vegetarian/ non-vegetarian

[bimel]

Meat constructed from soy beans or tofu were created for vegetarians around the world so that they wont "miss out" on the pleasures of eating meat. Even when he /she is taking in the morsels of a vegetized meat psychologically they believe "..if it was turkey, it would taste just like or almost like this.."

So the point is ...why be a vegetarian and eat "vegetarian meat"..coz whether it be metaphorical or not..you're still eating meat.

p/s : No harm intended on anyone..this is merely an observation.

[vinegar]

because no animal was killed in its production, and no you're not eating meat, you're eating soya, which is not rajas food.

[Dynamic_Banda]

because soya cant be halal

[bimel]

i do get the whole halal, non-halal thing...i really do, both my parents are amrit-thari's...but...

the same way as we are told :

" thinking of misdeeds is the same as doing them."

take sex for example, the story has been told numerous times, and everytime the moral of te story is the same:- we are to hinder away from sexual thoughts or sexual acts as both are considered under the same category thus considered sinful.

isn't eating (soybean)meat (thinking at the back of our minds" this vegetized chicken curry tastes just as chicken curry should", this is how we explain to other non vegetarians who have never tried vegetized meat...don't we?) the same as eating meat?...the logic is the same..

its not the litteral idea of forking in vegetized meat or not coz its non-halal, its the whole methophoric idea that follows..

another thing i want to stress is that this topic is not to question if we are to be vegetarians or not, as even SGGS leaves it as an open question for us to ponder on, this is just an observation...

as always....no pun intended on anyone..

[vinegar]

i would say no, because the logic behind vegetarianism in Sikhi has nothing to do with taste, but with the composition of meat - it is composed of all 5 elements and puts greater weight on oneself, which makes bhagti harder.

Its like non alcoholic wine - we dont abstain from alcohol because of the taste but because of the effect, non alcoholic wine is basically fruit juice, you can't say that its the same to drink as alcoholic wine.

[Dynamic_Banda]

Its all about your intentions.. if your reason for eating meat or meat substitute stems from one of the 5 kaam krodh lobh moh or hankar.. then i guess its bad..

Then again if you eat vegi stuff for those reasons thats bad too.. guess its about why you eat not what you eat. !

Like some sarblohi people who do it as show.. or to act bigger then others etc

[DHANBABANANAK]

A fakir/mahapursh who all ways is meditating and is very high in his spirtual path. Told me that people who eat meat... those spirts then make the human who ate the flesh ill and doctors cant find what is wrong.

[Niranjana]

wow Dhan Baba Nanak - that is revelationary news...I guess the whole meat eating world is ill and the vegetarians are the fit elite...

[Dynamic_Banda]

well baba santa singh is fat !

Dhan teri sikhi

[vijaydeep Singh]

Gurfateh

Das feels weak when does not eat meat.Anyway to digest meat one has to do good hard work else it may cause good lost of complcations.Yes if someone uses good lots of barin then also meat is good food.

But always good to have great physical work to digest meat and oily or proteen rich vegitalbes also.

Das's muscle tear dowen and meat repairs them due to das's doing martial Arts.In Shaster Vidya when actuly Sri Sahib cut hand,meat heals the wound faster.

Had Misldar not meat eateres then scitifically it was not possible for them to recover from wounds of small or great holcauste(Ghalughara) so soon inspite of great wounds.So it is medicine.

[wahegurubol]

vijaydeep singh ji, Baba Deep Singh ji fought with his head on his left hand and sword in the right with the kirpa of Guru jee , not with the kirpa of MEAT.

well said DHANBABANANAK !

as for soybean and tofu.. i usually eat those soyburgers and meatless sausages to tell you the truth... I dont find them anything tasting close to meat.. infact a soyburger feels all like beans and grains.. and it feels healthy.

[Maha Kharag Singh]

First of all the body is tied to this mortal relm, once life ends aatma goes forth before Mahakaal for judgement, therefore this nullifies any concept that the ruh of that animal can cause hindrance to the person consuming it. Another thing, anyone who has atoot bishwas in Mahakaal can never ever be harmed by such things.

This dharti is Karamkhand, where life and death is decided by vidhata. So wahegurubol, you can shuv your narrow minded views where the sun doesnt shine.

[Xylitol]

Actually, Baba Jagjeet Siingh ji Harkhowal waley also told a man in sangat that he had parkinsons b/c of all the chickens that he used to eat. According to baba ji, meat eating leads to numerous diseases such as parkinsons and arthritus. the man said that the doctors had advised him to eat eggs to provide the body with nutrients that are required and will help deal with the parkinsons, baba ji said no, don't eat any more meat. this is your karma, now just let the karm work itself out.

btw, 10th Guru issued a Hukum to sangat to abstain from meat.

http://www.info-sikh.com/PageM1.html

[wahegurubol]

This dharti is Karamkhand, where life and death is decided by vidhata. So wahegurubol, you can shuv your narrow minded views where the sun doesnt shine.

I can clearly say from your behavior of how much of an effect meat is having on you. So was your goat dish really delicous ?

[shaheediyan]

Without getting involved in the meat debate, just a bit of advice for lethargic vegi's, the reason many feel weak after leaving a meat diet is lack of iron.

Meat/blood has a high iron level which keeps people energetic.

Those that switch to a veg diet should do some research and ensure that they eat a good quantity of iron rich foods i.e. spinach (not killed as in saag but fresh), raw beetroot, broccoli.greens etc.

For a really good daily boost, Floradix is a 100% guaranteed way to boost your iron count.

Cheers.

[wahegurubol]

Veer ji, I have left meat several years ago... even when I use to eat meat, my body was never able to digest it, my mind use to become heavy and i use to get very uncomfortable. As a child my family was non-veg but was never happy after eating the meat.

In anycase, those who says veggies are wrong and go for pro-meat diet... they must first look at the Langar served in the Gurudwara which is PURE VEGETARIAN and this fact is a big slap on pro-meat supporters !

[Maha Kharag Singh]

the reason guru ka langar is vegetarian is because Hindus are strictly vegetarians and Muslims do not eat meat which is not halal, therefore the compromise is Vegetarian Langar because Muslims and Hindus would both happily eat it. So theres your slap back.

[vinegar]

based on what

[wahegurubol]

the reason guru ka langar is vegetarian is because Hindus are strictly vegetarians and Muslims do not eat meat which is not halal, therefore the compromise is Vegetarian Langar because Muslims and Hindus would both happily eat it. So theres your slap back.

No ! you are wrong. i dont know from where you got that thinking coming, but thats not true. Many maas-eaters like you also come up with the execuse that guru ka langar is veg cos meat is expensive.

Now here are some quotes which specifically compares meat with negative thinking and acts.

Avarice is a dog, falsehood the sweeper and cheating the eating of meat.

(Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Sri Raag ang.15)

Falsehood is my dagger and to eat by defrauding is meat.

(Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Sri Raaj ang.24)

There is a story of Guru Gobind Singh Ji who sent out his falcon to hunt an animal, once caught Guru Ji watched as the baaj tore into the animals flesh. Asked by one of his Sikhs what was the reasoning behind this Guru Ji stated that in a previous life the animal had borrowed some money from the baaj and swore on Akal Purkhs name that he would pay it back, he never did, now it was pay back time. There are many instances like this which illustrate that the Gurus were not hunting for meat but to save these souls from the continuous cycle of birth and death. In two Hukamnamas of Sri Guru Har Gobind Sahib Ji there are clear cut instructions prohibiting the eating of meat, fish etc.

When Guru Nanak in his sixth form prohibits Sikhs from eating flesh in such a strong language, how can he, in his tenth form, issue instructions absolutely contrary to and in negation of his own earlier instructions?

H.S Singha in his Mini Encyclopedia of Sikhism.

'Guru Amar Das Ji ate only rice and lentils but this abstention cannot be regarded as evidence of vegetarianism, only of simple living.'

Mohsin Fani (1615-70), the well known historian and a contemporary of Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib, rites in his work DABISTAN-E-MAZAHIB as follows:

"Having prohibited his disciples to drink wine and eat pork, he (Nanak) himself abstained from eating flesh and ordered not to hurt any living being. After him this precept was neglected by his followers; but Arjun Mal, one of the substitutes of his Faith, renewed the prohibition to eat flesh and said: This has not been approved by Nanak."

ahib Sri Guru Gobind Singh ji's "UPDESH" to Bhai Daya Singh ji which is mentioned in "SUDHARAM MARAG GRANTH" :

"One who does not Steal, Commit adultery , Slander anyone , Gamble , Eat meat or drink wine will be liberated in this very life (i.e. Jeewan Mukt)".P

Lastly, NO ANIMAL WANTS TO DIE, DO YOU THINK THE GOAT OR THE HEN YOU ARE KILLING IS HAPPY TO BE JHATKA-FIED BY YOU ! OR IS IT SAD AND IN FEAR? JUST TELL ME THAT !!! IF SOMEONE WANTED TO CUT YOUR THROAT AND EAT YOU, WOULD YOU BE HAPPY?????

IF NOT, THEN HOW CAN YOU EAT MEAT ?? U WILL PAY FOR IT !

[Matheen]

W-bol, why are you bothered what anyone else does?

Maharaj Ji also says not to argue over meat.

[Maha Kharag Singh]

kutha maas or halal meat is prohibited. wbol ur just an idiot who is absolutley deluded and ehankaar, becuase you think that your auda is that of Mahalaal where you think that you can condemn me, face it u arrogant piece of crap your budhi is bhrasht

[wahegurubol]

W-bol, why are you bothered what anyone else does?

Maharaj Ji also says not to argue over meat.

Matheen Ji,

The only hymn in the whole of Sri Guru Granth Sahib that is specifically cited in support of eating meat is the hymn of Sahib Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in the Var of Raag Malhar on pages 1289-90 beginning with the couplet:

Maas Maas Kar Moorakh Jhaghrrey.

Gian dhian Nahin Jaaney.

Kaun Maas Kaun Saag Kahaavey

Kis Mah Paap Samaaney. (pg. 1289-1290)

Only the fool quarrels over the question of eating or not eating of the meat.

He does not have the True Wisdom. Without True Wisdom or Meditation, he harps on

which is flesh and which is not flesh and which food is sinful and which is not.

The gist of this shabad is a condemnation of the pakhand Pandits do when they run away from even the sight of meat and can't even fathom touching it. It says that without Satguru, there is no knowledge.

Nowhere in this shabad is there any indication that we should eat meat. Just that we shouldn't hate it because WE are made of meat and we shouldn't think that by giving it up we are spiritual. There is no indication in this shabad that says "meat eating is ok". In fact this shabad indicates to us that we are meat and we should recognize that just as the thought of eating a dead body is revolting, the thought of eating meat should be as well. Because that’s precisely what it is: a dead body, and the same stuff our body is made of.

Here's the ultimate question: If there was an animal even higher in the food chain than us, would you appreciate it eating your Mother, Dad, brother or sister? No, didn't really think so. So what makes us think that animals do?[/size=24]

[/size=24]A final thought, the Sants and Mahapursh of the present day all warn us of the evils of eating meat. They all urge us to take Paol/Amrit and to give up maas, alcohol and tobacco. Not one Sant has ever said otherwise.

Do we eat to live, or do we live to eat ? [/size=24]

[wahegurubol]

kutha maas or halal meat is prohibited. wbol ur just an idiot who is absolutley deluded and ehankaar, becuase you think that your auda is that of Mahalaal where you think that you can condemn me, face it u arrogant piece of crap your budhi is bhrasht

The reason you call me ehankaari is cos you are filled with ehankaar therefore you see all veggies all ehankaari and you alone yourself right eating meat !!

you say "budhi is bhrasht" ... i think you are the one who thinks that you have auda of Mahalaal using that type of words !

So was your meat delicious ??? mouth-watering ! LOL hahahahahaha.

[Niranjana]

This whole thing is a non-issue, yet Sikhs love to keep beating it on the head again and again.

Site Admin - please lock down these meat-discussions, I recall SAdmin doing just that a few years back on an extensive thread concerning this topic, anyone wanting to explore it further can look it up on those threads and links provided therein.

The Sikh Rehit maryada is very clear on this topic - the only restriction is on Halal Meat. We can argue semantics about what is Halal and what isn't, what is Kutha and what isn't, but that's why you have a choice, if you don't want to eat it, fine don't, if your latest Baba requires you to be a veggie or a vegan, then fine, these are your choices.

Let's close this ridiculous topic.

[wahegurubol]

- the only restriction is on Halal Meat.

Let's close this ridiculous topic.

That is only SGPC maryada, Damdami Taksal, AKJ, Nanaksars .. all say that meat eating is KURAHIT !

More than that all the sants mahapursh, Sant Ishar Singh, Sant Attar Singh JI, Baba Nand Singh Sahib, Sant Jarnail Singh, asked sikhs not to eat meat and avoided eating themselves... so how can you say that it is a non-issue, when Guru HarGobind Ji in his Hukamnama clearly prohibits sikhs from eating meat..how can you say its non-issue !

Well those who want to eat .. eat it... Guru ji will not come and force you, but you will surely bear the negative consequences and karma from meat eating.