das

Om Swami came from a rich family, is educated in Australia and was running his own multi-million dollar company. But he left everything to be on Spiritual track. Very touching articles. e.g
http://omswami.com/2015/09/a-story-of-faith.html
http://omswami.com/2015/05/a-cobbler-dog-and-god.html
I think he is indeed brave or say lucky, who can do what life really wants instead of us who are just engrossed in baseless/worthless arguments on this vs that. Have a look on his website. Great, refreshing.

Congratulations Satkirin. May God bless you and your family!

The very simplest exercise for insomnia is: Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from the toes to the crown ten times. Just practice this for 10-15 times. Personally, I've noticed that most people don't remember when they fall asleep while doing this exercise. That's it.
There is another very potent but detailed exercise which could treat any chronic case of insomnia within 7 days but at the same time should not be used to fall asleep. Here are the details:
Potent Relaxation (Shithali Karana): As taught by Swami Rama
There is no exercise known to be higher and better than this exercise to alleviate stress, hypertension. It can cure any chronic insomnia case. Even though it is great exercise for insomnia but keep in mind that this exercise should NOT used to fall asleep. If you do this exercise, you will find a difference in the quality of your sleep. In 7 days time it completely changes the whole cycle and anatomy of sleep; the quality of sleep increases and the duration of sleep decreases. Usually you do not really get a deep sleep so that your body is fully rested; you have aches and pains and inertia in the morning. If you do this exercise you will not experience those any longer.
This exercise is also very good for either mentally based or physically based depression. If you do this exercise before meditating, you will find a difference in the quality of your meditation. Practice this exercise for a long time and perfect it. You should have mastery over this exercise and do it accurately. Find out where you are committing mistakes, and then correct your mistakes. You should train your body to follow your mental instructions by doing this exercise. Use pillow under the head for this exercise because otherwise the finer gases from the digestive system can come up and disturb your heart.
Do not retain the breath in this exercise. There should be no jerks, or noises, and the breathing should not be shallow. 2nd chakra is excluded from this exercise. This exercise will drop the pulse rate drop and heart muscle able to rest. The involuntary system also rests; the pumping station that pumps blood to your brain slows down.
To begin, the room should be made dark, quiet, and the eyes should be closed. Make sure that you lie on ground or with a thin sheet on ground; never use bed or mattress as it will make your spine curved. Lie down on your back with a soft pillow (not too big or small, just normal) under the head, with your feet spread and space between two legs, the toes pointed outward, the hands a little bit away from the body, palms up, eyes and lips gently closed, and the tongue relaxed at the roof of the mouth. First, breathe diaphragmatically 5 times; 5 complete exhalations and 5 inhalations. As you exhale let your abdomen contract, allowing the lungs to expel carbon dioxide. Let the abdominal muscles gently relax when you inhale. Exhale from the crown of your head to the toes, and inhale from the toes up through the ankles, knees, hip joints, and spinal column and coming back to crown. Do this 10 times. Exhale from crown to ankles, and inhale from ankles up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to knees, and inhale from knees up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to perineum, and inhale from perineum up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to navel, and inhale from navel up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to heart center, and inhale from heart up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to throat, and inhale from throat up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to bridge between nostrils, and inhale from bridge between nostrils up to crown. 5 times. If one of your nostril is blocked, ask your mind to open it and if it is your friend, then it open it. Exhale from crown to space between eye-brows, and inhale from space between eye-brows up to crown. 10 times. Here breath will become very short but it is fine breathe. It is not really shallow, but actually deep and fine. Exhale from crown to bridge between nostrils, and inhale from bridge between nostrils up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to throat, and inhale from throat up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to heart center, and inhale from heart up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to navel, and inhale from navel up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to perineum, and inhale from perineum up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to knees, and inhale from knees up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to ankles, and inhale from ankles up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from toes up to crown. 10 times. Then gently get up. Throughout this entire exercise relax your whole body and let it inhale and exhale in a natural manner. In short the summary is:
Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from the toes to the crown ten times. Do the same with the ankles and knees. Then 5 times to perineum, navel, heart center, throat, bridge between the nostrils. Then from space between eyebrows to bridge between nostrils at least 10 times. Then reverse the process, coming back to the toes.  

The very simplest exercise for insomnia is: Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from the toes to the crown ten times. Just practice this for 10-15 times. Personally, I've noticed that most people don't remember when they fall asleep while doing this exercise. That's it.
There is another very potent but detailed exercise which could treat any chronic case of insomnia within 7 days but at the same time should not be used to fall asleep. Here are the details:
Potent Relaxation (Shithali Karana): As taught by Swami Rama
There is no exercise known to be higher and better than this exercise to alleviate stress, hypertension. It can cure any chronic insomnia case. Even though it is great exercise for insomnia but keep in mind that this exercise should NOT used to fall asleep. If you do this exercise, you will find a difference in the quality of your sleep. In 7 days time it completely changes the whole cycle and anatomy of sleep; the quality of sleep increases and the duration of sleep decreases. Usually you do not really get a deep sleep so that your body is fully rested; you have aches and pains and inertia in the morning. If you do this exercise you will not experience those any longer.
This exercise is also very good for either mentally based or physically based depression. If you do this exercise before meditating, you will find a difference in the quality of your meditation. Practice this exercise for a long time and perfect it. You should have mastery over this exercise and do it accurately. Find out where you are committing mistakes, and then correct your mistakes. You should train your body to follow your mental instructions by doing this exercise. Use pillow under the head for this exercise because otherwise the finer gases from the digestive system can come up and disturb your heart.
Do not retain the breath in this exercise. There should be no jerks, or noises, and the breathing should not be shallow. 2nd chakra is excluded from this exercise. This exercise will drop the pulse rate drop and heart muscle able to rest. The involuntary system also rests; the pumping station that pumps blood to your brain slows down.
To begin, the room should be made dark, quiet, and the eyes should be closed. Make sure that you lie on ground or with a thin sheet on ground; never use bed or mattress as it will make your spine curved. Lie down on your back with a soft pillow (not too big or small, just normal) under the head, with your feet spread and space between two legs, the toes pointed outward, the hands a little bit away from the body, palms up, eyes and lips gently closed, and the tongue relaxed at the roof of the mouth. First, breathe diaphragmatically 5 times; 5 complete exhalations and 5 inhalations. As you exhale let your abdomen contract, allowing the lungs to expel carbon dioxide. Let the abdominal muscles gently relax when you inhale. Exhale from the crown of your head to the toes, and inhale from the toes up through the ankles, knees, hip joints, and spinal column and coming back to crown. Do this 10 times. Exhale from crown to ankles, and inhale from ankles up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to knees, and inhale from knees up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to perineum, and inhale from perineum up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to navel, and inhale from navel up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to heart center, and inhale from heart up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to throat, and inhale from throat up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to bridge between nostrils, and inhale from bridge between nostrils up to crown. 5 times. If one of your nostril is blocked, ask your mind to open it and if it is your friend, then it open it. Exhale from crown to space between eye-brows, and inhale from space between eye-brows up to crown. 10 times. Here breath will become very short but it is fine breathe. It is not really shallow, but actually deep and fine. Exhale from crown to bridge between nostrils, and inhale from bridge between nostrils up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to throat, and inhale from throat up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to heart center, and inhale from heart up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to navel, and inhale from navel up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to perineum, and inhale from perineum up to crown. 5 times. Exhale from crown to knees, and inhale from knees up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to ankles, and inhale from ankles up to crown. 10 times. Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from toes up to crown. 10 times. Then gently get up. Throughout this entire exercise relax your whole body and let it inhale and exhale in a natural manner. In short the summary is:
Exhale from crown to toes, and inhale from the toes to the crown ten times. Do the same with the ankles and knees. Then 5 times to perineum, navel, heart center, throat, bridge between the nostrils. Then from space between eyebrows to bridge between nostrils at least 10 times. Then reverse the process, coming back to the toes.  

Om Swami came from a rich family, is educated in Australia and was running his own multi-million dollar company. But he left everything to be on Spiritual track. Very touching articles. e.g
http://omswami.com/2015/09/a-story-of-faith.html
http://omswami.com/2015/05/a-cobbler-dog-and-god.html
I think he is indeed brave or say lucky, who can do what life really wants instead of us who are just engrossed in baseless/worthless arguments on this vs that. Have a look on his website. Great, refreshing.

Om Swami came from a rich family, is educated in Australia and was running his own multi-million dollar company. But he left everything to be on Spiritual track. Very touching articles. e.g
http://omswami.com/2015/09/a-story-of-faith.html
http://omswami.com/2015/05/a-cobbler-dog-and-god.html
I think he is indeed brave or say lucky, who can do what life really wants instead of us who are just engrossed in baseless/worthless arguments on this vs that. Have a look on his website. Great, refreshing.

Om Swami came from a rich family, is educated in Australia and was running his own multi-million dollar company. But he left everything to be on Spiritual track. Very touching articles. e.g
http://omswami.com/2015/09/a-story-of-faith.html
http://omswami.com/2015/05/a-cobbler-dog-and-god.html
I think he is indeed brave or say lucky, who can do what life really wants instead of us who are just engrossed in baseless/worthless arguments on this vs that. Have a look on his website. Great, refreshing.

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.
Also, why the hell you're so desperate to show the world (other religions) to counter-act their claims? The real point is: What you've achieved by following Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Think about yourself, in dargah, your Spiritual achievements will be measured and not your debating skills (debating on topics which are all illusion).

Avatarvaad is not based on some competition on who is the greatest. Each avatar comes with a specific purpose and mission according to the context they manifest in. Krishna was pooran according to the context he manifested in and the Sri Satguru was pooran according to the context they manifested in. I find this "my Guru is greater than your Guru" business a bit too childish.

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.
Also, why the hell you're so desperate to show the world (other religions) to counter-act their claims? The real point is: What you've achieved by following Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Think about yourself, in dargah, your Spiritual achievements will be measured and not your debating skills (debating on topics which are all illusion).

Sant Baba Isher Singh Rara Sahib wale used to say: If the Guru is not-pura/complete but the student has 100% faith in his Guru that he is the God; then there are chances that student will reach higher Spiritual stages and will eventually get real Guru. On the other hand if the Guru is pura/complete/God-Himself but student does not have 100% faith on his Guru, then the student will NOT succeed. It means that Faith is more important.
Also, why the hell you're so desperate to show the world (other religions) to counter-act their claims? The real point is: What you've achieved by following Guru Nanak Dev Ji? Think about yourself, in dargah, your Spiritual achievements will be measured and not your debating skills (debating on topics which are all illusion).

Okay, agreed that Guru Nanak Dev Ji was highest of the high; He is the greatest. But the real question is: Are you following Guru Ji's instructions/teachings in real sense? You're born in Sikhism and therefore its easier for you to follow Guru Ji's teachings (no resistance from society, family etc.). If you still don't follow the real core teachings of Guru Nanak Dev Ji, then having Guru Nanak Dev Ji as greatest have NO benefit to you. Think about it.
 

Most of the stuff you seem worried about isn’t going to affect your day to day life as Gursikh. And yes, you get tested.Everyone does. But I feel you are in the same mindset that a lot of people are in when they enter the dharm, focusing more on the outer stuff. All fired up about the political and social revolutionary aspects. Nothing wrong with that. But, the relative importance of the outer things to the inner spiritual life is akin to the skin of the almond to the almond itself. 
There are variations between Gurdwaras as well. Some places are more restrictive while others are not. Some places the sangat is very spiritual minded while other places they are not so far along in the path. 
You seem to be throwing the baby out with the bathwater over a few things that, for the most part, are unlikely to majorly affect your life much unless you let them. They usually do not directly affect you. 
Going to sangat everyday is  hugely important for one’s jeevan. But the difference is I go there for my jeevan, not to critique things or look for faults. The ones who go to fight fights usually lose out, while the ones who focus on Naam gain. I’m not saying there aren’t fights worth fighting. But how will you accomplish anything if you fight every fight? 
 
btw, when I called those things bunk I meant that most of them are not legitimate Sikhi. The majority also happen to not believe in them. 
 
 

When we choose a religion from a culture which is way different from our understanding there will always arise such conflicts..the fact is women are not the same as they were then..they are independent . Besides our differences i feel you are a strong woman..and i understand your thinking .
There are different layers of Sikhi ...The Nanak Panth is a different layer ..no where in the Guru Granth Sahib you will find insistence on rehat maryada..people will give tuks to prove ..but otherwise what i feel is ..it is the Sant marg..full of Bhagti for the One Divine Hari Parmatma..full of Sehaj ..
The Khalsa of Guru Gobindsingh ji is the militarised form and has certain regulations ..people may have their thoughts about Amirt sanskaar as a uniform ceremony however i strongly feel that there would be a different process of amrit sanskaar for women and a different rehat..also women were not empowered then and had a limited role in the ceremony there is belief of them to be not playing any role .
Your feminist approach will not let you stick to any belief where you will not find the role of women, which is not a point to argue since it is all about a mindset. Good or bad is not something for me to judge because at the same time i don't have any issues with it .
Before you go forward to a major decision in your life ..it is for you to think that this is just one thing which is known to you now ..going forward at every stage you will face such challenges wherein you will find yourself  thinking differently from the society and your spouse which you will be part of .
You need to think and introspect about your decision since it is all about your life.
I personally am brought up in a cosmopolitan way and society, i don't get along with one single group in majority i prefer to have everyone around .  I can very well understand how you must be feeling . 
You might have ignored my replies to your posts in the past ..however i am saying all this to you as a fellow human being ..we aren't friends or relatives ..whatever i have experienced and known i feel you need to introspect really well and then arrive at a decision . It is about 2 people's lives and i feel everyone should be happy.
 
 
 

As per my belief (based upon Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's audio deewan), "Waheguru" mantar was first uttered as "Satnaam Waheguru" by Nirankar Himself when Guru Nanak Dev Ji requested Him to give Him updesh during Guru Nanak Dev Ji's visit to Nirankar (when Guru Ji went to Vae river for 3 days). Nirankar then uttered the Moolmantar.
Again, this is my belief and your belief might differ based upon the your choice of source. But in general, its best to believe that source which have actually travelled instead of the one who just visited the Map (via books, history, scriptures) and not the real thing.
If you want to hear the deewan, then here is the link: It starts from around: 30.00 till 48.00:
http://www.gurmatveechar.com/audios/Katha/01_Puratan_Katha/Sant_Ishar_Singh_(Rara_Sahib_wale)/051-100/070--Sant.Isher.Singh.(Rara.Sahib.wale)--Sri.Guru.Nanak.Dev.Ji.da.Sachkhand.Jana.mp3

If anyone claims something to be perfect on the face-value, then he/she is bound to prove it and giving one's our account is perfect way. So, in other words, it's not the personal details. See bro, I'm not pulling your leg or trying to prove you wrong, but I just want to show you the reality. Don't go for right-wing thinking or left-wing thinking. You're bound to get failures. Follow the middle-path as suggested in Guru Ji.
Sikhism as religion would NOT take you anywhere. Come out of your dream world. But the teachings of Sikhism (as written down in Guru Granth Sahib Ji) does have potential to lead you on the path of salvation quickly. But there are 2 conditions that must be fulfilled by anyone who want to ride fastest to salvation:
1. Understand the real meaning and core concepts of Gurbani. e.g Karma, Upsana, Gyan, importance of Guru etc.
2. And then Practice those teachings.
These days, people have forgot the conditions but just claim that Sikhism is the fastest or some say the only. Real Sikhism is not what you see these days. Sikhism is NOT about the Amrit Sanchar, or Panj Payare, or equality vs inequality, or this vs that. It's sad to see that day by day, common people are converting the Sikhism into some package/box and then marketing it. Wake up.
You might remember the conversation with Suleman with sangat during Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's (Rara Sahib wale) time. Suleman was asked which religion is best: Listen to it and then understand the core he is talking about. He specifically mentioned that everything is same but in Sikhism it is easier to follow a Saint whereas in other religions (referring to Muslims) going to a Saint is NOT allowed.
Bottom-line is:
Sikhism was supposed to be fastest lane ONLY when: One understands the real meanings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and does understand that there is a need for REAL Saints and practice the teachings.
One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.
Are not the teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji teach exactly what is mentioned in the above 4 steps? Think about it.

Recently on this forum and in general view: there is always tension between the groups in regards to "If women can be part of Panj Payaras or not". Every group has its own rigid explanations for their views.
Group-1 says that yes, women can be part of Panj payaras. Their core reason is the bani as explained in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Group-2 says that no, women cannot be part of Panj payars. Their core reason is because women didn't  offer their head that day or say Guru Ji didn't ask. Some also say that women is not capable of preparing Amrit. Group-3 says that we've to follow the establised tradition and should not allow women to be part of Panj-payars but if any women is Brahmgyani, then its okay. Their core reason is that since the creation of Khalsa and all along during the times of great Saints, everyone suggested that women cannot be Panj Payaras. Now, I do NOT want to stretch this boring conversation to further but I DO want to present my personal views which seems to be opposite to the above mentioned groups at-the face value but in deeper sense it does resonate with them. So, please do NOT post same old reasons/explanations to prove your point. But I invite all memebers to please share your thoughts on this topic without indulging in baseless claims and let's have a Open Mind discussion.
I also request everyone to carefully read the whole topic first and then send your response. Please do NOT read causally or just scan and then post the same thing which was in your head (pre-programmed).
My personal view is: No, women cannot be part of Panj Payaras because the Amrit prepared during Sanskar Amrit is still within the sphere of "Laws of Universe" unless a Brahmgyani (any gender) is involved.
In other words, Amrit is prepared with its roots in Duality (opposites coming together). And anything in duality needs to have opposite forces coming together: Shiva and Shakti. Shakti is represented by the Khanda/Sword/Bagauti and Shiva power needs to be in the form of 5 males (Five are required to move Seven to Twelve in Space). As this physical Amrit is NOT the real Amrit (real Amrit being Naam Amrit), therefore in order to prepare it one needs to have correct ingredients: Positive and Negative forces. One cannot prepare the strongest Amrit (which acts as initiation for Guru and will further lead to Raas) with the use of un-balanced ingredients.
Now, why I think that Sanskar Amrit is within the Sphere of Laws: It is because:
The 5K's (Kara, Kangha, Kachera, Kirpan, Kesh/Kesge) symbols are the physical symbols; they DO represent Spiritual purposes but still they are just physical symbols. How could we ridicule Janeu (Hindu thread) as manmat; janeu could also represent some Spiritual principle. So, how could we mock janeu but for 100% in for 5Ks as physical symbols? Guru Gobind Singh Ji choosing only men or say God only pushing man to stand for the cause DOES hold some purpose. As Guru Ji was 100% sure regarding what was written in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and as per Guru Granth Sahib Ji, man and woman does have equal opportunity and rights. So, he would not go against Guru Granth Sahib Ji. In Bachittar Natak, Guru has mentioned that in His previous life (not physical though) how he once fight with the demons and won the war. This is the time when Bhagauti told Guru Ji that when He will go to Earth for the establishment of new dharma, then She would offer her services and this is the reason Khanda is used while preparing Amrit. And Panj-Payas does represent Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Guru Gobind Singh Ji has told several times in history that He should NOT be considered God. Here I'm NOT trying to say that He was not God; I'm just trying to bring up the point that no Guru before Guru Gobind Singh Ji has said that in the same tone. He is not trying to be humble, may be He is trying to tell us something (that he indicated in His writings) Guru Gobind Singh Ji's birth and the creation of Khalsa was the requirement of those times but Guru Ji did NOT abolish the place of Saint/Sant (some call it physical Guru). e.g If you see all the yesteryear Sants after the creation of Khalsa, even though they did come under the umbrella of Khalsa but they are also the student under their respective Senior Teachers/Gurus/Sants. If the intention of any Guru (any 10 Gurus) was of to abolish the trend of physical Sant, then surely They must have provided in written format the Arths/Meanings of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. But They did not do that because the key to the hidden treasures of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is still with the Sants. So, wraping up I could say that: Guru Gobind Singh Ji did come for different purpose (as per the requirement of time and order of Waheguru) and fullfilled His purpose; and his purpose was not the same as that of first 5 Gurus and 9th Guru. Even 6, 7, 8th Guru Ji have not recorded Their Bani in Guru Granth Sahib Ji as They were preparing the ground for the coming of 10th Guru. Read the story of Bib Bhani. Guru Gobind Singh Ji explicitly stated many times this fact in His writings: Bachittar Natak and His other writings. It is just us (the normal people) who didn't look deep enough.
At last, I'm NOT saying that Khalsa was that time's need and we need not take Amrit. I'm just saying that people start debating this vs that without understanding the purpose of creation of Khalsa. Sometimes in different ingredients (having different powers) are necessary to bring up the Neutral/Precious stuff. e.g It is believed that lead could be transformed into gold in alchemy.

The 5K's (Kara, Kangha, Kachera, Kirpan, Kesh/Kesge); the symbols are the physical symbols; they DO represent Spiritual purposes but still they are just physical symbols. How could we explain this outside of duality? How could we ridicule Janeu (Hindu thread) as manmat; janeu could also represent some Spiritual principle. So, how could we mock janeu but 100% in for 5Ks for Sikhs?
Satkirin, do you know Kirpan/Khanda is always represented by Female/Shakti. I don't know how could 5 women (female power) prepare it with Kirpan (again female power)? Moreover, have you read Bachittar Natak, or Bibi Bhani's sakhi? It sounds like from your messages that you haven't had a chance. I have no issues with you or paapiman but both of you have yourself closed your mind to any new stuff, both of you are just repeating same stuff again and again without even trying to understand what the other is saying.
Yes, I agree that everything is Illusion/Maya; in that sense, we haven't left God's abode; HE is still here; in-fact we're God. Then what's the need of any Spiritual stuff anyway or to take Amrit?? Kindly explain? Just switch your point to view from macro to micro. Yet, its very easy to say, but extremely hard to experience. e.g If someone asks you to target Sky; your reaction would be where in Sky. Right? You need something in the sky to aim at. Same way, Nirankar is everywhere but out our bhuddi (part of mind) is not able to understand it, so we had to take the help of Mind to some level, i.e we need to concentrate our dhayan on something which will eventually take us from this level to that level. Problem is when we rigidly start worshiping the tools thinking that this is the God.
Moreover, its just recently that everyone is treating Amrit like going to a shop (choosing which brand - AKJ or This or That) and then making a deal. Nothing more than that. In the past, Saints/Sants used to give Amrit only to people who are really ready and putting up the effort. e.g If anyone asks for Amrit from Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji, then he used to say that: First practice Meditation/Paath for 6 months, and then again for 6 months and instructs them to refrain from alcohol and meat during that time. And if one is able to follow those for 1 full year, only then he/she was given Amrit. Nowdays, things have changed and there are many shops where one can do window shopping.
At-last, regarding your dropping the idea of taking Amrit, please allow me to ask this question: Why you were interested in taking Amrit in first-place: Was it because of your Love towards Guru Granth Sahib Ji OR just something else? You decide!!

Recently on this forum and in general view: there is always tension between the groups in regards to "If women can be part of Panj Payaras or not". Every group has its own rigid explanations for their views.
Group-1 says that yes, women can be part of Panj payaras. Their core reason is the bani as explained in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Group-2 says that no, women cannot be part of Panj payars. Their core reason is because women didn't  offer their head that day or say Guru Ji didn't ask. Some also say that women is not capable of preparing Amrit. Group-3 says that we've to follow the establised tradition and should not allow women to be part of Panj-payars but if any women is Brahmgyani, then its okay. Their core reason is that since the creation of Khalsa and all along during the times of great Saints, everyone suggested that women cannot be Panj Payaras. Now, I do NOT want to stretch this boring conversation to further but I DO want to present my personal views which seems to be opposite to the above mentioned groups at-the face value but in deeper sense it does resonate with them. So, please do NOT post same old reasons/explanations to prove your point. But I invite all memebers to please share your thoughts on this topic without indulging in baseless claims and let's have a Open Mind discussion.
I also request everyone to carefully read the whole topic first and then send your response. Please do NOT read causally or just scan and then post the same thing which was in your head (pre-programmed).
My personal view is: No, women cannot be part of Panj Payaras because the Amrit prepared during Sanskar Amrit is still within the sphere of "Laws of Universe" unless a Brahmgyani (any gender) is involved.
In other words, Amrit is prepared with its roots in Duality (opposites coming together). And anything in duality needs to have opposite forces coming together: Shiva and Shakti. Shakti is represented by the Khanda/Sword/Bagauti and Shiva power needs to be in the form of 5 males (Five are required to move Seven to Twelve in Space). As this physical Amrit is NOT the real Amrit (real Amrit being Naam Amrit), therefore in order to prepare it one needs to have correct ingredients: Positive and Negative forces. One cannot prepare the strongest Amrit (which acts as initiation for Guru and will further lead to Raas) with the use of un-balanced ingredients.
Now, why I think that Sanskar Amrit is within the Sphere of Laws: It is because:
The 5K's (Kara, Kangha, Kachera, Kirpan, Kesh/Kesge) symbols are the physical symbols; they DO represent Spiritual purposes but still they are just physical symbols. How could we ridicule Janeu (Hindu thread) as manmat; janeu could also represent some Spiritual principle. So, how could we mock janeu but for 100% in for 5Ks as physical symbols? Guru Gobind Singh Ji choosing only men or say God only pushing man to stand for the cause DOES hold some purpose. As Guru Ji was 100% sure regarding what was written in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and as per Guru Granth Sahib Ji, man and woman does have equal opportunity and rights. So, he would not go against Guru Granth Sahib Ji. In Bachittar Natak, Guru has mentioned that in His previous life (not physical though) how he once fight with the demons and won the war. This is the time when Bhagauti told Guru Ji that when He will go to Earth for the establishment of new dharma, then She would offer her services and this is the reason Khanda is used while preparing Amrit. And Panj-Payas does represent Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Guru Gobind Singh Ji has told several times in history that He should NOT be considered God. Here I'm NOT trying to say that He was not God; I'm just trying to bring up the point that no Guru before Guru Gobind Singh Ji has said that in the same tone. He is not trying to be humble, may be He is trying to tell us something (that he indicated in His writings) Guru Gobind Singh Ji's birth and the creation of Khalsa was the requirement of those times but Guru Ji did NOT abolish the place of Saint/Sant (some call it physical Guru). e.g If you see all the yesteryear Sants after the creation of Khalsa, even though they did come under the umbrella of Khalsa but they are also the student under their respective Senior Teachers/Gurus/Sants. If the intention of any Guru (any 10 Gurus) was of to abolish the trend of physical Sant, then surely They must have provided in written format the Arths/Meanings of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. But They did not do that because the key to the hidden treasures of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is still with the Sants. So, wraping up I could say that: Guru Gobind Singh Ji did come for different purpose (as per the requirement of time and order of Waheguru) and fullfilled His purpose; and his purpose was not the same as that of first 5 Gurus and 9th Guru. Even 6, 7, 8th Guru Ji have not recorded Their Bani in Guru Granth Sahib Ji as They were preparing the ground for the coming of 10th Guru. Read the story of Bib Bhani. Guru Gobind Singh Ji explicitly stated many times this fact in His writings: Bachittar Natak and His other writings. It is just us (the normal people) who didn't look deep enough.
At last, I'm NOT saying that Khalsa was that time's need and we need not take Amrit. I'm just saying that people start debating this vs that without understanding the purpose of creation of Khalsa. Sometimes in different ingredients (having different powers) are necessary to bring up the Neutral/Precious stuff. e.g It is believed that lead could be transformed into gold in alchemy.

Recently on this forum and in general view: there is always tension between the groups in regards to "If women can be part of Panj Payaras or not". Every group has its own rigid explanations for their views.
Group-1 says that yes, women can be part of Panj payaras. Their core reason is the bani as explained in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Group-2 says that no, women cannot be part of Panj payars. Their core reason is because women didn't  offer their head that day or say Guru Ji didn't ask. Some also say that women is not capable of preparing Amrit. Group-3 says that we've to follow the establised tradition and should not allow women to be part of Panj-payars but if any women is Brahmgyani, then its okay. Their core reason is that since the creation of Khalsa and all along during the times of great Saints, everyone suggested that women cannot be Panj Payaras. Now, I do NOT want to stretch this boring conversation to further but I DO want to present my personal views which seems to be opposite to the above mentioned groups at-the face value but in deeper sense it does resonate with them. So, please do NOT post same old reasons/explanations to prove your point. But I invite all memebers to please share your thoughts on this topic without indulging in baseless claims and let's have a Open Mind discussion.
I also request everyone to carefully read the whole topic first and then send your response. Please do NOT read causally or just scan and then post the same thing which was in your head (pre-programmed).
My personal view is: No, women cannot be part of Panj Payaras because the Amrit prepared during Sanskar Amrit is still within the sphere of "Laws of Universe" unless a Brahmgyani (any gender) is involved.
In other words, Amrit is prepared with its roots in Duality (opposites coming together). And anything in duality needs to have opposite forces coming together: Shiva and Shakti. Shakti is represented by the Khanda/Sword/Bagauti and Shiva power needs to be in the form of 5 males (Five are required to move Seven to Twelve in Space). As this physical Amrit is NOT the real Amrit (real Amrit being Naam Amrit), therefore in order to prepare it one needs to have correct ingredients: Positive and Negative forces. One cannot prepare the strongest Amrit (which acts as initiation for Guru and will further lead to Raas) with the use of un-balanced ingredients.
Now, why I think that Sanskar Amrit is within the Sphere of Laws: It is because:
The 5K's (Kara, Kangha, Kachera, Kirpan, Kesh/Kesge) symbols are the physical symbols; they DO represent Spiritual purposes but still they are just physical symbols. How could we ridicule Janeu (Hindu thread) as manmat; janeu could also represent some Spiritual principle. So, how could we mock janeu but for 100% in for 5Ks as physical symbols? Guru Gobind Singh Ji choosing only men or say God only pushing man to stand for the cause DOES hold some purpose. As Guru Ji was 100% sure regarding what was written in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and as per Guru Granth Sahib Ji, man and woman does have equal opportunity and rights. So, he would not go against Guru Granth Sahib Ji. In Bachittar Natak, Guru has mentioned that in His previous life (not physical though) how he once fight with the demons and won the war. This is the time when Bhagauti told Guru Ji that when He will go to Earth for the establishment of new dharma, then She would offer her services and this is the reason Khanda is used while preparing Amrit. And Panj-Payas does represent Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Guru Gobind Singh Ji has told several times in history that He should NOT be considered God. Here I'm NOT trying to say that He was not God; I'm just trying to bring up the point that no Guru before Guru Gobind Singh Ji has said that in the same tone. He is not trying to be humble, may be He is trying to tell us something (that he indicated in His writings) Guru Gobind Singh Ji's birth and the creation of Khalsa was the requirement of those times but Guru Ji did NOT abolish the place of Saint/Sant (some call it physical Guru). e.g If you see all the yesteryear Sants after the creation of Khalsa, even though they did come under the umbrella of Khalsa but they are also the student under their respective Senior Teachers/Gurus/Sants. If the intention of any Guru (any 10 Gurus) was of to abolish the trend of physical Sant, then surely They must have provided in written format the Arths/Meanings of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. But They did not do that because the key to the hidden treasures of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is still with the Sants. So, wraping up I could say that: Guru Gobind Singh Ji did come for different purpose (as per the requirement of time and order of Waheguru) and fullfilled His purpose; and his purpose was not the same as that of first 5 Gurus and 9th Guru. Even 6, 7, 8th Guru Ji have not recorded Their Bani in Guru Granth Sahib Ji as They were preparing the ground for the coming of 10th Guru. Read the story of Bib Bhani. Guru Gobind Singh Ji explicitly stated many times this fact in His writings: Bachittar Natak and His other writings. It is just us (the normal people) who didn't look deep enough.
At last, I'm NOT saying that Khalsa was that time's need and we need not take Amrit. I'm just saying that people start debating this vs that without understanding the purpose of creation of Khalsa. Sometimes in different ingredients (having different powers) are necessary to bring up the Neutral/Precious stuff. e.g It is believed that lead could be transformed into gold in alchemy.

What I have noticed with Bhai Balbir Singh Ji is that he is very humble and always shows humility, and is ready to grab the other persons shakti, like how ramchandra did to parshu ram.  I think he does not look at the other persons fault, he just respects anyone who calls themselves a saint even though they might be fake.I dont seen any ill intentions on part of Baba Ji, just a higher level of perception, plus we do not know the context either.
It would be like why Bhai Ghanaiya Ji were first aiding the enemy...

If anyone claims something to be perfect on the face-value, then he/she is bound to prove it and giving one's our account is perfect way. So, in other words, it's not the personal details. See bro, I'm not pulling your leg or trying to prove you wrong, but I just want to show you the reality. Don't go for right-wing thinking or left-wing thinking. You're bound to get failures. Follow the middle-path as suggested in Guru Ji.
Sikhism as religion would NOT take you anywhere. Come out of your dream world. But the teachings of Sikhism (as written down in Guru Granth Sahib Ji) does have potential to lead you on the path of salvation quickly. But there are 2 conditions that must be fulfilled by anyone who want to ride fastest to salvation:
1. Understand the real meaning and core concepts of Gurbani. e.g Karma, Upsana, Gyan, importance of Guru etc.
2. And then Practice those teachings.
These days, people have forgot the conditions but just claim that Sikhism is the fastest or some say the only. Real Sikhism is not what you see these days. Sikhism is NOT about the Amrit Sanchar, or Panj Payare, or equality vs inequality, or this vs that. It's sad to see that day by day, common people are converting the Sikhism into some package/box and then marketing it. Wake up.
You might remember the conversation with Suleman with sangat during Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's (Rara Sahib wale) time. Suleman was asked which religion is best: Listen to it and then understand the core he is talking about. He specifically mentioned that everything is same but in Sikhism it is easier to follow a Saint whereas in other religions (referring to Muslims) going to a Saint is NOT allowed.
Bottom-line is:
Sikhism was supposed to be fastest lane ONLY when: One understands the real meanings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and does understand that there is a need for REAL Saints and practice the teachings.
One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.
Are not the teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji teach exactly what is mentioned in the above 4 steps? Think about it.

If anyone claims something to be perfect on the face-value, then he/she is bound to prove it and giving one's our account is perfect way. So, in other words, it's not the personal details. See bro, I'm not pulling your leg or trying to prove you wrong, but I just want to show you the reality. Don't go for right-wing thinking or left-wing thinking. You're bound to get failures. Follow the middle-path as suggested in Guru Ji.
Sikhism as religion would NOT take you anywhere. Come out of your dream world. But the teachings of Sikhism (as written down in Guru Granth Sahib Ji) does have potential to lead you on the path of salvation quickly. But there are 2 conditions that must be fulfilled by anyone who want to ride fastest to salvation:
1. Understand the real meaning and core concepts of Gurbani. e.g Karma, Upsana, Gyan, importance of Guru etc.
2. And then Practice those teachings.
These days, people have forgot the conditions but just claim that Sikhism is the fastest or some say the only. Real Sikhism is not what you see these days. Sikhism is NOT about the Amrit Sanchar, or Panj Payare, or equality vs inequality, or this vs that. It's sad to see that day by day, common people are converting the Sikhism into some package/box and then marketing it. Wake up.
You might remember the conversation with Suleman with sangat during Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's (Rara Sahib wale) time. Suleman was asked which religion is best: Listen to it and then understand the core he is talking about. He specifically mentioned that everything is same but in Sikhism it is easier to follow a Saint whereas in other religions (referring to Muslims) going to a Saint is NOT allowed.
Bottom-line is:
Sikhism was supposed to be fastest lane ONLY when: One understands the real meanings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and does understand that there is a need for REAL Saints and practice the teachings.
One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.
Are not the teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji teach exactly what is mentioned in the above 4 steps? Think about it.

If anyone claims something to be perfect on the face-value, then he/she is bound to prove it and giving one's our account is perfect way. So, in other words, it's not the personal details. See bro, I'm not pulling your leg or trying to prove you wrong, but I just want to show you the reality. Don't go for right-wing thinking or left-wing thinking. You're bound to get failures. Follow the middle-path as suggested in Guru Ji.
Sikhism as religion would NOT take you anywhere. Come out of your dream world. But the teachings of Sikhism (as written down in Guru Granth Sahib Ji) does have potential to lead you on the path of salvation quickly. But there are 2 conditions that must be fulfilled by anyone who want to ride fastest to salvation:
1. Understand the real meaning and core concepts of Gurbani. e.g Karma, Upsana, Gyan, importance of Guru etc.
2. And then Practice those teachings.
These days, people have forgot the conditions but just claim that Sikhism is the fastest or some say the only. Real Sikhism is not what you see these days. Sikhism is NOT about the Amrit Sanchar, or Panj Payare, or equality vs inequality, or this vs that. It's sad to see that day by day, common people are converting the Sikhism into some package/box and then marketing it. Wake up.
You might remember the conversation with Suleman with sangat during Sant Baba Isher Singh Ji's (Rara Sahib wale) time. Suleman was asked which religion is best: Listen to it and then understand the core he is talking about. He specifically mentioned that everything is same but in Sikhism it is easier to follow a Saint whereas in other religions (referring to Muslims) going to a Saint is NOT allowed.
Bottom-line is:
Sikhism was supposed to be fastest lane ONLY when: One understands the real meanings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and does understand that there is a need for REAL Saints and practice the teachings.
One Saint has given the following flow-chart to achieve Salvation:
1. Do the company of Sant/Mahapurash/Saint.
2. If you cannot do that, then do Naam (Meditation); Dan/Charity of 10% of your income to needy; Isnan (Bath).
3. If you cannot do Naam, Dan, and Isnan, then do not overburden yourself with sins. In other words, avoid doing sins.
4. If you cannot refain from sins, then it is better to die because without doing steps 1, 2, 3 you are bound to fall to lower planes.
Are not the teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji teach exactly what is mentioned in the above 4 steps? Think about it.