds are just different...like a speeding train shooting past you, and you stick your arm out (attention) and grab hold of handle on the train, and it just takes you away

Ego says "I have achieved this, Ego says i found the sound myself" so we try to replicate, try all sorts....meditation starts to become a mental exertion again...bringing frustration at times...when in fact i have found a heartfelt ardaas, and just surrendering yourself to the power that be has bought me closer to Guru Ji...

No power to speak, no power to keep silent. No power to beg, no power to give. No power to live, no power to die. No power to rule, with wealth and occult ...no power to gain intuitive understanding, spiritual wisdom and understanding....

Edited September 2, 2014 by chzS1ngh

[Sahib]

Exactly..thats what i am saying...these sounds are definitely the signs of good concentration...but anahad nad is anahad naad..when it is heard it is experienced then there is no question left..

[sukrit kaur]

I just want to add some words in this disscussion.i really know nothing and have not experienced this yet.but i read somewhere that a stage comes where you need a guru to hold you and to reach where you want to go.i am highly confused here.i mean there we'll meet that purkh?? Please do help me in this??as it's said little knowledge is dangerous..so i want to get familiar with it..

[Lucky]

I just want to add some words in this disscussion.i really know nothing and have not experienced this yet.but i read somewhere that a stage comes where you need a guru to hold you and to reach where you want to go.i am highly confused here.i mean there we'll meet that purkh?? Please do help me in this??as it's said little knowledge is dangerous..so i want to get familiar with it..

To put it in simple small words...............

We don't need no master or physical guide to help,hold and guide us at further stages..

ALL we need and should be looking for is the SHABAD.

The Shabad IS the Guru.

Guru Nanak ji told the yogis 'shabad guru surat dhun chela'....when they asked young guruji who his master guru was.

However, if we are blessed with his kirpa and baksh...and may need a guide to hold our hands across the turbulent world ocean, then Nanak ji himself will give you his darshan.

[sukrit kaur]

To put it in simple small words...............

We don't need no master or physical guide to help,hold and guide us at further stages..

ALL we need and should be looking for is the SHABAD.

The Shabad IS the Guru.

Guru Nanak ji told the yogis 'shabad guru surat dhun chela'....when they asked young guruji who his master guru was.

However, if we are blessed with his kirpa and baksh...and may need a guide to hold our hands across the turbulent world ocean, then Nanak ji himself will give you his darshan.

Yes,Nanak ji can give us darshan.I know it sounds easy but..Can you please add more about shabad..I do know little about it,but hard to say unless it's experienced.Shabad starts listening at it's own after an appropriate stage or waheguru is the shabad??

I know my question makes no sense ,but i need views to make my doubts clear.

Edited November 1, 2014 by sukrit kaur

[BhagatSingh]

Yes,Nanak ji can give us darshan.I know it sounds easy but..Can you please add more about shabad..I do know little about it,but hard to say unless it's experienced.Shabad starts listening at it's own after an appropriate stage or waheguru is the shabad??

I know my question makes no sense ,but i need views to make my doubts clear.

The shabad (word) is His name 'Waheguru', into which you are supposed to focus on with your whole mind.

If you can find a physical guru, that's awesome too because they can give advice for your particular case. They can tell you what you need to hear. So how do you recognize a guru? Anyone to whom you listen to, who takes you deeper into your consciousness, is a guru.

[Truthseeker]

Gurbani explains to us perfectly what is Shabad//Panch Shabad/Sehaj Dhune/Sacha Shabad/Toor/Naad - all refer to Naam (different forms).


Āsā mėhlā 5.
Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:

Uḏam karaṯ hovai man nirmal nācẖai āp nivāre.
Making the effort, the mind becomes pure; in this dance, the self is silenced. (effort to jap: chant and meditate on gurmantra)

Pancẖ janā le vasgaṯ rākẖai man mėh ekankāre. ||1||
The five passions are kept under control, and the One Lord dwells in the mind. ||1||

Ŧerā jan niraṯ kare gun gāvai.
Your humble servant dances and sings Your Glorious Praises.

Rabāb pakẖāvaj ṯāl gẖungẖrū anhaḏ sabaḏ vajāvai. ||1|| rahā▫o.
He plays upon the guitar, tambourine and cymbals, and the unstruck sound current of the Shabad resounds. ||1||Pause||

Parathme man parboḏẖai apnā pācẖẖai avar rījẖāvai.
First, he instructs his own mind, and then, he leads others.

Rām nām jap hirḏai jāpai mukẖ ṯe sagal sunāvai. ||2||
He chants the Lord's Name and meditates on it in his heart; with his mouth, he announces it to all. ||2||

Kar sang sāḏẖū cẖaran pakẖārai sanṯ ḏẖūr ṯan lāvai.
He joins the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, and washes their feet; he applies the dust of the Saints to his body

Man ṯan arap ḏẖare gur āgai saṯ paḏārath pāvai. ||3||
He surrenders his mind and body, and places them before the Guru; thus, he obtains the true wealth. ||3||

Jo jo sunai pekẖai lā▫e sarḏẖā ṯā kā janam maran ḏukẖ bẖāgai.
Whoever listens to, and beholds the Guru with faith, shall see his pains of birth and death taken away.

Aisī niraṯ narak nivārai Nānak gurmukẖ jāgai. ||4||4||43||
Such a dance eliminates hell; O Nanak, the Gurmukh remains wakeful. ||4||4||43||

ANG 381



Some more quotes from Guru Granth Sahib:

Gẖantā jā kā sunī▫ai cẖahu kunt.
His bell resounds to the four corners of the world.

Binvanṯ Nānak sukẖ nām bẖagṯī ḏar vajėh anhaḏ vāje. ||4||3||
Prays Nanak, happiness comes from devotional worship of the Naam; at His Door, the unstruck melody resounds

Pancẖ sabaḏ ḏẖun anhaḏ vāje ham gẖar sājan ā▫e. ||1||
The unstruck sound current of the Panch Shabad, the Five Primal Sounds, vibrates and resounds; my friends have come into my home.

Anhaḏ sabaḏ ḏasam ḏu▫ār vaji▫o ṯah amriṯ nām cẖu▫ā▫i▫ā thā. ||2||
The unstruck sound current of the Shabad vibrates and resounds in the Tenth Gate; the Ambrosial Naam trickles down there

Man mukẖ nām japahu jagjīvan riḏ anṯar alakẖ lakẖā▫i▫ā. ||12||
Chant the Naam with your mind and mouth; know the unknowable Lord, the Life of the World, deep within the nucleus of your heart.

ghunghroo vaajai jay man laagai.
You shall hear the vibrations of the tinkling bells, when your mind is held steady.

Panj Shabad, Anhad Bani and Sehaj Dhun

The terms used in the chapter include panj Shabad, anhad bani and
sehaj dhun. These are in the form of music tunes. Panj shabad
means the five divine sounds. They resound in the house of mind
and also with Truth. The divine speech of Truth is known as Anhad
Bani. It is the best of all the speeches. Truth Himself gives this
speech. Sehaj dhun is the divine Word of Truth. It is the divine
command for our minds and is also known as Hukam.

Truth in His grace and mercy reveals His secret Shabad – the
insignia of His existence- (Anhad Bani or Sehaj Dhun) to some
blessed souls. The Guru gives the Gurmantra and through Gurman-
tra the secret Anhad Sabad (Word of Truth) is revealed to the
seeker.



These sounds resemble the tones and tunes of a cricket, flute, gong,
conch shell, horn, tinkling bells, trumpet, rebeck, singing cicadas in
the silence of the night, and a falling bronze vessel. Other than five
sounds, many more melodies manifest. On the opening of the sixth
chakra, the Shabad enters the Gagan (the Tenth Sky). This
continuously reverberating melody at the Tenth Sky is called Sehaj
Dhun or Anhad sabad. When our mind enters the stage of
UnnMunn (inward mind), all the doors open and the tunes and all
the shabads start to sound.

The divine melody of the Shabad vibrates.
(SGGS 917)

The combined symphony of these sounds is called Anhad Bani.
When these melodies are very loud and fast they are called Taar
Ghor Bajaantar (The grand orchestra of divine music). All these
melodies reverberate at the Tenth Door in the Sukhmana and are
called the divine music in the house of Sukhmana “Sukhman De
Ghar Raag”

1. wind instrument (flute, trombon, harmonica etc.)
2. Leather instrument (tabla, dhol, drum etc.)
3. String instrument (Rabab, Harp, Guitar, sarangi, etc.)
4. Metal instrument (khadtaal, chimta, ghungroo (tinkling bells)
5. Earthen pot ( ghatam, ghadda),

Edited November 2, 2014 by Truthseeker

[sukrit kaur]

The shabad (word) is His name 'Waheguru', into which you are supposed to focus on with your whole mind.

If you can find a physical guru, that's awesome too because they can give advice for your particular case. They can tell you what you need to hear. So how do you recognize a guru? Anyone to whom you listen to, who takes you deeper into your consciousness, is a guru.

This is the point where i get confused."physical guru" means other than guru granth sahib ji?I know there are answers of all questions in guru granth sahib ji,but without his bliss it's very difficult to understand all.So,there are lot of questions in my mind.I try to meditate,but such queries are restricting me.I mean I get scared while meditating.So,should i focus on waheguru? It will happen on it's own?In gurbani there is lot of stress at many places about NAAM.I know it's hard to say anything unless experienced. I hope waheguru ji will make my doubts clear .. Edited November 2, 2014 by sukrit kaur

[Lucky]

I know there are so many questions.

My easiest piece of advice would be to start doing regular simran with waheguru jap.

Ideally most of us that speak on here have started with the saas graas and saas saas jugtees(techniques)

It really doesn't matter what technique you use as long as you get to that internal discipline of steadying your mind(from jumping to thoughts) and japping internally with the mind.

Eventually;-(if you already haven't)..you will begin to fall in love with the waheguru gurmantar.

Whilst doing this it is important to be listening, listening and listening...to just listen to yourself inside doing the jap.

It is when you start listening to your sukham(subtle) self whilst doing jap...that waheguru begins to manifest within.

[sukrit kaur]

I know there are so many questions.

My easiest piece of advice would be to start doing regular simran with waheguru jap.

Ideally most of us that speak on here have started with the saas graas and saas saas jugtees(techniques)

It really doesn't matter what technique you use as long as you get to that internal discipline of steadying your mind(from jumping to thoughts) and japping internally with the mind.

Eventually;-(if you already haven't)..you will begin to fall in love with the waheguru gurmantar.

Whilst doing this it is important to be listening, listening and listening...to just listen to yourself inside doing the jap.

It is when you start listening to your sukham(subtle) self whilst doing jap...that waheguru begins to manifest within.

Yes,i appreciate what you adviced..I hope waheguru ji will show his kirpa..

[BhagatSingh]

This is the point where i get confused."physical guru" means other than guru granth sahib ji?I know there are answers of all questions in guru granth sahib ji,but without his bliss it's very difficult to understand all.So,there are lot of questions in my mind.I try to meditate,but such queries are restricting me.I mean I get scared while meditating.So,should i focus on waheguru? It will happen on it's own?In gurbani there is lot of stress at many places about NAAM.I know it's hard to say anything unless experienced. I hope waheguru ji will make my doubts clear ..

I mean a person-Guru. But really anyone, any place and anything can be a guru if it takes you deeper within your consciousness.

What do you mean you get scared while meditating. Scared of what?

[sukrit kaur]

I mean a person-Guru. But really anyone, any place and anything can be a guru if it takes you deeper within your consciousness.

What do you mean you get scared while meditating. Scared of what?

It's a very different kind of fear.I mean whenever i try to meditate i feel like my body is going to vibrate.I know it's the fear of mind, but it's still here.