Matheen

It would take too many pages.... but here are a few anyway: Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Mecca, in Baghdad (the Sakhi with the Pir's son), Punja Sahib, Turning bitter fruit sweet etc etc. I know you're familiar with Suraj Parkash, Bhai Gurdas' Varan, Janam Sakhis etc. yet you ask me......

i really didn't need to see that last post..........seriously.

Niranjana, there are plenty of examples of the Gurus performing miracles. As i stated, they only act in Akaals hukam. In essence, there is no difference between a true Sant and God, as Gurbani clearly states. (apologies in advance if this causes controversy, and for going waaay off-topic)

Niranjana, they eat for the same reasons that Maharaj Ji ate food etc. While in a human body, they (Mahapursh) follow the Maryada (can't think of a better word) that comes with it, everything is done in Waheguru's hukam. Also, showing kara-mat for no reason is not what Sikhi is about. People don't think about why Guru Gobind Singh Ji fought battles and went through such hardships for us. They could have used karamat but showed us what is expected of us, by setting an example. Saying that, there are several examples of Mahapursh demonstrating that even death is in their control: Sant Karam Singh Ji (Hoti Mardan) announced to the Sangat that they had 8 days to live. The Sangat got together and did an ardas then sent a Sewadar to ask Baba Ji to extend their time. After repeated requests, they told the Sewadar that he had 2years 8 days remaining and asked if he was willing to 'swap' this for the 8 days that they (Baba Ji) had. The sewadar agreed and died exactly 8 days later. Baba Ji left their sareer exactly 2 years later. This was witnessed by a large number of the Sangat at that time. Sant Isher Singh Ji (Rarasahib wale) wrote, in their diary, how long they had left in that sareer. This was 10 years before they left the sareer. In their final year, as the day approached, they announced to Pritam Singh, who is still alive in Canada, that they are extending their time here by 30 days. So while these things are not impossible, Brahmgyanis, as Maharaj Ji did, lead by example. What would be achieved and what lesson taught by not eating? Gurbani clearly states what is possible for a Gursikh, but only a handful ever reach that level. Anyway, this is way off topic now. I suspect your reason for asking this question is to ask W-bol why anyone needs to do anything at all.

Humans have the ability to control kaam. It's one of the things that differentiates us from animals. Gurbani does tell us that the Ghrist marg is highly regarded but it isn't the ONLY path for a Sikh. Many Mahapursh are not married.

Funny thing is, Gurbani makes all this clear, in simple language

You have to be ready for the battle before it begins. W-bol, did you even listen to the Katha that Neo posted?

Maha Kharag Singh, do you perform jhatka in england? (assuming u from there) Some of those Mahapursh were in the army (bir rasi?) in their younger days but kept their Rehat, to the point of breaking ice to have ishnan at Amritvela. A point often not known is that only the Nihung Singhs have aagya to eat meat should the need arise( however the Taruna Dal at Harian Bela differs). Meat is tamoguni, to overcome this, their Nitnem is quite a bit longer than other Sikhs. Talking from personal experience, I had to give up meat, fish, eggs to progress spiritually (this was before Amrit - the Rehat i was blessed with forbids meat) My Nitnem was simply not enough to "pay the price". Also, there are some Mahapursh whose duty is to heal the sick through Gurbani, they insist that anyone who comes to them give up meat if they want to get better and ALL who listen to Gurbani and follow the instructions get healed - this i've seen with my own eyes, in fact they guarantee it. Others, such as Maha Kharag Singh, have been able to progress whilst eating meat, but then, he is a Nihung. BTW, Maha Kharag Singh, where does your Surti tik?

Beautiful pictures singh. I wish the greenery was still there. BTW, are there any paintings of the oringinal Darbar Sahib?

Your Iranian lovers read this forum? (sorry, couldn't help myself)

Mekhane'ch Janat - sorry, but blimey, what a load of trollop....

W-bol, have you heard any of Sant Isher Singh Ji's divans? Furthermore, look into the lives and teachings of all the Mahapursh you mention. Nowhere do they insult another religion or 'reject' the vedas or koran. Being Sikhs, there is no need to get involved.

Deepsingh - you need to look at the original constitution and perhaps read up on the 'founding fathers'. Were slavery and racial segregation Christian principles?

Anand hee Anand.... made my day - haven't seen these in colour before

edited.

talk about going off-topic........

how about explaining why you wear the dastar?

Niranjana: how do you interpret 'giving your head'? Reading all these posts, i don't think anyone's actually disagreeing with anyone else, they just have different ideas of surrender. Makhane'ch Jannat: why the personal attack? When you do realise who you are, you'll realise that you don't despise W-bol, just his ideas, because there is no difference between your real-self and his. I speak from experience.

W-bol, why are you bothered what anyone else does? Maharaj Ji also says not to argue over meat.

Nah singho, i don't mind being disagreed with. What does disturb me is when people 'talk-back' at Guru Sahib. I KNOW that a Sikh has to give everything to his Guru for success on this path, including the mind. As i said in another post, when it comes to 'worldly' matters such as history etc, then a critical mind IS necessary to find the truth, but Gurbani should be accepted without question. Whether you do or don't is not my problem.

I wish we could march for this cause, as we do for Khalistan. How do Singhs in India watch this go on? A cause to fight for, for sure.

As far as asking "Why?", i personally draw the line when it comes to Maharaj Ji. Asking "How?" is another matter, as Maharaj Ji says,"If you wish to swim across the water, then consult those who know how to swim."

Speaking from experience, plus the fact that Maharaj Ji clearly states it, God does "have everything to do with it". Frankly the ignorance about Gurbani (which is our Guru, after all) and the perceived arrogance after having read a few books is amazing.

I think it means to give up your own 'mat' and do what Maharaj Ji asks us to do. Guru Ji themselves say: jau qau pRym Kylx kw cwau ] jo tho praem khaelan kaa chaao || If you desire to play this game of love with Me, isru Dir qlI glI myrI Awau ] sir dhhar thalee galee maeree aao || then step onto My Path with your head in hand. iequ mwrig pYru DrIjY ] eith maarag pair dhhareejai || When you place your feet on this Path, isru dIjY kwix n kIjY ]20] sir dheejai kaan n keejai ||20|| give Me your head, and do not pay any attention to public opinion. ||20|| What do you reckon?

Nah, you're way off. He took his first birth while Sant Isher Singh Ji was alive. Gurdeep Singh may have passed away from what i've heard. (BTW, he could recall his past when very young, and had a mark on his sareer that Suleman said would be proof that it was him.) It's not worth dwelling on. Sant ji only let him speak to sangat so we could learn lessons from what he said. The main thing was to use this life wisely - our time is limited and shouldn't be wasted. Jeevan Mukti can be attained by anyone by following Maharaj Ji's teachings and with their kirpa. Time spent arguing with fools over meat and other divisive issues can be used for simran.