DSG

It would be good if they divulge who is behind the beadbi and make it Public, as surely if they got him to admit to the crimes , surely they must have asked him who told him to do it .... sounds a bit fishy

Chatanga1 , help her bro. If you have the gian , then share it and help her , its a good cause teaching someone which they will benefit.

The Jatedar said even though the pardon has been revoked it is still open for discussion. ( now what does that mean ) nothing concrete was said by Jatedar Gurbachan Singh . He needs to be questioned to find out who is behind all this , but will he speak up ?

I think the issue is about power and money . If you look at Punjab , what is there for the normal law abiding citizen ... nothing really You educate the young , then its who you know in order to get a job. To apply for jobs , people want money , application forms are filled in for money . Now thousands and thousands apply , then they dont hear anything. The Police are so corrupt , Cynthia Mahood an anthropologist , started to study about Sikhs in the 1980's , the autrocities and cruelties she has been through is unbelievable. She herself was sent death threats and gang raped and torctured by 6 people , who turned out to be the Police, and she is from USA, what hope has the average Punjabi got if he/she stands up to injustices against the government / Police .... none at all. You may be born into a Sikh family but does not make one a Sikh. I think theres a bigger agenda , where the average joe blog or shall i say joginder bhogal :) :) are being used to do the dirty work. The question is why would someone do such atrocities , could it be either just out of hatred , personal conflict , forced to do it , money exchanging hands , lack of knowledge ... Why ? is the key question. Education/awareness i think is the key , educate all and most important any person committing such crimes need to be punished. A big investigation from top down ( government , to MP's , to the Police etc.. needs to be done and I agree rather than beating the perpetrators get them to confess 100% as why they did such crimes , then expose them all . The sad part is that if someone starts doing this without the backing of the kaum , then most definitely he or she will be put down , you need masses , the kaum to wake up and all walk the walk and talk the talk to make a difference.

very good well done an inspiration to all

Please view and sign the petition https://www.change.org/p/bbc-bbc-report-on-indian-govt-opening-fire-on-peaceful-sikh-rally-after-media-blackout-order?recruiter=59504107&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=whatsapp The Indian Govt has today opened fire and sanctioned the use of water cannons and brute force by Punjab police on thousands of it’s own citizens whilst they were peacefully staging a sit-in protest. Sikhs had gathered to protest the lack of police action in a case of the desecration of the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji in the area of Kotakpura Punjab. Disturbingly the Indian Govt has ordered a media blackout in Punjab. Yet still news, images and video footage is emerging on social media of the violence being perpetrated against innocent civilians – three civilian deaths have been reported and hundreds of casualties, with the death toll set to rise as more reports come to light. This is the most recent episode in an escalation of violence by the Indian Govt against the Sikh minority of India. They have also been torturing and force feeding an octogenarian who- protesting against the illegal detention of prisoners who have long since served their sentences- has been on hunger strike for over 280 days. The Punjab police has been harassing his supporters and illegally detaining prominent Sikh figures who’ve been peacefully protesting the state's interference in matters concerning the Sikh governing body. Despite the BBC having large presence in India with many reporters stationed there – it has not picked up this story. There is no mention of this on any of the their news media outlets in India or here in the UK, despite the fact that their express global purpose is to “provide international news broadcasting of the highest quality, enabiling individuals to participate on the global debate on significant international issues”. This is a significant issue for the 20 million Sikhs worldwide. We rely on the BBC as (in their own words) an “independent, objective and honest” news organisation to report on such issues. Please sign this petition and get the BBC to cover this story and turn the spotlight “the worlds biggest democracy” and the crimes it's committing against it’s own people.

Very bad indeed I really feel for the brothers and sisters in Punjab You go to the Police .... they are corrupt You go to the politicians .... they are corrupt You go to the jatedars .... they are corrupt You protest peacfully .... you are stopped and killed Where do they go for justice ???????? The police suppose to be the peaceful mediators , rather they are instigating and retaliating to violence The sad thing is the majority of the Police have distaars , dont they feel any remorse towards the fellow Sikh brothers and sisters and the beadbi to dhan dhan sri gur granth sahib ji, are their jobs that important that they cant see right from wrong ? If they were at all decent , they would put down their weapons, take off their uniform and tell the Badal clan , we are not your puppets and rebel , the sangat will then take care of them...no doubt. so sad

WAKE UP CALL !!!! Was watching Sikh channel yesterday and they were discussing , how we should setup Sarbat Khalsa , and the 5 jatedar incompetence by pardoniong Sauda wala and lack of response from them regarding Jatedar Surat Singh They are thinking about holding a meeting in Punjab for all leaders/ jate bandis to meet up and discuss about Sarbat Khalsa Sangat Ji What are your views and how do you think we can move forward ? Some thoughts or views that came out from yesterdays program were :- 1. Lets not look back , move forward 2. Send emails to the jatedars current residing at Harimandir Sahib . Bombard them with so much emails so they know sangat is against their decision 3.Lets not rush into holding meetings , lets take our time and think it through 4. We need to act , not just merely talk then couple of weeks pass by then all is forgotten , back to square one 5. Let the Sikh Council decide on the criteria as to the roles and responsibilities required 6. Oust out the current jatedars , the Sangat will do this 7. Educate the people in villages , make it our individual duty to make others aware 8. Have a global fund , to fight for these causes 9. Use media more , maybe hold world wide video conferencing to discuss i.e. one from UK , italy , delhi, germany usa ,canada , rather than all physically going to one location 10. The badal clan will not allow meetings to be held in punjab . Hold a meeting at nankana sahib , 11, Have more than one backup plan , if group A are falsely arrested, beaten up put in jail then group B carry on with the cause 12. For future candidates of jatedars / leaders have a selection and not election . Go back to the khalsa days 13. Have a poll in each country and send the figures to Akaal Takt stating how many people are against the jatedars decision. 14. All leaders/jatebandis sangat to unite under one nishaan sahib 15. No violence , lets keep knocking at their door until the so called culprits resign / admit to their wrong doings Just some thoughts / ideas please sangat share your views ...

whats so secretarian and crazy about , the 9th Guru Dhan dhan sri gur Tegh Bhadaur Ji sacrificing his life so that YOU can live the way you do NOW . Bhai Dyala Ji, Mati Das , Sati Das sacrificing their lives , with extreme torture. Dheru Ram didnt see his act as secretarian and Crazy ... Did he ? ...... in your eyes he must have been a one off And many all over the world , black,white, yellow, pink , hindu, sikh, christian, jew etc.. seeing this as a great act of sacrifice EXCEPT YOU ... you only see as secretarian and Crazy If you even bothered to watch the program rather than going off on a tangent as usual , you would realise ... GROW UP MAN !!! The world is not out to get you or in FACT Sikhs are not out to get you , we got better things to do. Where do i state that ONLY Sikh women made sacrifices ? GROW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I saw this yesterday , one very interesting point was that , her grandfathers father was born as Dheru Ram , from Hindu family and it was custom to give one of their chilldren into Sikhi out of respect due to the sacrifices the Gurus and Singhs made to uphold justice in India , hence her grandfather was Sant Ram and then Sant Singh ... truly amazing. My father also told me of the sacrifices Sikh Women had to make in order to save them from rape/torture by the muslims ...shocking

Wahe Guru Ji Ka Khalsa Wahe Guru Ji Ke Fateh Please see presentation regarding selection V Election when running a Gurudawara. http://www.srsofchicago.com/selection-vs-election-systems-in-our-gurdwaras-which-is-gur-matta-based/

contact details of the jatedars and dera wala , which they wont respond to but regardless we should bombard them with messages of concern Contact details of the Panj Takhat Sahib ‘Jathedars’:1.Gurbachan Singh, Sri Akal Takht Sahib, Sri Amritsar. 0183-2540820 Extn. 434 2.Mal Singh, Takht Sri Kesgarh Sahib, Sri Anandpur Sahib. 01887-232100 (Office)94175-42974 (Mobile) 3.Iqbal Singh, Takht Sri Patna Sahib, Bihar. 0162-2641821, 0612-2642000, 0162-646574 4. Kulwant Singh, Takht Sri Hazoor Sahib (Nanded) Maharashtra. 02462-241266 240083, 238222 5. Balwant Singh, Takht Sri Damdma Sahib, Talwandi Saboo (Bathinda) 01655-220036 (Office), 94172-20036 (Mobile)Avtar Makkar, President, S.G.P.C.+91-183-2553950 (Office)+91-98558-95558 (Mobile)Email: president@sgpc.netDera Jhoota Sauda Contact details:Shah Satnam Dham, Sirsa – 125055 (Office) 91-1666-238610(Mobile) , 238650 (Office), 245688 (Office)Email: msg@derasachasauda.in

Also see The 5 jatedar are a joke , a lot of noise is being made to oust them out of power ,

Have a look at following link , may help you http://sikhism.about.com/od/sikhfuneralcustoms/tp/Sikh_funeral.htm

Even though i agree discussions are good , but these type of discussions i feel is breaking the panth , you have people 1. For Dasam Granth ji 2. Anti Dasam Granth ji 3. in the middle 4. only for Sri Guru granth sahib ji 5. For none In summary from all the posts , my understanding is that One must be at a certain spiritual level to fully understand the true meaning . How is this achieved ? Should there be a caveat in place , stating one must have had proper santhiya of both granths for x amount of years before they start preaching / having dialogue with the sangat as not to misguide them ? ( Like Bhai Pinderpal Singh) Should the granths be easily/readily available online/other sources as the normal "Joe Bloggs" reading the granth , especially the english translation will take the meaning literary and question and question its authenticity . Or does read and follow its teachings ...period no questions asked. If they do ask questions , who do they ask ? ( Forums , Granthis , mates and how legitimate will they be ?) The questions asked should they be put in way asking for answers ? Then you get some , who get all defensive and abusive and attack personally due to one questioning the context according to their own psyche. Where does one draw the line ?

I think we are missing the point here. Why does one read Gurbani ? My understanding is that for enhancing one spiritually , to become close to the almighty , to get rid of the 5 thieves (lust , anger ,greed,ego,materialism) etc.., this relationship is between you and almighty . If you feel by reading any granth you are hitting this areas , and becoming a better person then read it , practice it , if not then dont , as simple as that , and the more spiritually enlightened one becomes the closer to the truth they become.

Its a sad state theres no sharda left anymore . Rather than discussing, explaining etc... they are so rude , want to fight you rather than talk to you. I think they all need to have a Piare Pill and they need Singhs/Singhni's who have this gian to explain to the bride and groom , like Basics of Sikhi who are doing a fantastic job and can have a proper dialogue with the bride,groom and families regarding the Anand Kharj ceremony. All gurudawaras need to follow one Rehat Maryada, it seems we are picking and choosing what suits our needs. It will take a lot of time,effort and determination to make a change but an immediate change that can be in place at every Gurudawarais a dialogue with the bride/groom and family who wish to partake in an Anand Kharaj at a Gurudwara.The dialogue should be 100% as to what our Gurus have shown us to do and perform.

The bride and groom need to be educated before the actual wedding day . Tell them about the Anand Kharaj , and ask them questions about whether they agree with the Gurus teachings , if not then tell them to partake in a registry wedding only. I think its all about awareness and i am pretty confident if they are told in advance about the Anand Kharaj in a polite, loving manner they will think twice or even change their mindset, but with brute force its not good. Its funny how this type of news hits the papers and I feel is damaging Sikhi , why not discuss beforehand and iron out any differences amicably

http://www.referendum2020.org/

You ask those people who have lost their loved ones ? You ask those people who have no voice back in Punjab? You ask those people who are falsely arrested and framed ? Theres no voice in Punjab , if we on the "outside" dont speak up and make our voices heard and seek Justice for our brothers and sisters who are being opressed even today , what hope will they have. Look at the recent events , Bapu Surat Singh hunger strike, Sikh Referendum 2020 , the antics the Indian government are playing , WE NEED TO SPEAK UP AND MAKE ALL AWARE so that our brothers and sisters can live in luxury houses , can have a proper toilet to shit in, have proper jobs,have a good economy rather than selfishly looking upon making our backyard even greener. Yes it will be hard , yes we will have to change the mindset of our brothers and sisters. Why did our parents move abroad ? for a better life not just for them but for their children aswell. So its not something we need to SHUT UP about , in fact we need to SHOUT at every opportunity until we get justice , politically,socially and economically back in Punjab.

I dont think setting limitation on a topic will make any difference. Lets face it a bit of controversy makes one read that thread closely, and I think there will always be disagreements , and its how users respond is the key.Vetting this will be very difficult It may be a good idea for the admins to summarise the valid responses to the questions posed , and if they feel the question has been answered then lock the thread (especially the long ones)

Firstly why is there cheating happening ? Is it due to , poor teaching standards Poor facilities I have heard and seen in the past other students taking exams for other students for a fee Is it money oriented , i.e. teachers want money so that they can help students pass Plus who would want to go to some one especially studying medicine who have passed by cheating , i know i wouldnt . I think you would need to look at the root cause , for them cheating and then take the necessary precautions.

why not use jasmine oil / olive oil on your dharri

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa , Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh I just stumbled across the sikhs for justice site and saw the SIkh Referendum 2020. I am quite concerned that such a big step taken by some dedicated American Citizens has not made any mainstream Sikh media ( may be it has but i wasnt aware of it/ maybe they will campaign in the near future as the target is 2020 ) So Sangat ji , what do you think of the Sikh Referendum ( please see the attached doc for details , taken from the following sites ( sikhs for Justice , Panthic org) They require 5 million voters , again who will this be ? Which party will stand up ? What will the currency be ? How will they lobby in Punjab to the normal "pend walla" http://www.panthic.org/articles/5548 https://www.facebook.com/SikhsForJusticePage sikhreferrendum2020.docx

With over 700,000 Sikhs residing in the UK, the sikh network which consists of over 1,000 members ( existing sikh organisations,human rights and political activists, lawyers,academics,researchers,journalists,public sector professionals,management consultants, marketing , PR , charity workers and students ) The Sikh Manifesto 2015-2020 is widely viewed as a crucial development reflecting the political maturity of British Sikhs. The Sikh Manifesto launched for the 2015 general election so that the main political parties seeking Sikh votes are made aware of the Sikh objectives , which in brief are 1) More effective representation in Parliament ( at the moment there is only one MP and 3 Lords representing over 700,000 Sikhs) 2)Separate Ethnic Monitoring ( Office on National Statistics (ONS) , Sikhs to be monitored as a distinct ethnic group 3)Statutory code of practice on the 5K's and Sikh Turban( prevent discrimination in the workplace and public spaces) 4)Action against perpetrators of grooming and force conversions ( as well as abandonment of the word "Asian" by public bodies and the media 5)Network of state funded sikh ethos schools ( Central and local government to support this, target is to have 25 state funded Sikh schools by 2020) 6)Monumnet in London to highlight sikh sacrifices in the first world war 7)Pressure on France to stop discrimination against turban wearing sikhs 8)Independent public inquiry into UK government actions in the lead up to and after the 1984 Sikh genocide 9)UN Led inquiry into 1984 Sikh genocide 10)Application of self determination to the Sikhs Sikh Federation UK was launched in 2003 as the first and only Sikh political party to represent Sikh issues and concerns and also to facilitate consultations by the government and main political parties on issues of national interest. The Sikh Council UK established in 2010 as a common platform for membership Gurudwaras and Sikh organisations to meet and discuss issues of concern. Most recently the Sikh Network. They also had 50 Target seats which they wanted Sikh MPs in the 2015 general election ( I dont think they got any) again due to lack of support, awareness by the Sikh Community. I personally think Nagar Kirtans are a perfect place to canvass and try to convince the Sikh Community to stand up and take part or at least support. Above is an extract from the Sikh Manifesto which was published before the 2015 General election. www.thesikhnetwork.com facebook/thesikhnetwork