sukrit kaur

Pen jee,
the mind is just fulfiing its duty of its master Kal purukh by creating doubts in us, in order to desviate us from our goal, namely Wahiguru.
We too have to be faithfull sikhs of  Guru jee / Wahiguru by holding on to His pallau strongly, which is none other than His simran, come whatever it may.
Sat Sree Akal

Pen Jee,
when coming to love Wahiguru alone, there is never any excess ..... it is nothing but His Grace.  We are a drop of that Satnam Samundar of Pyaar , and  whatever concept we have of ourselves, is nothing but like a grain of sand in this Mahabhavsagar.
All rivers go and merge  in the Ocean, and yet it is not too much at all. The Ocean accepts and embraces them all ...
Love for Wahiguru, means to live in His will at all times. Believe it, the pull you feel within for Wahiguru, is not much on your part, as much as His powerfull pull, it is He who is pulling the string of your heart from within.
So be thankful to Him, to bless you more and more as much as  possible, as this is the only load/stock of wealth we shall take with us.
One more thing, to be able to digest and cope with this His blessing on you, try to keep constant simran running in you, at all times.
Cause as the saying goes, when one does His work(true love/devotion), He arranges and takes care of our worldy affairs.
Ja Tu Mere Wal Hai Ta Kya MuhChanda, Tud Sab Kich Mainu Saunpeya Ja Tera Banda
God bless you dear child!
Sat Sree Akal.
 

you are on the Path, and avoid intellectual interpretation of your symptoms.
The love and devotion to God has twin basis, give what you have without expectation and contemplate on giving what you don't have, and you can test your love and devotion yourself, it if is real, by gradually following HIS Hukams.
 
 

To have love for god is right,but then is it called excess when everything else seems to be useless.At this point,mind gets worried.Everything including friends,family,study,classes,career,even own health,own body become out of interest.Mind does not want to talk to anyone.It always keeps lost somewhere.All world matters become no longer point of interest.People start calling introward,insane .So is it right??,If not,then why does this happen walking on the path of spirituality? Are these signs of depression? Is there any need for counselling of mind?? Why this parkh takes this much time? Shouldnt God stop examining his lovers?? 
So,Is it not right to have excess of love towards almighty?? Or 
Does It mean that we are living with doubt or we dont love God in reality?
Please share your views .
WJKKWJKF!!

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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LHpdgHTINik

Also a lot of posts are missing.

Sister,
I do not want to discourage you or anybody, do what you want, but just ask yourself : to speed up, but for what?

You see, you say you want to this in dedication to Baba Deep Singh. It is fine.

But have we not got anything to do with Wahiguru?

Have we not, any duty towards our True Father Wahiguru?

You see, all Gurmukhs, Sant Janas, dedicate their wholes lives to make us understand throughly, that Wahiguru is the only permanent Truth.

And they come by the Hukum of Akal Purukh, to just make us understand, that if ever we have to do any devotion, it should be of Wahiguru alone.

If we ever want to please someone, it has to be Wahiguru.

If we ever have to love someone, it has to be Wahiguru.

It is His Jot, which is present in all. All owe their existence and presence to Him, Wahiguru.

Even Dasam Pitama, said: I am a servant of Wahiguru, and I have to come to see His Creation´s play.

So in my most humble suggestion, if ever you or anybody wants to do any paath, do it of the most sweetest aksahar: Wahiguru, Wahiguru, Wahiguru...

If you ever want to see the results, try the 108 times of any Paath as many times you want, and on the other side , do even 1 hour of Simran Jaap of Wahiguru, and see by yourself, the huge difference ....

After all, any devotion we do, isn´t it, to please in Wahiguru?

And that also, to earn His Glance of Grace and Mercy, in ordeer to become spotless, and one day merge in Him.

You see, any Paath, is singing His infinite Glory; but repeating His Name, through His Simran, is calling on Him directly, and it this our calling on Him, which makes us nearer and nearer to Him.

For example, a child talks about the virtues of his/her mother... the mother somehow listens to its child; but as long as the child does not say mummy, mummy, mummy...the mother does not come...

With our heavenly Father Wahiguru, something similarly happens ... As long as we cling on and keep ourselves busy with other terms of devotion, He stays where He is.

But the moment we call Him saying Wahiguru, Wahiguru, Wahiguru... He leaves His abode, and with each of our steps towards Him, He takes hundred steps towards us.

The thing is, if we ever have to do any devotion, why not His? The highest.

We should not do what the world does, let them do what they want ...

Rather we should only, and only follow what the Bani says:

Jin Har jappeya, se Har hoeeya.

We may read the Banis as much as possible, because we get more and more in love with Him, because our whole being gets in a state of bliss, as we hear of His unlimted mahima, His unbound grace ... we just get sweepd away, by just hearing a fraction of His wonderfull and countless virtues, as it surpasses any mental realm ..... It is like getting in trance, with just listening as said, His beant Mahima.

But with His Simran we get imbued with these His virtues mentioned above. His Simran, is simple, you can do it as much as you want, without any restrictions or limitations, you can do it while going to work, at home , while bathing, while eating, etc ...etc ... It is the most complete and simple jugtee at the same time, and the more one does His Simran, the more spiritual wealth we gather, for the day we shall have to leve this physical frame and plane.

You see pen jee, the Bani beautfully says:
Har Simran meh Prabh aap Nirankara.

This means, the Supreme Lord Wahiguru, is hidden in His Simran. So if we do it within us, He makes Himself Pargat within us, thus and only thus we become Him.

Sister, there is nothing in comparison to His Simran, in terms of devotion, to Him.

Please forgive me, if I have said anything which is not in accordance to your way of perceiving things, as for me, I have only taken you as a sister, and I have said only what I have understood a little from the pure paviter Bani of our Guru Sahibans. As the Bani is much much more than our petty minds.

Sat Sree Akal.

I am going to write this for the first time here.my ultimate goal is quite difficult to express in words.but i'll try .so here i go:
I want to be there from where i am.i want to make full benefit of this life and want to get rid from this circle forever.i want to be in deep sleep where there is almighty..where i have not to feel like i am feeling right now.no more thirst,no more wishes,not desire to meet lord.i should be there,he should be there,no more thoughts,nothing..i really dont know what to write more.

Guru Nanak created Nirmal Panth (pure) according to Bhai Gurdas. Nirmal Panth = Khalsa Panth

There was no changing of teachings, it was the same. Shasters were also worn before guru gobind singh. The tenth Guru just finalised Sikh teachings.

A Sikh does not become Khalsa merely by taking 'amrit' but by the following loving Parmatma. The word Khalsa is mentioned in SGGS.

Page 655, Line 1
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਜਨ ਭਏ ਖਾਲਸੇ ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਭਗਤਿ ਜਿਹ ਜਾਨੀ ॥੪॥੩॥
Says Kabeer, those humble people become pure - they become Khalsa - who know the Lord's loving devotional worship. ||4||3||
Devotee Kabir


And no Dasam Granth does not mention the 5 Kakkaars, it is a shabad attributed to Nand Lal contained in some Buddha Dal gutkas that might confuse you admin.

But due to some personal commitments (time limit) I can't partake in this interesting debate. I know Sher has some vested interests in denying the importance of kesh and other external rehat which differentiates Sikhs from Hindus.

And its also not the first time that KDSingh and I have the discussion.

Hope someone can take over and guide these two.

The clue lies in the fact that Guru Nanak Sahib wasn't only a saint but also had political teachings and was a revolutionary. Guru Nanak asked his arabic Sikhs to keep kesh (I refer to Syed Prithipal Singh who was an ex Muslim who met these Arabic Sikhs last century). Sobti Sikhs in Iraq also only knew of Guru Nanak but kept uncut hair.

Gyan Ratnavli and other Janamsakhis clearly mention that Guru Nanak asked Bhai Mardana to keep kesh.

Guru Nanak had long uncut kesh according to Mehervaan Janamsakhi.

Hukam Rajaee Chalna is the biggest proof for Khalsa Rehat of keeping uncut kesh & anti circumcision.

So Shabads adressed to Hindus do not count for Sikhs? Or Shabads to Muslims don't count for Sikhs? Gurbani has one updesh for all humanity, the updesh did not change from person to person. Thats a flawed logic you have there.

Prof Sahib Singh clearly states the the tuk means to stop thinking of hair removal (sunnah - shaving moustache, removing pubic hair, armpit hair) as purity, instead let your sabat soorat (uncircumcised state) be the purity.

ਨਾਪਾਕ ਪਾਕੁ ਕਰਿ ਹਦੂਰਿ ਹਦੀਸਾ ਸਾਬਤ ਸੂਰਤਿ ਦਸਤਾਰ ਸਿਰਾ ॥੧੨॥
ਹੇ ਅੱਲਾ ਦੇ ਬੰਦੇ! (ਵਿਕਾਰਾਂ ਵਿਚ) ਮਲੀਨ ਹੋ ਰਹੇ ਮਨ ਨੂੰ ਪਵਿੱਤਰ ਕਰਨ ਦਾ ਜਤਨ ਕਰ-ਇਹੀ ਹੈ ਰੱਬੀ ਮਿਲਾਪ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਸ਼ਰਹ ਦੀ ਕਿਤਾਬ। (ਸੁੰਨਤਿ, ਲਬਾਂ ਕਟਾਣ ਆਦਿਕ ਸ਼ਰਹ ਨੂੰ ਛੱਡ ਕੇ) ਆਪਣੀ ਸ਼ਕਲ ਨੂੰ ਜਿਉਂ ਕਾ ਤਿਉਂ ਰੱਖ-ਇਹ (ਲੋਕ ਪਰਲੋਕ ਵਿਚ) ਇੱਜ਼ਤ-ਆਦਰ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤ ਕਰਨ ਦਾ ਵਸੀਲਾ ਬਣ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ॥੧੨॥

As someone who wasnt born into Sikhi, I do not think 5 k's are stunting growth of Sikhi... opposite actually!

I have fully adopted and WANTED to adopt the 5 K's. Coming to Sikhi on my own, I WANTED everyone to know I chose this path. I wanted to stand out, I feel somehow different especially since I started to tie a dastar. Some Sikh guys dislike women tying turbans, but let me tell you, I see something different in me since I have. It's been a full year now and I can't ever see me going back to bare headed. And a chunni is just not possible for anything that involves well... movement lol. Unless you want to strangle yourself with it!

I think the Khalsa roop actually helps to draw people to Sikhi... not prevent it from spreading!

I know turban is not one of the 5 k's but it's still a must and still part of the image of Kkalsa. I also cant imagine cutting my hair.

Here is yesterday's very variag may kirtan by Veer Manpreet Singh. Enjoy.

http://soundcloud.com/satwant9/20130616-veer-manpreet-singh

Sangat Ji,

Here are some recent live recordings of Veer Manpreet Singh (UK Wale). True divine kirtan. Enjoy...



https://soundcloud.com/satwant/20130113-veer-manpreet-singh

Its also not an AKJ or Naamdharis (and others) other bashing thread so why nobody jump on Paapiman when he said so??

My point was not to bash DDT. My point was to show Paapiman that his very own description of a cult actually works against the sects he holds dear, which are the so called 'orthodox' sects because he describes any sect as not following ALL of Gurbani or doubting any of it as a cult. So I was trying to show how his definition of a cult is flawed.

Right and Gurbani says over and over that same light of God is in both genders and that neither one is above the other and that we are to see ALL with single eye of equality.

Then doing things the way that so called 'orthodox' sects how they see women as inferior, and make them acknowledge that inferiority by bowing to men, and disallow women from full participation in all seva... those actions are FALSE. Therefore do you think they fall under the definition of a 'cult'???

You said anyone who disregards ANY part of Gurbani is false and hence is a cult... so please answer the above. And I can back my point with Gurbani... Gurbani that is IN CONTEXT.

Page 599, Line 2
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਏਕ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਕਰਿ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਸਮੋਈ ਜੀਉ ॥੨॥
Gurmukẖ ek ḏarisat kar ḏekẖhu gẖat gẖat joṯ samo▫ī jī▫o. ||2||
As Gurmukh, look upon all with the single eye of equality; in each and every heart, the Divine Light is contained. ||2||

Look upon ALL with single eye of equality. So DDT have women look upon husband as God. But do not tell husband to look at his wife the same way. DDT are creating perceived inequality. That goes against the above tuk and many others. The above tuk is IN CONEXT in the shabad its in without having to twist it and remove from the shabad to use by itself alone. So they are spreading FALSE teaching!

want more??

Page 446, Line 12
ਸਭ ਏਕ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਸਮਤੁ ਕਰਿ ਦੇਖੈ ਸਭੁ ਆਤਮ ਰਾਮੁ ਪਛਾਨ ਜੀਉ ॥
Sabẖ ek ḏarisat samaṯ kar ḏekẖai sabẖ āṯam rām pacẖẖān jī▫o.
They look upon all with equality, and recognize the Supreme Soul, the Lord, pervading among all.

Again this one is also IN CONTEXT of the shabad its in! Without having to twist anything and remove it from the shabad as a stand alone tuk!

More??

Page 833, Line 16
ਏਕ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਸਭ ਸਮ ਕਰਿ ਜਾਣੈ ਨਦਰੀ ਆਵੈ ਸਭੁ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਪਸਰਈਆ ॥੭॥
Ėk ḏarisat sabẖ sam kar jāṇai naḏrī āvai sabẖ barahm pasra▫ī▫ā. ||7||
With a single, impartial eye, look upon all alike, and see God pervading all. ||7||

I could post MANY more just the same! ALL throughout SGGSJ! You are saying that anyone who disregards or doubts ANY part of Gurbani are a 'cult' yet so called 'orthodox' sects seem to forget these MANY MANY tuks on equality, and treat women as inferior to men. You didn't even dispute this fact when shown in another thread. You just quoted 'rehet maryada' as reason. Yet you just said on this thread that ANYONE who doubts or disregards ANY PART of Gurbani are a 'cult'

So .... according to your own description of what a cult is... the so called 'orthodox' sects fall into 'YOUR' description of a cult!! Because they disregard Gurbani on equality! Remember the above are only a few of the MANY MANY places Gurbani makes this statement and ALL OF THEM are IN CONTEXT in their shabads and are not removed as a single tuk and twisted the words backwards to fit an agenda!

Gurbani even tells us to avoid the 'different schools of philosophy' who wrongly teach that some are above others... and instead encourages us to see everyone equally!!! This counts whether we are looking at different sects as beneath our own sect, or also gender. ALL humans are equal! ALL humans have the same potential. ALL humans deserve the same opportunities and none should be forced to see themselves as inferior and bow to other humans who are equal to them.

Page 1103, Line 18
ਦਰਸਨੁ ਛੋਡਿ ਭਏ ਸਮਦਰਸੀ ਏਕੋ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿਗੇ ॥੨॥
Ḏarsan cẖẖod bẖa▫e samaḏrasī eko nām ḏẖi▫āvhige. ||2||
Giving up the different schools of philosophy, I look upon all equally; I meditate only on the One Name. ||2||

Cult or sect, can be called to all those who personaly or collectively do not worship Wahiguru Akal Purukh, the highest Power, or Supreme Consciousness, sole Reality.

There can be no greater "durmat", to not be blessed to worship and adore Him.

To influence and pollute others with hatred, and violence, which leads to fanatism, thus spiritual ignorance, is also cult, howsoever they may appear religiously inclined.

Being religious is not synonymous to become spiritually enlightened.

Either one loves Wahiguru, and one has Him as his/her goal, or not, that´s it in short.

Now how to love, worship and adore Him, is another topic, but basically, under the term cult, comes everyone who does not have Wahiguru as his/her, Aadhaar.

As the Bani says: Santa kee tek toon, bhakta kee oat toon, Sachaa sirjan haar ....

Sat Sree Akal.

Penji, if the thoughts of debate are distubring your mind maye you are investing too much emotional energy into it. One way to avoid exhaustion is that present your point, and stand by it. If you have a counter-argument to present , present it otherwise stay relaxed.
We have to know that if someone is not agreeing with us, its not our job to convinve them. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and understandings. I mean this in a positive way. There is no win-lose, its only a constructive discussion for your own benefit.
I mean this is in a positive way.

My closing thoughts are that if we are sincere enough in our aspirations , A brahmgyani will Himself come to us to solve our doubts or help us in some form. We do not have to define a Brahmgyani or find one.
Baba Ishar Singh Ji used to say this line before Baba Nand Singh Ji met him: ਯਾਰ ਹੋਣਗੇ ਮਿਲਣਗੇ ਆਪੇ ਦਿਲ ਨੂ ਟਿਕਾਣੇ ਰਖੀੲੇ

Here are my thoughts that i posted few years ago on forum:
 
 

But It's still a doubt for me.Sorry it's off topic.But I dont agree with killing of animals by ordinary men.Gurbani does not allow us to do so.

Paapiman you are still trying to confine what a Brahamgyani is...

Brahamgyani is not a label given by a sect to a leader etc.

It's actually becoming one with God. Finding that connection within. Understanding truth to reality. This is an act of the soul, in which every human has potential.

Arguing over which prayers are valid or not, does not ultimately matter because there will be those who actually find their way to this realization with no religion at all! Becoming Brahamgyani is not just following a set of rules and get a kudos or pat on the back for following them. It's actually becoming God realized.

That is not restricted to ANY human or man made group! It's possible for ANY human!

How do you know?? Sukhmani sahib tells us only the brahamgyani themselves can know. How can you gauge (or even think you have the privilege to gauge) whether or not someone else has become one with God? You can only say for yourself and nobody else.

So here by claiming who can and can't attain brahamgyani YOU are disregarding Gurbani!!!

Also DDT doubt gurbani where it says that women and men are equal. So do you think they can still attain brahamgyani? They disregard whole of SGGSJ saying women and men are equal and twist one tuk to mean what they want and then use that while still ignoring all of Gurbani as a whole saying women are not inferior. But they are saying women are inferior and must show that inferiority by bowing to men. So they are disregarding Gurbani where it says treat ALL with an equal eye.

So can they still attain brahamgyani??

So does whether or not someone believes in specific prayer make them a cult??

And here I thought a cult was the likes of the group that my friend had to be rescued from that drained her bank account, had her living in fear that she would be shunned or worse killed if she left, had her brainwashed into thinking only they were chosen people etc and that their leader was some chosen guy and hence could have sex whenever he wanted with any of the women in the 'compound'.

Thats the definition of what a cult is... not because two groups disagree on one prayer.