Reincarnation of past notable individuals

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Hi All,

I just have a thought about reincarnation within the Sikhism, does anyone know of any saints, sages, great teachers or guru`s that have been significant or insignificant figures in influencing our culture or religios teachings. I can`t think of any my self and with the limited literature about our religion and its teachings from credible authors. 

Also if anyone can think of any from Hinduism from the past 500 years, that were actual unquestionable reincarnartions not someones opinion for example there are some noteable authors that state Lord Buddha to be a reincarnation of Vishnu, which I thinkk is absurd.

Can anyone that comments please ensure you don`t use complex language or terms that are uncommon, although I am from tghe Uk my english is terrible and i would avoid asking for explanations.

Many thanks for all that reply and waheguru ki fateh waheguru ka khalsa.

Jitsingh

 

[sarabatam]

Sant Baba Karam Singh Ji Hoti Mardanwale was incarnation saint- Sant Isher Singh Ji Rara sahib wale, also Sant isher singh ji rara sahib wale was also raja janak in their previous incarnations.

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Hi Sarabatam, How do you know of this can direct me to any credible authors that can confirm this or is this something that known only to the local villages of these individuals. Also how was it confirmed they are the reincarnations?

I have anotated the essay of saint Sant Baba Ishar Singh (Rara Sahib) here and it states nothing about him being a reincarnation - https://www.sikhnet.com/gurbani/artist/sant-baba-ishar-singh-rara-sahib

Can anyne else that does comment provide some credible documentation from books or essays that that I can further read or explain how you come to know of this?

Thanks all. waheguru ki fateh waheguru ka khalsa.

[sarabatam]

Just oral tradition, thats why rara sahib is known as karamsar. If that wasn't the case it will be dedicated to Sant isher singh ji rara sahib teacher- sant attar singh ji reru sahib. But there is a reason it was known as karamsar.

[Soulfinder]

5 hours ago, sarabatam said:

Just oral tradition, thats why rara sahib is known as karamsar. If that wasn't the case it will be dedicated to Sant isher singh ji rara sahib teacher- sant attar singh ji reru sahib. But there is a reason it was known as karamsar.

Veer ji dass had bachan a few years ago with the recenty deceased Sant Partap Singh Ji Ilford uk wale rara sahib about the name of the gurdwara sahib. 

 

Their bachan was that "The Gurdwara Sahib both in Ilford and Rara Sahib Punjab is named after Baba Karam Singh Ji Hoti Mardan Wale". 

 

So you are correct veer ji as Sant Attar Singh Ji got there brahm vidya from Baba Karam Singh Ji Hoti Mardan.

[mahanpaapi]

To add, Baba Nand Singh Ji in one of his past life was in the lineage of Sheikh Baba Farid Ji's Sampardya, and in another one He was King of Lucknow. Both facts Baba Ji Himself stated, and are mentioned in His biography. Here is one photo showing that:

[sarabatam]

Look everything is possible including in vahiguru khed. When I was working many years ago I had a Buddhist friend who said lamas incarnation are picked early on by kali chakra or something like that. They have lineages. 1,2,3 lamas. Our Sikh panth has many bhramgyanis as opposed to other panths. As word of Sant Jagjit Singh Harkhowale, khalsa is Raj Rishiya da panth.

[sarabatam]

4 hours ago, mahanpaapi said:

To add, Baba Nand Singh Ji in one of his past life was in the lineage of Sheikh Baba Farid Ji's Sampardya, and in another one He was King of Lucknow. Both facts Baba Ji Himself stated, and are mentioned in His biography. Here is one photo showing that:

If it's in Anand chamtkar I have it ..do you have page number by any chance?

[mahanpaapi]

7 hours ago, sarabatam said:

If it's in Anand chamtkar I have it ..do you have page number by any chance?

I think it is in Anand Darshan! sorry, no I don't have the page number but I have read it long time back.

[Sikhilove]

On 1/16/2021 at 4:14 PM, Jitsingh Gojra said:

Hi All,

I just have a thought about reincarnation within the Sikhism, does anyone know of any saints, sages, great teachers or guru`s that have been significant or insignificant figures in influencing our culture or religios teachings. I can`t think of any my self and with the limited literature about our religion and its teachings from credible authors. 

Also if anyone can think of any from Hinduism from the past 500 years, that were actual unquestionable reincarnartions not someones opinion for example there are some noteable authors that state Lord Buddha to be a reincarnation of Vishnu, which I thinkk is absurd.

Can anyone that comments please ensure you don`t use complex language or terms that are uncommon, although I am from tghe Uk my english is terrible and i would avoid asking for explanations.

Many thanks for all that reply and waheguru ki fateh waheguru ka khalsa.

Jitsingh

 

Guru Gobind Ji wrote of the incarnations of Vishnu Ji in Sri Dasam Granth Ji. There are many Devi’s and devte who were/ have reincarnated.Some incarnations also go astray and some come back onto the path in their current janam. It depends on the incarnation.

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Thanks for the info, but I am still not convinced of any of the above indviduals being reincarnations, doesn`t all this get recorded especialy for noteable individuals within the sikh religion, would`nt it enrich our culture to have such records etc just like the buddhists do rather than what appears to be just knowledge within certain sikh communities  and even this is questionable, just look at the replies above.

Secondly how do you know this person is not trying to steel the idently of a past noteable figure certainly there is motivational incentives to steel someone elses ID if they were of value.

Keep the posts simple please if you reply.

Jitsingh

[sarabatam]

I think the reason behind not writing any records of those who are incarnated again that its in our sikh panth - our central theme is - Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji, so sikh saints are quite humble in that way, they don't publicly announce these esoteric / adhyatmic bachans to all. Buddhism on other hand has no central theme. 

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Hi Sarabatam, of course buddhism has a central theme the path to lieration of suffering or nirvana! How are you not being humble by showing in some convincing way that you are a reincarnation of a past teacher/guru to reinforce the teachings of the granth sahib. That is exactly what the buddhists reicarnated teachers have done on so many occasions.

not to be offensive to anyone here, but with the vast amount of individuals posting here, are showing they have a high level of competence in the these deeply penetrating teachings. But all the replies so have been just so vague and insubstantial to verify of even a single one person who has reicarnated to teach the meaning of the granth, convinces me even further to learn the true meaning of the teachings must be questionable and if you are left with questions and confusion wjhat value is there persuing to undertsand such teach teachings. 

I am not sayin that the teachers here are incompetant but for a religion that has like Hinduism, Buddhism reincarnation as one of its central pillars, there has not been one commonly known reincarnation, if that is the case what tyoe furture is sikhism heading towards for our children??? It is very worrying!!!

Again stickying to the central question of reincarnation, can anyone who replies provide some valued information supporting it. 

Thanks all, Jitsingh

waheguru ka khalsa waheguru ki fateh .

 

[sarabatam]

Perhaps lucky Singh can help or chatanga who is proficient in historical granths.

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Can anyone make any valued comments or show support in my question?

[mahanpaapi]

2 hours ago, Jitsingh Gojra said:

Can anyone make any valued comments or show support in my question?

for such issues like reincarnation, you may not find "documentary evidence." In divine realm, one has to believe the word of the Guru or Mahapurakh. In fact, Divine beings won't leave such evidence to see if a seeker believes Their word or evidence. It is not a physical rather metaphysical process. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj made sure that Sikhi is eternal until the end of Kalyug and thereafter. 

For me personally what other evidence I need to prove to myself that reincarnation exist after looking at the following:

[Jitsingh Gojra]

Again this is a absolute wrong and strongly disagree,, firstly if think of the what the tibetan buddhist have done with their recognition of a reincarnated guru, there are are many physical tests done in front of many followers and even non-followers of buddhism to verify the child is a incarnation and in some cases the child shows very competences siddhis and such psychic techniques naturally. through intuition. 

The point about you stating that Guru Nakak had ensured that the sikhi path that he taught and was recorded in the granth sahib would be sufficient to sustain the whole duration of the Kaliyug, goes fundamentally against the nature and las of change. 

Can you please explain what is written in the above picture, a mentioned please keep the english simple as this would save the need for explanations. 

Finally are there any historians on this platform or does anyone know of any historians sunch as J.S. Grewal, Sodhi Teja Singh and many others  that written extensively on the sikh history both on how the religion has developed over the past plus 500 years and also on the influential gurus, teachers, saints and solders - https://sikhbookclub.com/ 

 Again please keep it simple in any reply.

Thanks all, Jitsingh

waheguru ka khalsa waheguru ki fateh .

[mahanpaapi]

11 hours ago, Jitsingh Gojra said:

Again this is a absolute wrong and strongly disagree,, firstly if think of the what the tibetan buddhist have done with their recognition of a reincarnated guru, there are are many physical tests done in front of many followers and even non-followers of buddhism to verify the child is a incarnation and in some cases the child shows very competences siddhis and such psychic techniques naturally. through intuition. 

The point about you stating that Guru Nakak had ensured that the sikhi path that he taught and was recorded in the granth sahib would be sufficient to sustain the whole duration of the Kaliyug, goes fundamentally against the nature and las of change. 

Can you please explain what is written in the above picture, a mentioned please keep the english simple as this would save the need for explanations. 

Finally are there any historians on this platform or does anyone know of any historians sunch as J.S. Grewal, Sodhi Teja Singh and many others  that written extensively on the sikh history both on how the religion has developed over the past plus 500 years and also on the influential gurus, teachers, saints and solders - https://sikhbookclub.com/ 

 Again please keep it simple in any reply.

Thanks all, Jitsingh

waheguru ka khalsa waheguru ki fateh .

Note under the left side photo: Baba Nand Singh Ji was born in 1870 in Sherpur village. He undertook seva at Sri Hazur Sahib and Sri Amritsar Sahib, and established home of Bhagati at Nanaksar Kaleran and in 1943 left His body at Nanaksar Kaleran.  

Note under the right side photo: Baba Nand Singh in His past life - Nawab Shahadat Khan who ruled Lucknow 1722 Toi 1739, about which Baba Nand Singh Ji Himself foretold His close sangat members. About this full sakhi read in book Anand Darshan.

[sevak]

On 1/16/2021 at 11:04 PM, sarabatam said:

If it's in Anand chamtkar I have it ..do you have page number by any chance?

I heard Baba Nand Singh Sahib, was Brother Bharat of Shri Ram Chander. 

[sevak]

Do you feel that Dhruv, Prahlad, Ramayan / Mahabharat these are actually part of Sikhi History or in other words Sikhi is actually Real Pure Hinduism. Whenever I learn about these things I always feel that indeed Sikhi is the Pure Hinduism, but I am afraid to say this as some Sikhs get offended. 

In Sikhi all the devi / devtas are mentioned and their roles too. Also Sikhs are following the tradition of rishis, munis by keep unshorn hair and tie in knot in jura which is Satjug parampara. 

[ragnarok]

Sants' job is to join Sikhs to Guru Granth Sahib, not to come up with their own lineages. There is no tradition on Sikhi to choose a leader based on reincarnation or rebirth and the custom of going to an astrologer to trace your past life, future fortune etc is considered a waste of time and a maya trap. Guru Sahib repeats again and again that our job in this life is to Jap Naam and not be concerned about the past or future.

You denigrate oral tradition. Oral tradition is part of our culture, not everything is written. Part of the issue here is that you want something that you consider to be evidence based on a different culture. You're projecting British ideas on to Sikh culture.

If you want documentary evidence of reincarnation in general then refer to this long standing project at Vriginia Tech that documents statistically siginificant instances of reincarnation, i.e. cases that are mathematically impossible to have been faked. Children Who Report Memories of Previous Lives | Division of Perceptual Studies (virginia.edu)

From a Sikh perspective there is the Suleman tape documenting his journey from one human birth, to a non human birth and back to a human birth. The child that was born could remember his previous incarnation similar to the VT link above.

 

 

You claim not to understand English well and cannot read punjabi either. What is your background?

[SunnySingh]

4 hours ago, ragnarok said:

Sants' job is to join Sikhs to Guru Granth Sahib, not to come up with their own lineages. There is no tradition on Sikhi to choose a leader based on reincarnation or rebirth and the custom of going to an astrologer to trace your past life, future fortune etc is considered a waste of time and a maya trap. Guru Sahib repeats again and again that our job in this life is to Jap Naam and not be concerned about the past or future.

You denigrate oral tradition. Oral tradition is part of our culture, not everything is written. Part of the issue here is that you want something that you consider to be evidence based on a different culture. You're projecting British ideas on to Sikh culture.

 

Well said Ragnarok Jee,

I do not know, but why are people after such non-sense?

Why people are so much interested in such things even?

The only conclusion I get is that people are not interested what sikhee really is, though all profess proudly to be sikhs, thus they have failed to understand sikhee, so much pollution, twistings, manmukhta have been added and unfortunately distorted what sikhee is all about and thus so much speculation.

First of all, the aim of sikhee is is to reunite us with Him without any distinction, for once and forever.

If all these jeevas named above and even those which people have in mind and are not included in this thread .... just let us ask ourselves, if supposing they had done true bhakti of waheguru and become one with Him, how can ever anyone say such things as sen in this thread, so and so incarnations of so and so personalities?

Secondly, if they have been wandering since their past births, then too, why give so much importance to them, for not being able to do the correct bhakti as per Gurbani to reunite their souls with Him?

Do  not get me wrong, I have due respect for all beings, be it whosoever. But, from there to say, this or that personality is the reincarnation of such past jeevas... it does not make much sense.

For as said, if they have not been able to become one with Him, what help can they give us? None at all, for they have not done bhakti as per the teachings of Guru Jee.

For us as sikhs, only the teachings of Guru Sahiban are to be taken into consideration, and that too to be practiced in our daily lives, for the purpose of our union with Him.

Waheguru and Guru Jee are important worth of our devotion, and all those who follow their teachings faithfully, just as mahapurukhs, sant jan, rest all are to be discarded,  if their lifestyle and behaviour is not based on Gurbani.

Do not get me wrong, I say discarded, not disrespected or abused.

That is all.

 

[Arsh1469]

In Guur Gobind Singh Ji's own bani he says that

Bhai Daya Singh is a avtar of Luv

Bhai Dharam Singh of Bhagat Dhanna

Bhit Himmit Singh  Unknown

Bhai Mokham Singh Bhagat Namdev

Bhai Sahib Singh Bhagat Sain

[Sikhilove]

On 1/18/2021 at 5:27 PM, Jitsingh Gojra said:

Hi Sarabatam, of course buddhism has a central theme the path to lieration of suffering or nirvana! How are you not being humble by showing in some convincing way that you are a reincarnation of a past teacher/guru to reinforce the teachings of the granth sahib. That is exactly what the buddhists reicarnated teachers have done on so many occasions.

not to be offensive to anyone here, but with the vast amount of individuals posting here, are showing they have a high level of competence in the these deeply penetrating teachings. But all the replies so have been just so vague and insubstantial to verify of even a single one person who has reicarnated to teach the meaning of the granth, convinces me even further to learn the true meaning of the teachings must be questionable and if you are left with questions and confusion wjhat value is there persuing to undertsand such teach teachings. 

I am not sayin that the teachers here are incompetant but for a religion that has like Hinduism, Buddhism reincarnation as one of its central pillars, there has not been one commonly known reincarnation, if that is the case what tyoe furture is sikhism heading towards for our children??? It is very worrying!!!

Again stickying to the central question of reincarnation, can anyone who replies provide some valued information supporting it. 

Thanks all, Jitsingh

waheguru ka khalsa waheguru ki fateh .

 

Guru Granth Sahib Ji is all that’s needed, it’s all in there and we keep moving on the path with naam simran, practicing Truth in real life. We’re not supposed to worship saints, were supposed to apply gurbani, which has given us the first step in applying Truth and walk the rest of the path alone with God. If you come across a sant then fine, if not, there’s always gurbani. People likely won’t always name names on here because a lot of the time, real saints are demonized, to the extent that some are physically hurt, sometimes even by full amritdharis no less. The Gurus and the sants they associated with are the perfect examples of this. People tend to fear what they dont understand. With hukam, you’ll meet one if it’s gods will. 

[SunnySingh]

On 1/26/2021 at 3:31 AM, Arsh1469 said:

In Guur Gobind Singh Ji's own bani he says that

Bhai Daya Singh is a avtar of Luv

Bhai Dharam Singh of Bhagat Dhanna

Bhit Himmit Singh  Unknown

Bhai Mokham Singh Bhagat Namdev

Bhai Sahib Singh Bhagat Sain

If Guru Gobind Singh said what you say, that is fine, because He is th form of Waheguru Akal Purukh at our level, which means He is omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent.  

Whatever He says is the Truth.

But let us ask ourselves? Even if all the names of those jeevas mentioned by you in your post above is a reality, what is so great about it? 

We must bear in mind, merging and becoming one with Waheguru is not like going to a holiday resort or to a foreign land for sometime and coming back.

For any soul who reaches Waheguru´s level and merges in Him, has for sure lost his petty identity and become one with Him without any distinction.

And if these jeevas mentioned by you,  they came back,  that means they were not one with Him, they were somewhere settling their karmas ... thus they came back once again as human biengs to perfect their bhakti and if it is His mauj, then go and become one with Him, that is it.

We too, each one of us, have been born countless times, in countless lives and species, so then?  

Our only goal to be paid attention to, should be the goal taught in the Gurbani, which is Guru Jee or Satnam, that is it, for only with Him can we ever get out from maya and brahm..

Who comes, who goes, where does that jeeva go .... are all distractions.

Life is too short, we should focus on ourselves, whether we are fulfilling our purpose of doing the right job/bhakti to get out of the endless cycle of 84, for once and ever and merge in  Him, with His grace, that is it.