Since you all were wondering...

[CdnSikhGirl]

This is not intended to spark another debate that we will only disagree on forever anyway... 

1. I got married... to the best Singh on the planet, who fully supports equality of everyone.  

2. I took Amrit. 

3. Though Panj Pyaras were five males that day, the Gurdwara where I took it, has had a woman do this seva before.  Further to this, the five addressed the women who took Amrit that day.  They said there is absolutely NO limitations placed on women in Sikhi.  They directly stated "Women who attain this level can just as easily be in the same place we are"  Even better, they then made a direct challenge to the women present with this statement "We want to see at least some of you Singhnis who are here today, be in the same place we are and do seva as Panj Pyaras someday!"  As if my day was not already awesome, THAT WAS ICING ON THE CAKE THAT MADE IT SPECTACULAR!

4. They also clarified some things:  You do NOT have to be vegetarian. It's your choice if you are (I am) but if you choose to eat meat, it can not be killed the Muslim way.  They also stated that piercings are not allowed because of the association to slavery in the past, however all other jewelry is perfectly fine. Makeup is also not prohibited.  Understanding this, I still don't wear makeup vast majority of the time anyway as I think it looks fake... except once in awhile if I have a blemish I will cover it up with some makeup.    

5.  During our Anand Karaj, we did a few things that challenged the status quo... I only had one friend and her husband present as my family could not make it.  My friend (a female) handed the palla.. A few Singhs went to object and tried to get her husband to do it, but my husband stopped them and said he wanted my friend to do it.  So thats how it happend! This was my husbands idea btw.  Though I did follow in the lavans... I would not have known enough to guage anyway when to stop as there is no screen there with translations.  For me the lavans themselves are not one leading and one following... they are both moving as one unit around Guru Ji.  It's a circle... and a circle anyway has no beginning or end, so there is no front or back.  if he moved further around who would he find in front of him?? And besides, I had more control over his movements, than he did of mine, since I controlled the slack in the palla and could make him move slower or faster based on how much slack I let get in it.  So when Singhs spout that lavans having the male in front is to denote the male's authority that she is supposed to be subject to... I laugh.  I had control over his movements, he didn't have control over mine lol.  To me it's more like a horse and chariot rider... where the male is the horse, pulling the chariot rider to the destination, but the chariot rider is the one who was in control LOL.  (I know some of you will be upset at my analogy, and try to turn it back into male 'leading' female 'following' in order to prove some point of husbands having authority or higher status over their wives but I really don't care.) 

6. My husband suggested I should stop coming here... as certain mindsets will never change and it's so not worth it to stress over opinions of others.  

 

 

 

 

 

[Harjots8963]

Wait so just making sure how did you do lavans? lol
Side by side?

I'm curious...

[Harjots8963]

Also can you elaborate on the meat?

Did they say that non - muslim way eat all the meat you want? Or did they say it should be Jhatka.

Also if you don't mind?

Elaborate on the makeup? Did they like give you a maryada to refer to?


Thanks.
 

[Guest]

Ack...I can't log back in again... 

He led in lavans... I was just saying that because he starts doesn't mean he has any sort of authority or control over me ( metaphorically or otherwise) as some Singhs use this to say that makes have higher status than females. Rubbish... It's a circle. Side by side puts one person further away from SGGSJ so then the closer one is higher status?

Meat they said its your choice but if you do eat meat it can not be ritualistically sacrificed and killed as Muslims do (and I guess Kosher too for same reason).

Makeup and jewelry they explained that piercings are prohibited because of link to slavery in history but they specificat said all other jewelry is fine to wear.  And makeup they said is not prohibited.  

They only referred to Sikh Rehet Maryada.  And this is at a historical Gurdwara.  

Interestingly they also said its prohibited to follow ANY sects (when they were mentioning sects which have been excommunicated like nirankaris etc). They said follow SRM and SGGSJ only.  So there... I am BOUND following SRM and no other RM as that's what Panj Pyaras specifically stated when I took Amrit!!! 

 

 

[Koi]

Many many thousands of millions of billions of congratulations to you and your husband! !!!!! 

Can honestly say I was anxiously waiting for this news.

Well done, and all the best for the future. 

Guru Kirpa Kare...

[CdnSikhGirl]

Harjot S. No we did lavans normally because side by side one is further from SGGSJ instead of both being same distance.  And it's more about Guru Ji than us.  I just get upset when some Singhs use the fact with male starting and female behind him to justify saying that men have control or authority or higher status than women and that's rubbish.  I actually had more control over his movement in the lavans than he had of mine since I was the only one who could alter the tension on the palla. If I wanted him to slow down I just let it get tighter if I wanted him to sped up I let it be looser.  And anyway it's supposed to be moving as one.  I don't really think there is any symbolism of man being in charge of anything. I think that's just how some Singhs interpret it. In our marriage we are definitely equals. He does not consider me to be any status less than him or think he deserves more respect than I do.  I told u guys before he actually fights for equal rights for women at darbar sahib. 

 

As for meat they said its your choice but if you do eat meat then it can't be ritualistically killed and bleed to death like Muslims do as it's cruel and makes no sense to sacrifice an animal to God which also has the same divine light present as in us.  Kosher would also be prohibited based on the same.  For jewelry only piercing is prohibited and they specified all other jewelry is allowed. 

 

Maryada is Sikh Rehet Maryada and they specifically stated this is only one accepted by Akal Takht. Further they said NOT to associate with dheras Jathas or sects. They specifically mentioned those like nirankaris etc but the message was clear to follow ONLY SRM and SGGSJ. 

By the way this was at a historical Gurdwara (same one for both anand karaj and Amrit). Gurdwara Chatti Patshahi in Srinagar Kashmir. 

And it was awesome that they specifically addressed the women who took Amrit that day one week ago exactly it was last Sunday) the Panj Pyaras actually told the women that they want to see at least some of them serve as Panj Pyaras in future and reach that level of dedication.  And they specifically stated there is no restriction on women that is not also on men. As both are given equal rights in Sikhi.  So they specifically stated women can do every seva including Acting as Panj Pyaras in Amrit sanchars!! And this was from the five who were Panj Pyaras last Sunday!!!!

Edited September 20, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[amardeep]

Congratulations with the wedding, may the Guru grant you both eternal happines

[Singh123456777]

Congrats!

[Singh123456777]

PS: I'm pissed I never got no cake. 

[CdnSikhGirl]

We didn't have cake actually....

Reception was at Nageen Club right on the lake in Srinagar (Nageen Lake is attached to Dal Lake) and we had 9 varieties of veg dishes including a few local ones from kashmir like Nadru Yakhni (lotus stems) and Brinjol (they are small eggplants) and also about 6 non veg dishes for the meat eaters present on a separate table.  Also a salad table, and a staion set up for jalabies (not sure if I spelled it right) and icecream.  And dessert was actually pineapple pastry.  Also kashmiri khava (hot drink made with saffron and crushed almond).  There were over 250 people present and we had fireworks :) My hubby planned all this since I was in Canada... and he made it a memorable night! 

At the Anand Karaj, we only had about 50 people present as he didn't want it to be too much stress / pressure especially on me.  

Here is a pic... we didn't exactly match... But I wanted blue. I normally don't wear much jewelry but the necklace was from his Mother (I have never had so much real gold on me at one time, I was nervous wearing it as it's 22k solid gold. I guess it's a normal tradition for MIL to give the DIL bridal set gold jewelry - but new to me as I was not expecting it! She gave me also 4 gold bangles and the ring which covers half my finger that match the necklace but no earrings because they know I don't wear them and they are all amritdhari and piercing prohibited).  But I normally would not wear such a large necklace... now I will take it out only on very special occasions. 

By the way it's almost impossible to do anand karaj where we did :) Since it's a historical gurdwara there.. but he has connections!

 

Edited September 20, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[Singh123456777]

Congrats again!

 

PS:Still never got no ice cream.

[Ragmaala]

Congratulations! All the Best in your journey ahead!

[Sat1176]

Many congratulations to you both.  May you both have great future together full of happiness and gursikhi jeevan. 

[amardeep]

Is your husband a Kashmiri Singh since it took place in Kashmir?

[CdnSikhGirl]

Is your husband a Kashmiri Singh since it took place in Kashmir?

Yes he is, born and raised... his family are mostly in Baramulla, and Srinagar with some in Jammu too.  And that makes me fortunate because as I have been told, it's nearly every Indian's dream to visit Kashmir, and now I get to call it my second home!  I love it there as it's so beautiful and not too hot (but it was still hot the last week or so.. and humid.  Though it was here in Halifax too and nearly same temperature so I can't win LOL but in the mountains like in Pahalgam and Sonamarg it's much nicer temps!) 

 

[kdsingh80]

congrats

 

Your singh is really tall

[CdnSikhGirl]

congrats

 

Your singh is really tall

No... I'm just short LOL.  I'm only 5'2" tall.  He is 5'11" -- Height is unimportant... Its never stopped e from doing anything... and sometimes it's an advantage being shorter... like when I took Tae Kwon Do and we did self defence techniques, I could easily move under my opponent's arm as I grabbed it so I ended up behind them and had their arm in a pressure point hold.  Someone taller would not have been able to duck under so easily.  haha.  The tall guys hated it!  It was like my signature move! 

 

 

Edited September 20, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[amardeep]

Thats cool. Is he an indigenous kashmiri or did his grandparents/ancestors come from Punjab?

[CdnSikhGirl]

Thats cool. Is he an indigenous kashmiri or did his grandparents/ancestors come from Punjab?

Punjabi descent.. 

[Koi]

Who says you don't match?

I think you match quite nicely! 

[CdnSikhGirl]

Colour wise I meant... since I am in blue and he is in cream / red.  But the orange palla really looks good with the blue :) 

[paapiman]

This is not intended to spark another debate that we will only disagree on forever anyway... 

1. I got married... to the best Singh on the planet, who fully supports equality of everyone.  

2. I took Amrit. 

3. Though Panj Pyaras were five males that day, the Gurdwara where I took it, has had a woman do this seva before.  Further to this, the five addressed the women who took Amrit that day.  They said there is absolutely NO limitations placed on women in Sikhi.  They directly stated "Women who attain this level can just as easily be in the same place we are"  Even better, they then made a direct challenge to the women present with this statement "We want to see at least some of you Singhnis who are here today, be in the same place we are and do seva as Panj Pyaras someday!"  As if my day was not already awesome, THAT WAS ICING ON THE CAKE THAT MADE IT SPECTACULAR!

4. They also clarified some things:  You do NOT have to be vegetarian. It's your choice if you are (I am) but if you choose to eat meat, it can not be killed the Muslim way.  They also stated that piercings are not allowed because of the association to slavery in the past, however all other jewelry is perfectly fine. Makeup is also not prohibited.  Understanding this, I still don't wear makeup vast majority of the time anyway as I think it looks fake... except once in awhile if I have a blemish I will cover it up with some makeup.    

5.  During our Anand Karaj, we did a few things that challenged the status quo... I only had one friend and her husband present as my family could not make it.  My friend (a female) handed the palla.. A few Singhs went to object and tried to get her husband to do it, but my husband stopped them and said he wanted my friend to do it.  So thats how it happend! This was my husbands idea btw.  Though I did follow in the lavans... I would not have known enough to guage anyway when to stop as there is no screen there with translations.  For me the lavans themselves are not one leading and one following... they are both moving as one unit around Guru Ji.  It's a circle... and a circle anyway has no beginning or end, so there is no front or back.  if he moved further around who would he find in front of him?? And besides, I had more control over his movements, than he did of mine, since I controlled the slack in the palla and could make him move slower or faster based on how much slack I let get in it.  So when Singhs spout that lavans having the male in front is to denote the male's authority that she is supposed to be subject to... I laugh.  I had control over his movements, he didn't have control over mine lol.  To me it's more like a horse and chariot rider... where the male is the horse, pulling the chariot rider to the destination, but the chariot rider is the one who was in control LOL.  (I know some of you will be upset at my analogy, and try to turn it back into male 'leading' female 'following' in order to prove some point of husbands having authority or higher status over their wives but I really don't care.) 

6. My husband suggested I should stop coming here... as certain mindsets will never change and it's so not worth it to stress over opinions of others.  

God willing, you will have a great happy married life. It would have been great if you had taken Amrit from Pyaray, not associated with the so-called SRM, but something is better than nothing. You have taken Khanday da amrit prepared by five Gursikh males (who might all have very high spiritual levels) and Daas is guessing that they must have read all 5 complete prescribed Gurbanis (2 from SSGGSJ and 3 from SDGSJ), while preparing the Amrit. If you keep moving ahead in your spiritual journey, by doing plenty of naam simran, Satguru jee will show you the right path. Even Daas first took Amrit from Pyaray, associated with the so-called SRM.

There are some anit-Gurmat (against Sikh principles) statements made in this thread. They will be addressed in a separate topic.

Bhul chuk maaf

Edited September 21, 2015 by paapiman

[CdnSikhGirl]

I dont ever wish to take Amrit from any group who puts women into a lower position than men Paapiman. You can do as you wish but please don't expect me to ever agree with you and pls don't refer to Amrit taken by anyone as 'something better than nothing' and refer to it as not the 'right path' Infact the Panj Pyaras last weekend actually stated to NOT associate with any sects as they only serve to divide the panth. They said follow SRM and SGGSJ only.  And they themselves challenged the women present at Amrit last weekend to be dedicated and eventually also do the same seva as Panj Pyaras.  They stated there is nothing at all in Sikhi which says women are any less capable than men or deserve any less treatment. They directly said women too can also participate in Amrit Sanchars as Panj Pyaras.  and they further said to us that they WANT to see at least some of us reach that level and be there doing that same seva someday!!  They said directly to us that SRM is the ONLY accepted RM by Akal Takht. I know you can't stand that fact but you can't expect most women to like your philosophy of holding them as lower than men when SGGSJ teaches and instructs us to see and treat everyone equally. You can't expect me to ever want to put myself in a lower position as GRM would have me serving my husband as a God.  First of my husband would never let that happen as he too believes in equality.  

This Amrit Sanchar was also done at a Historical Gurdwara with over 50 people present and it was actually organized because I was there and requested it since I only had limited time and my husband has connections with the Srinagar committee.  

PS you won't find any dehras or sects or Babawalas (is that a word?) in Kashmir.  The Sikhs there only follow SRM and SGGSJ and Damdami Taksal tried to come there awhile back and they were told basically to keep to themselves and not try to influence the rest. 

I am hoping that YOU find the right path eventually... Instead of one of elitism and male superiority and denigrating women.  

 

Edited September 21, 2015 by Satkirin_Kaur

[paapiman]

There are some anit-Gurmat (against Sikh principles) statements made in this thread. They will be addressed in a separate topic.

Bhul chuk maaf

Here is the link to that thread.

http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/17077-some-important-concerns/#comment-153732

Bhul chuk maaf

[CdnSikhGirl]

Go pound sand Paapiman... And take your women denigrating comments and ideology with you!!